Bioshock - New Community Site, Q&A

[Dhruin]

2K Games has launched a new community site for Bioshock at The Cult of Rapture (http://www.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/qa1.htm). One of the first features there is a short Q&A (http://www.2kgames.com/cultofrapture/qa1.htm), although the answer to this question may not be what many are wanting to hear:
Are there any lessons from Deus Ex 2 that the team has learned and is using when making BioShock?
Many development teams have learned important lessons from previous attempts to bring PC games to the console, though Deus Ex 2 is an infamous example. One of the main things we are doing differently is that we are leading our development efforts with the 360. Therefore all decisions on HUD and gameplay situations are made on the 360 and brought over to the PC to avoid the situations you are thinking about.
More information. (http://www.rpgwatch.com/show/newsbit?newsbit=3574)

[Reyla]

One of the main things we are doing differently is that we are leading our development efforts with the 360. Therefore all decisions on HUD and gameplay situations are made on the 360 and brought over to the PC to avoid the situations you are thinking about.

Um. That was exactly the problem with Deus Ex 2. Is this guy confusing himself?

[Elwro]

Yeah. It seems that in the last sentence he mixed "avoid" with "encourage".

[zakhal]

What exactly was so wrong about deus ex2? I played through both 1 & 2 and dont remember anything horrible on the latter one.

Last year I bought 32" LCD and Im all prepared to play the PC version of bioshock laying on the sofa with my ps2 controller. So I dont really mind as long as it has atleast the 360 controls. Mouse & keyb is nice extra.

[VPeric]

Deus Ex 2 was horribly dumbed down from Deus Ex. Skills removal, simplifed inventory, to name a couple.

And this sounds like we'll get another Oblivion-esque interface. =\

[zakhal]

Deus Ex 2 was horribly dumbed down from Deus Ex. Skills removal, simplifed inventory, to name a couple.

Yeah I heard about that before I bought it (cheap). Still the game was fun to the end. There was simplification (like unified bullets) but after a while got used to it. It wasnt a big deal.

I guess after all the bad rep I didnt expect to see deus ex when I finally got to play it. And as a generic fps/rpg it wasnt so bad. Beats the hell out of pure fps atleast.


And this sounds like we'll get another Oblivion-esque interface. =\

I guess it was okay for gamepad atleast (not that all pc setups are suitable for that). Still in the case of oblivion it was atleast moddable. Dont know about this game though.

[DarNoor]

Well, i must say that after reading that, i am not very encouraged.

[Acleacius]

"Therefore all decisions on HUD and gameplay situations are made on the 360 and brought over to the PC to avoid the situations you are thinking about."

That's such a bad answer it can't possibly be correst.
It's like saying yes we know about the problem but we are going to do everything in our power to make the same mistake, since we are going to use the same exact principals for design.
This had to have been some generic answer, unless the person relaing the answer didn't understand the answer or the question or I am really confused.
It certianly doesn't sound like the way Levne talks. :S

[KazikluBey]

It certianly doesn't sound like the way Levne talks. :S
That's because it was written by Elizabeth Tobey, who seems to be the 2K Games community manager or something like that, so I wouldn't put too much weight to it.

[Nonymous]

Wow. I've never had a game that I wanted go from "Buy Zero Day" to "Wait for the jewel case at $9.99 to come out."

On the plus side, Supreme Commander is looking better & better with each passing day.

[fatBastard()]

I totally agree with you Nonymous. I've lost just about all interest in Bioshock by now.:uncool:

[curious]

you are all
acting like
little sisters

[Corwin]

I lost all interest when they said it was an FPS and NOT an RPG!!

[Briosafreak]

Thanks to slamelov from NMA for pointing this:

Quote:
Are there any lessons from Deus Ex 2 that the team has learned and is using when making BioShock?
Many development teams have learned important lessons from previous attempts to bring PC games to the console, though Deus Ex 2 is an infamous example. One of the main things we are doing differently is that we are leading our development efforts with the 360. Therefore all decisions on HUD and gameplay situations are made on the 360 and brought over to the PC to avoid the situations you are thinking about.
What situations?. So, the lessons you learned about Deus Ex 2 is to make the same errors?.
<...>
It will be a console game ported to PC.

That FAQ entry is not accurate. According to Ken Levine, it was written by our new community development liaison who is coming to Boston this week to get fully briefed on our development process.

- Chris Kline, Lead Programmer

DANGEROUS LIAISONS! :)

[Moriendor]

That's because it was written by Elizabeth Tobey, who seems to be the 2K Games community manager or something like that, so I wouldn't put too much weight to it.

LOL that must have been a little bit like this...

Little Liz who doesn't know crap about gaming shows up for her first day of work as the new community liasion at 2K Games. They decide to give her the task to write a FAQ entry for Bioshock so her boss briefs her and tells her:
"Look, Liz, we don't really give two shits about PC gamers but you gotta make it sound as if we do, OK? All we really care about is the X360 version though. Well, just write a little blurb to put the other carebears to rest, will ya?".
So little Liz walks back to her office, sits down at her desk and she's having one of those blackout moments....
'Crap'... she thought... 'What was it again? We care about PC gamers and not about the X360 or the other way around? Shit. This is my first day of work and I'm too embarassed to ask so -please God- let this be right...'

Guess what, Liz... wrrrrrrrooonnggg :biggrin:

[Acleacius]

Certianly a scrapebook moment.

Noting like spreading Shock and Horror accross the World to millions of fans whom spend billions of dollars a year, so she can get her paycheck, your first day on the job. :p

[crpgnut]

So what we got was someone who told the truth before she's sent to corporate to learn pr-speak. Illuminating :)

[doctor_kaz]

Bioshock is turning out to be less the spiritual successor to System Shock to and more like the successor to Deus Ex: Invisible War. "Don't worry PC gamers! We're making the X-Box 360 the primary development console and just porting it over. You'll love it!" I wonder if Irrational hired Harvey Smith recently.

[curious]

stop misplacing your unsatifaction with life/other games on this game, it hasn't even been released and irrational has no record to warrant such behaviour!!!

even if people don't want to have constructive comments, whats the point in being destructive when something hasn't even been built yet.

[Acleacius]

Looking on the forums of the sites that keep up with Bioshock, crpgnut and doctor_kaz seem to be the only two left on the net taking this seriously, oh well. ;)

[gumbomasta]

From the website itself:

Therefore all decisions on HUD and gameplay situations that are made on the 360 will be re-thought and optimized when brought over onto the PC..

Rpgwatch misquoted Levine, I think.

[Corwin]

We don't misquote; it was not originated here if you check out the article.

[Dhruin]

It absolutely was not misquoted. I cut and pasted directly from the site. They have changed text subsequently.

[JDR13]

A lot of you are making a big deal out of this and I think it's premature. Let's wait until we actually play the game before condemning it.

[Corwin]

We're NOT condemning it, just stating our legitimate concerns!!

[txa1265]

And expressing concerns is a very valid thing to do - when we look at the history of games in similar circumstances there are definitely 'consolitis' things to gripe about. I'm not talking Oblivion-bashing here, just that there are many things that would have made the PC versions of games like Oblivion, KotOR, Deus Ex 2, Thief, Tomb Raider and many more much easier to deal with.

[Acleacius]

Dhruin
"They have changed text subsequently."
Lol, I can't imagine why, unless it's the sh*tstorm that's been unleashed. :p

Omg, who let teh trolls and teh whinners out, this site used to be SO cool, back in the day. :biggrin:

[Dhruin]

A lot of you are making a big deal out of this and I think it's premature. Let's wait until we actually play the game before condemning it.

I agree.

But you can't blame us (as gamers) for paying attention to a Q&A they put out on this specific topic and actually listening to what they had to say.

I'm a huge Irrational fan (and love the fact that they have a studio here in Australia) but c'mon, how many times do they have to beat me over the head with this stuff?

Me: Oooh...a System Shock 2 spiritual successor, made by Irrational, cool Utopia-gone-wrong theme. Day 1 purchase!

Them: <stuff about Ayn Rand>

Me: Awesome! Here's my cash!

Them: It's an FPS. It's an FPS. It's an FPS. It's an FPS. It's an FPS.

Me: Ooooookay, I get it. I'm still in.

Them: And the Xbox 360 is the only thing that counts.

Me: Look, fer chrissakes are you trying to turn me off? Who the hell says "System Shock 2 successor" and then gives multiple interviews purely to say this is only an FPS?

[txa1265]

Me: Look, fer chrissakes are you trying to turn me off? Who the hell says "System Shock 2 successor" and then gives multiple interviews purely to say this is only an FPS?

I have no problem with the FPS side, but get wary when it becomes a 'console FPS being ported to PC, but we'll get it right ... this time ... unlike the others'.

[Corwin]

Dhruin
"They have changed text subsequently."
Lol, I can't imagine why, unless it's the sh*tstorm that's been unleashed. :p

Omg, who let teh trolls and teh whinners out, this site used to be SO cool, back in the day. :biggrin:

Good grief, the site's only been live a few months and already we have a history. "Back in the day' indeed!! :biggrin: