Any Dwarf Fortress geeks here?

[Prime Junta]

I just started dabbling in Dwarf Fortress, and I'm hooked. It took me about one evening to figure out the extreme, very, total basics, and yesterday I got far enough to accidentally drown my dwarves in a horrible irrigation accident (it turns out that water runs downhill). I think I know what I did wrong so I can start over with more luck. Maybe.

I.e., once past the insanely irritating UI where sometimes - means up, sometimes u means up, and sometimes up arrow means up, I'm starting to have fun. Without the wiki, I wouldn't have a prayer, though.

Any suggestions for a total newbie, anyone?

[xSamhainx]

*crickets chirping*

[Prime Junta]

So it appears. You guys don't know what you're missing. I'm totally hooked. Plus I take back everything I said about not learning anything from games -- I've got the mineralogy links on Wikipedia open as I'm playing...

[txa1265]

I've heard of it ... but with my current schedule I have put it in the 'wait until next year when no new games are coming out' pile ...

[pnutz]

It is badly gashed!

[Jaz]

PJ's hot love for this game must have impresed me so much that I dreamt of it last night. Now I absolutely have to play it just to see if it looks even remotely like the game I dreamt of.

[magerette]

Check out his screenshot of the "improved graphics" in the "What are you playing" thread before you make a commitment, Jaz--though if anybody could handle it I know it would be you. :)

[Zaleukos]

I'm waiting for a tileset (something akin to Falcons eye for Nethack) before trying this one out. I'm too old and impatient for ASCII.

[Rina]

I have been playing occasionally since the last winter and got addicted again when that new version was released a while ago. Z-levels added lots of new depth to the game (no pun intended) but they have also been a source of minor annoyance to me when I have thought that I found a perfect starting location and then the ground elevation is completely wacky. I wouldnt mind the challenge brought by that so much if the caravan and immigrant spawn locations would be somehow predictable, but as far as I'm aware they arent. It's not so big issue now that the vagon speed was increased, but it would be nice to know from the beginning.

I'm still in the process of re-learning all the finer points of the game, and so far my new fortresses have been dismal failures for being boring and unimaginative (mostly as a result for playing it too safe) and I have ended up abandoning them for various reasons - best one so far because a crash lost me nearly five hours of progress, and I didnt feel like re-engraving my huge legendary dining hall and re-smelting a metric shitton of gold and steel again. (Seasonal autosave is enabled now, thank you very much.)

I think it's the time to start on a sinister glacier and face the true horrors that the game can throw at you. Aside from a titan that got shot by sieging goblins I havent had much of that yet. x_x

[Prime Junta]

Whoo, that sounds intense.

Somehow I'm glad I don't need to deal with that kind of crap yet. I just managed to get my first magma workshop running, in a nice little corner of the map with magnetite-rich chalk, sand, trees, and a waterfall, with only the trees and sand a bit of a walk away. My seven dwarves seem reasonably happy despite the lack of creature comforts and somewhat monotonous diet of plump helmets and fish.

Next up: farming pig tails, cave wheat, and rock bushes. I hope I'll get some immigrants to give a hand too...

[Elwro]

I'm waiting for a tileset (something akin to Falcons eye for Nethack) before trying this one out. I'm too old and impatient for ASCII.
One of the Codexers is working on a tileset. Look here:

http://rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=21041&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=25

and scroll down to see examples and a download link (it's still a work in progress).

[Prime Junta]

It's funny how quickly you get used to the ASCII graphics. (OK, I have played way more NetHack than is good for me so I guess I have a bit of a head start there.)

The UI, OTOH, could use a major overhaul -- I'm still constantly hitting the wrong keys because I'm in the wrong context (e.g. trying to d[esignate] d[ig] when I'm still in the b[uild] menu because I didn't hit space the right number of times). The only trouble is that if they ever do it, I'll hate it because by then I will have learned this one.

[Jaz]

@magerette: I did look up the screenshots right after posting. Big surprise, my dream looked nothing like the screenies. The game I dreamt of last night looked less like ASCII and more like Catacomb Apocalypse. But I'll still play Dwarf Fortress!

[magerette]

Jaz wrote:
Big surprise, my dream looked nothing like the screenies.

I have the same trouble with my dreams. :) Good luck with the real world version.

[Prime Junta]

If you do, remember the slogan: "Failure is fun."

My plant fiber crops just failed and I have no more seed. That screwed up my plan for upgrading to cave wheat and quarry bushes -- I need sacks to process them, and without fiber, I can't make cloth, without which I can't make sacks.

Luckily some elven traders showed up with literally a ton of cloth, so I bought their entire stock off them with some nice silver and platinum trinkets I've made. Now to make sacks so I can carry grain and leaves to be processed into nicer food. Yay!

[magerette]

You *do* know how geeked out that sounds...I wish you'd stop, because I know I can't play this game in the existing comparative states of its graphics and my eyeballs. Not to mention my questionable keyboard skills. That little paragraph reminded me strongly of my chinese cities in Emperor--never enough rice, fish, game meat and/or wheat to make Tasty Food without trading.

[xSamhainx]

well I'm glad that someone other than the crickets finally chimed in, PJ. I know the loneliness of feeling like the only one who likes something they think is truly awesome. Like The Devil's Sword (http://intlwalnut.blogspot.com/2006/06/devils-sword.html)

I however cannot do the Dwarf Fortress, I can barely commit to games that are half as complicated and hundreds of times prettier..

[Rina]

If you do, remember the slogan: "Failure is fun."


Actually it's "losing is fun". :)

[KazikluBey]

I decided to try it after the latest round of gushing over it at the Codex. I don't think I even managed to start a new game. It sounds good though and I'd love to devote the time to learn it. Now, if only I could find that time...

[Prime Junta]

Oh, I'm sure you have the time. You just may not have the patience. ;)

(FWIW, this is my third attempt at getting into the game; the first two times I wandered around aimlessly for a while and then ran screaming.)

[Prime Junta]

Actually it's "losing is fun". :)

Well, it is, strangely enough.

DF is really the NetHack of sim-games. Meaning, a big part of the appeal of NetHack was the wide variety of YASD's (Yet Another Stupid Death, for the uninitiated) in it. DF takes that to a whole new level -- you can YASD an entire tribe. :)

(I'm starting over once again. My dwarf king just died in a horrible magma engineering accident and I don't feel like continuing without the little bastard.)

[Jaz]

I tried and failed miserably.
There is a reason why I usually shy away from builder-type games. They... uh... are far too complicated for my taste. I was unable to play the Settlers for more than 30 minutes, and I'm far too thick for this one. I'm paid for staring at code and other strange stuff on a screen, and I just can't bring myself to do it in my time off as well.

[Prime Junta]

Yeah, well, it's definitely not a game for everyone. I suppose it's like stout porter -- takes a while to learn to like, but becomes increasingly addictive.

[xSamhainx]

My dwarf king just died in a horrible magma engineering accident and I don't feel like continuing without the little bastard.

that sentence just gave me a good lol here on my lunch break!

Have you ever played Dungeon Keeper?

[Ubereil]

I personaly think a Turorial would be a great asset to this game. I tried the "your first keep" tutorial on the DF-wiki page, but got turned off pretty quickly because of all the aspects that tutorial didn't bring up (on the map, what is what? Magma's supposed to be nice, but what is it, and what does it look like?).

It looks like the game I've been waiting for (I've been waiting for a really good sim for ages), but I'm afraid I won't be able to get into it :(. I'll give it another (more serious) go when I'm ready...

Übereil

[Prime Junta]

Übereil, don't get discouraged. The first 5-8 hours will be confusing as hell, but it gets a lot clearer from there on out -- or, rather, you're confused by things happening in the game rather than the way the game presents them.

The DF wiki is an a fantastic resource; there are a quite a few good tutorials there. Here's my dime's worth on getting started:

(1) Don't worry about fancy stuff like magma, steel, glass, clothing, trade, diplomacy, or war when you start your first fortress. Just concentrate on surviving the winter. For that, you need to figure out:

* Digging lodgings
* Basic comforts (beds, tables, chairs) => needs wood, carpenter's workshop, mason's workshop
* Irrigation (floodgates, levers, connecting the two, channeling water) => needs mason's workshop, mechanic's workshop
* Requirements for farming (muddy floor => getting water at a depth of 1 onto it)
* The kitchen (otherwise your produce will spoil)
* The still (otherwise your dwarves will have to drink water, which they don't like)

That's a quite a handful already, and, as stated, it took me about 6-8 hours to get my first farm going, the first three or four of which were spent in utter confusion.

[Zaleukos]

One of the Codexers is working on a tileset. Look here:

http://rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=21041&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=25

and scroll down to see examples and a download link (it's still a work in progress).

Thanks for pointing me to that. I was pretty sure that someone would be working on a tileset by now, since the game has been available for some time.

[Rina]

* Irrigation (floodgates, levers, connecting the two, channeling water) =>
needs mason's workshop, mechanic's workshop
* Requirements for farming (muddy floor => getting water at a depth of 1 onto it)


Floodgate farming is mostly obsolete now.
Sand or clay are the way to go, and at least in the current version you dont need to worry about irrigation with them.

[Prime Junta]

Seriously? No wonder I'm starving every winter. Gotta try that... so you don't need to irrigate at all with sand or clay? Just dig a room and plant your plump helmets, cave wheat, sweet pods, and quarry bushes?

[Rina]

Seriously? No wonder I'm starving every winter. Gotta try that... so you don't need to irrigate at all with sand or clay? Just dig a room and plant your plump helmets, cave wheat, sweet pods, and quarry bushes?

Yup! It's that easy. I'm not sure if Toady did that to ease the learning curve or if there is something else behind that, but enjoy it while you can.

There is also a neat little trick you can do now: expose part of the farm to the sunlight by digging channels on the surface level, and you can grow outdoor crops inside next to your subterrean stuff. :)

[Prime Junta]

Cool, gotta try that. Outdoor crops are just so... un-dwarflike.

[Ubereil]

I'm makeing slow progress. I have a way of starting over if I make some mistake (which I'll have to get rid off...), so I have so far started four or five new fortresses (with one world per fortress). I was going to really start seriously on the last one but I somehow managed to pick a spot where I started at the top of the mountain, three levels above the forest...

Übereil

[Prime Junta]

Übereil, I think starting over is a big part of the fun. I must've started a dozen fortresses by now, although the latest ones have lasted a bit longer as I figure out more of the basics (I think I finally understand how food works, for example).

However, being three levels up on a mountain is no problem -- just tunnel down and dig a passage to the trees. It's a good idea to add a door and some stone-fall traps to keep the wildlife from wandering in, though. Not to mention kobolds and goblins.

[KazikluBey]

Rightyo, I have survived my first year and received my first couple of immigrants. The interface is pretty nice, though click-and-drag would be quite a timesaver in some instances. I think I managed to find a nice starting area with a river and various kinds of rock/sand/clay ground, have so far found copper and aluminum. I think my greatest hurdle will be the whole "no victory conditions" thing, until I'm overrun by a bunch of goblins, of course, at which point I'll probably start anew with the goal of surviving my first invasion.

[Prime Junta]

I just had my first invasion... and it was bugged. Apparently as of the latest version, the invaders just stand around the edge of the map and do nothing. IOW, play v0.27.169.33b if you want sieges to work. I'm sure it'll be fixed real soon. I guess that's why they call it an alpha...

I'm freezing that game until the next version; it's actually the first fortress I've made that's gone beyond mere survival -- I had about 50 dwarves, a sheriff, a couple of military squads, a big food surplus, and a neat little metal industry. It's kinda amusing that the most expensive metal (other than adamantium) is... aluminum. With platinum.

Next time, I'll pick a spot with flux materials for steelmaking. Iron somehow seems so... primitive.

[Rina]

I just had my first invasion... and it was bugged. Apparently as of the latest version, the invaders just stand around the edge of the map and do nothing. IOW, play v0.27.169.33b if you want sieges to work. I'm sure it'll be fixed real soon. I guess that's why they call it an alpha...

I'm freezing that game until the next version;


Actually, unless I'm mistaken, it has been bugged ever since 0.27.169.32a was released, because of the Z levels. So I think that if you want them to work you need to get the last january's release. And as the invaders will come sooner or later in any case, I dont see much point in saving that for later.

Edit: Apparently 33d released yesterday by the way.

[Prime Junta]

I was quoting the wiki: [ http://www.dwarffortresswiki.net/index.php/Siege ].

[Majnun]

Well, I appologize in advance for a half-assed linkjob...but this guy has a lot of usefull info about dwarf fortress in his blog. He's the reason I got interested in it in the firtst place since I respect his opinions about games (one of the few reviewers who also hated deus ex:invisible war back when he wrote for gonegold.com).

You need to scroll down to September 7th (an inch or so from the bottom of the page) on this one and start from there:

http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2006_09_01_archive.html

He does a walkthrough/tutorial for the first part of the game over a few days, and there's plenty of posts with DF stories from various other people tossed in later...including some here (start almost at the bottom):

http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2006_10_01_archive.html

and there's also this:

http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2007/01/dwarf-fortress-interview.html

There's a 2nd part to that interview but I'm entirely too hungover and lazy to look for it and link it...if you care you can find it yourself. :P

I'd imagine some of the tutorial stuff he wrote is outdated since the game has been updated at least once (twice I think) since then (I haven't played it in awhile) but it still might be useful.

[Elwro]

Mayday has released a graphics update for Dwarf Fortress:

http://rpgcodex.net/index.php#4978