NWN2 - Manuals Available for Download

[Dhruin]

Atari's German reps have pointed out the German NWN2 manual is available for download. After experimenting, Avantenor let us know several others can also be accessed:
English (ftp://ftp.download-center.com/international/NWN2/NWN2-GB.pdf)
German (ftp://ftp.download-center.com/international/NWN2/NWN2-DE.pdf)
Spanish (ftp://ftp.download-center.com/international/NWN2/NWN2-ES.pdf)
French (ftp://ftp.download-center.com/international/NWN2/NWN2-FR.pdf)
Italian (ftp://ftp.download-center.com/international/NWN2/NWN2-IT.pdf)
Thanks, Avantenor!

More information. (http://www.rpgwatch.com/show/newsbit?newsbit=2391)

[r3dshift]

Cool, now I won't get too much sleep because I'll spend most of the night just browsing the manual and prolly planning my main character. Thanks for the great find, Avantenor!

[r3dshift]

Well, having munched and crunched the manual for the better part of last night, I've come to the conclusion that if I decide to play a good character at first, then I'll be a planetouched paladin or a human monk; if I choose to play the bad side (which I'm most tempted to do), I'll definitely be an evil monk or an assassin. My only problem with being evil is that most cRPGs either do not support being evil or being evil simply translates into some petty viciousness, not some grand wicked plotting scenario.

[bjon045]

I have a feeling the Aasimir Paladin will be a little overpowered.

[r3dshift]

That's what I've been thinking too, hence I am also considering playing a monk. I've never done that before and could be a welcome change. Although that'd mean missing out on all the cool spells, arms and armour :)

[txa1265]

Very nice manual for a change ...

[Corwin]

Yeah, made for a pleasant read. I'll still be a Sorc; it's my favourite DnD character, especially at the higher levels.

[bjon045]

I am probably going to be playing a Tiefling wizard(5)/arcane trickster(4)/rogue(remainder). Will be tough, but I figure should be extremely versatile.

[txa1265]

I have a feeling the Aasimir Paladin will be a little overpowered.

That looked interesting to me, but you're likely right. I tend to like playing a Paladin or a Neutral Good Sorceror.

[Arma]

An Aasimar Paladin/Monk sound great, I wish my damned rig would run NWN2 but still :( Or an evil Warrior/Weapon Master ...

On a another note, is it new to DnD 3.5 that a Paladin can cast lvl 4 spells? As far as I remember my NWN pallys could only do lvl 3 ...

[Jaesun]

Why did they release the Manuals online?? I think that's a great idea to may drum up interest and such, but that just seems odd.?

[bjon045]

Paladins had up to level 4 in 2nd edition if I recall correctly. In 3rd edition (and NWN) they had a wisdom requirement added 10+spell level so you need 14 wisdom to use the 4th circle.

This is why I think the Aassimar will be so powerful, they only have to use 4 points to get the wisdom they need for the 4th circle, and then they can use only 4 points into charisma and still get a +2 bonus to all their charisma based skills and still have 22 points available for str/con/dex/int. The other races often have to spend 16 points to get to the same level.

[BillSeurer]

If I am remembering weapon master correctly they suck compared to a plain fighter of equal level. You might want to run the numbers a bit and compare.

[kalniel]

Hmm.. rather bare and mechanics orientated. I was hoping for some world background/lore/characters information that would set the atmosphere a bit better.

Hopefully we'll be able to create characters that have good RP potential.

[TheMadGamer]

That is one of the 'meatiest' rpg manuals in a long long time...

[xSamhainx]

Thx for the manual hookup

Nice to see a comprehensive one such as this, I've been quite disappointed by the dearth of proper manuals in games lately.

Not to mention (I'll mention it anyway) those stupid little cardboard disc sleeves!

[BillSeurer]

Hmm.. rather bare and mechanics orientated. I was hoping for some world background/lore/characters information that would set the atmosphere a bit better.

Hopefully we'll be able to create characters that have good RP potential.

I am sure that their goal is to make NWN2 like NWN, only better. That is, it is more of a toolset than an actual game scenario. Thus all the crunchy bits.

Hopefully the included campaign (uh, there IS one RIGHT?) will be much better than that which came with the original NWN. I actually did not finish it at first and even abandoned NWN for a few years until some good campaigns came along.

[Corwin]

What bothers me, is that it appeared they had cut down on the number of quickslots!! I hope not, as a caster, I NEVER have enough slots!! :)

[Arma]

However, I believe I read that there was an entire quick cast menu. Btw, the NWN interface was OK for a fighter type character in my opinion, but was a real pain in the rear for a spellcaster, one of the reasons I never went far with a caster anyway.

[txa1265]

All I can say is thank goodness for turn-based combat in terms of the quick-slots. I know what you're saying, but at the same time it will force me to make smart choices. My last time through I started using my 'last choice', CTRL-F12, first and working backwards ... I found that after a few levels I wouldn't touch CTRL.

[Corwin]

Imagine playing a level 30-40 caster in an online MP high level mod!! Some days I just die a LOT!! Finding a spell which works can often be quite frustrating against high level monsters who can kill you in one or two hits, even using mage armor type buffs!!

[txa1265]

I think I just found another reason not to play MP NWN games ;)

I like to fiddle around and micromanage my inventory and quickslots ...

[kalniel]

I think the new drop down menus for spells reduces the need for quite so many quickslots.

[bjon045]

If I am remembering weapon master correctly they suck compared to a plain fighter of equal level. You might want to run the numbers a bit and compare.

The fighter/weapon master was one of the most powerful characters in the original NWN, it has been toned down a lot for NWN2.

In NWN the keen property stacked with the improved weapon master critical with led to obscene critical hit chances. I played Hordes as one, and in the final battle (which I played through about 4-5 times to see most of the endings) I managed to do over 600 damage in a single round duel wielding 2 katanas. If I recall the critical threshold was 15-20(3x) or also a 30% chance of landing a crit (6 hits a round = 2 crits).

In NWN2 they no longer stack, this means the only benefit would be that you don't need a keen weapon and you do better criticals. It could still be handy class to pick up 7 levels in if you plan on soloing as a fighter with no enchantment capabilities.

[Peter Stauffenberg]

This is why I think the Aassimar will be so powerful, they only have to use 4 points to get the wisdom they need for the 4th circle, and then they can use only 4 points into charisma and still get a +2 bonus to all their charisma based skills and still have 22 points available for str/con/dex/int. The other races often have to spend 16 points to get to the same level.

Charisma is the paladin's best so it should be as high as possible. There are many reasons for that.

1) You receive Divine grace at 2nd level which adds the charisma modifier to all saving throws. So a 18 CHA paladin gets +4 to all saving throws. That is great indeed.

2) You receive Turn undead at 4th level and can use it (charisma modifier + 3) times per day. The strength of the turn undead use is also dependent upon the charisma modifier. This also applies to the number of undead affected by each turn undead.

3) You receive lay on hands at 2nd level and can heal charisma modifier * your level HP's per day. So a 9th level paladin with CHA 20 can heal 9 * 5 = 45 HP per day.

4) You have the paladin power Smite evil which adds the charisma modifier to the attack die roll and adds the paladin's level to the damage. So charisma is vital here too.

5) A paladin could choose the skill Diplomacy and this skill adds the charisma modifier to the skill rank.

6) Charisma also helps the feats Divine might, Divine shield and Divine resistance.

So a paladin should maximize his charisma attribute when creating his character. Only spending 4 build points and give CHA 12 (CHA 14 as an Aasimar) is not what I would recommend. What makes a paladin great is his charisma attribute as I showed above.

I would build my Aasimar paladin like this:

STR: 15 (8 bp)
DEX: 8 (0 bp)
INT: 12 (4 bp)
CON: 14 (6 bp)
WIS: 12 (4 bp) + 2 from Aasimar = 14
CHA: 16 (10 bp) + 2 from Aasimar = 18

If you choose Luck of heroes as your background trait you receive +1 AC and +1 to all saving throws to counter for receiving -1 AC and -1 to reflex saves for getting a poor DEX.

For skills I would choose: Concentration, Heal and Diplomacy. With INT 12 you receive +1 skill point per level. With the standard 2 sp per level for the paladin class you can use a total of 3 sp level which makes it possible to max out these 3 skills. Having INT 12 counters for the loss of 1 extra sp per level as humans get.

It's possible to have 10 dex and 10 int or 10 dex, 12 int, 12 con if you don't like an attribute below 10.

At level 4 you increase your strength attribute from 15 to 16 getting +3 to attack and damage. Pretty good for a paladin. All further attribute increases should to to charisma which gives you a charisma of 22 at level 20. That gives you a charisma modifier of +6.

For feats I would go for:
1th level: Power Attack
3rd level: Cleave
6th level: Divine might (or Divine shield)
9th level: Improved critical (longsword) unless you have a great longsword with the keen ability. Keen does NOT stack with improved critical in NWN2. It did stack in NWN1.
12th level: Divine shield (or Divine might)
15th level: Extra turning
18th level: Toughness (or Weapon focus (longsword) if you intend to become a Divine champion prestige class)

I think this could make a great paladin with few weaknesses. The key is to focus on charisma. With STR 16 (at level 4) you are strong enough to carry a lot of equipment, CON 14 is pretty good too. WIS 14 is just enough to cast all paladin spells. Remember also that magical items will probably increase the stats even further. In NWN1 I had a paladin in HoU with a modified CHA of more than 40. That is +15 to all saving throws, 600 hp per lay on hands, awesome smite evil, divine might and divine shield etc.

[Cormac]

Good stuff there, Peter. My favourite character is always a paladin (or anything resembling that) and I planned to create an aasimar paladin in NWN2. I was never good at number crunching, though, so thanks for the tips.

[r3dshift]

Wow, Peter, awesome tips. Thanks! I'm getting more and more certain that I'll be playing an Aasimar Paladin :)

[Corwin]

Now you know why Peter has been a regular in my weekly online NWN gaming session, usually as a Paladin!! He hated it when I asked him to play a rogue in a campaign we ran a few weeks ago, but I had eveyone, including myself, play a character opposite to their normal preference!! :)

[txa1265]

Wow, Peter, awesome tips. Thanks! I'm getting more and more certain that I'll be playing an Aasimar Paladin :)

Truly great tips ... I'll remember this for my second run through ... that'll be my Pally

[Kalia]

I don't know about international release manuals, but the US version is ostensibly supposed to be over 150 pages. Obviously there's a lot missing from what was released online. Also, given the number of errors in spelling (to name one thing), one would imagine that these were early mock ups. Originally just the German version was available until someone ferreted out the others. Go figure.

As for the quickslots: You'll have a lot of choices with the number of 'belts' you can make for your character. Not being a spellcaster (YICK!), I'm fuzzy on the details but there are a TON of ways you can set your casters up for different situations. You can set up a belt, for instance, for the undead, another for fire resistant monsters, etc. It sounds almost good enough for me to want to try a caster. :)

*shoulders her greatsword and swaggers off* ;)

[bjon045]

Charisma is the paladin's best so it should be as high as possible. There are many reasons for that.

So a paladin should maximize his charisma attribute when creating his character. Only spending 4 build points and give CHA 12 (CHA 14 as an Aasimar) is not what I would recommend. What makes a paladin great is his charisma attribute as I showed above.


I had forgotten you could raise an attribute to 14 without increasing the point cost. I would increase it to 14(+2 = 16). I do tend to play more melee orientated characters and I would probably pick up 5 levels of divine champion as soon as it is available.


9th level: Improved critical (longsword) unless you have a great longsword with the keen ability. Keen does NOT stack with improved critical in NWN2. It did stack in NWN1.


Does keen stack with the Ki critical feat (weapon master)? I thought that was the only change they made to the keen property.

I thought it would be interesting after reading Peters build if everyone would type up their own builds:

Mine is a Chaotic Neutral Tiefling

Str 10 (2bp) (A more melee orientated build would increase str/con by +2)
Dex 20 (16bp)
Con 10 (2bp)
Wis 8 (0bp)
Int 18 (10bp) (-2 for +2 str/con if required)
Cha 6 (0bp)

Level 20 (Tiefling level 19): Rogue 10/Wizard 5/Arcane Trickester 4.

This character would have a +7d6 sneak attack and be able to perform all the services of a rogue for the party. This character is intended to level up as a wizard first, then pick up 5 levels of Rogue and then level as a Trickster and by Level 14 would be casting 5th level spells. The main strength of this character is the huge amount of skill points it will get as a high intelligence rogue, while the main weakness is a lack of feats, as such it would be best to focus feats to a single spell school. Dodge and Mobility are essential to this class as it is intended to cast spells at point blank range. Weapon Finesse is essential also.

[txa1265]

I don't know about international release manuals, but the US version is ostensibly supposed to be over 150 pages. Obviously there's a lot missing from what was released online. Also, given the number of errors in spelling (to name one thing), one would imagine that these were early mock ups. Originally just the German version was available until someone ferreted out the others. Go figure.

Thanks - so there is likely more info still out there ... but we only have a few days left before we find out ...

[doctor_kaz]

Sweet! Making these available ahead of time is a great idea. I wish that the big spiral-bound manuals were still standard nowadays though.