Drakensang - RPC Trailer

[Dhruin]

Drakensang.de has a Drakensang trailer (http://www.drakensang.de/oe2edit/oe2edit.cgi?site=005&language=de) from the recent Roleplaying Convention in Germany (51Mb). I haven't seen it but I assume it's in German.
Thanks, Alrik!
More information. (http://www.rpgwatch.com/show/newsbit?newsbit=9001)

[woges]

Eye candy, no spoken words some German text.

[Alrik Fassbauer]

Yes it is.

[Brother None]

Dang, that gameplay footage looks a lot more polished than when I last saw the game.

[r3dshift]

Dang, that gameplay footage looks a lot more polished than when I last saw the game.
Yikes! So how was it last time if this is polished?

2 months till release? Damn, is this a non-buyer for me.

[lef]

Looks nice enough to me. Can't wait to play it. :) The only bad thing about that trailer is its music. So boring and unimaginative. I hope they did better for the actual game.

[Roi Danton]

Yikes! So how was it last time if this is polished?

2 months till release? Damn, is this a non-buyer for me.


What isn't polished? Good, graphics don't look as good as in NWN2 but I can live with that.

[DaDoom]

The trailer doesn't show much of the gameplay - not enough to judge the game by it in any case. There's more footage somewhere on the net, showing more of the interaction with NPCs and the combat system. What I've seen so far looks very promising to me. I think Drakensang could become much more of a Baldur's Gate in 3D than Newerwinter Nights ever was.

[r3dshift]

What I definitely didn't like in the trailer is the static combat. They have sweeping moves and all, yet when a character gets hit, they just wince. Come on... This was acceptable in TB games a few years ago, but not now and not in real-time combat. Not since the Polish guys making The Witcher took the trouble to properly animate characters, even in combat.

BTW, NWN2 is far from being a graphics benchmark in my opinion. :)

[DArtagnan]

That didn't demonstrate much, and I think the combat looked kinda clumsy and static. It didn't give a feel of the gameplay at all, and it was dull in its overly dramatic Hollywood style as so many others.

If it wasn't for the legacy, I'd be completely disinterested in this based on that trailer, but I'm keeping an eye out for now.

[Dhruin]

It wasn't a great trailer but I don't really care too much about the animations. Still high on my list - or it would be, if they'd get some English release details out.

[Alrik Fassbauer]

Not since the Polish guys making The Witcher took the trouble to properly animate characters, even in combat.

Sounds like being overfed with luxury.

Remember that the Witcher is out only for a few months - and Drakensang has been in development for about the same time ( I met the then responsible community manager of dtp at the FeenCon in the last two years - always in July).

[Gorath]

You can't really compare it to The Witcher. CD Project had ca. 4 times the budget - in a country with lower wages. Completely different focus. It was clear from day one that Drakensang would be nowhere near the top technically. It´s only about "good enough".

[DaDoom]

Believe it or not I never buy an RPG because of it's technical qualities - of course I don't say no to some eyecandy but I'd play a plain 2D RPG if the inner values are ok. Games like "Hard to be a God" are beautiful enough in my eyes, what counts for me is the game itself, not the presentation.

[elikal]

Guys, a RPG like Dark Eye ones, are for the world to explore, a STORY to experience. Yeah yeah, combat and details are nice and fun. But its not what a ROLE PLAYING GAME is mainly about. Or should be. Ok I am biased being an old Dark Eye pen and paper gamer, but even in many other RPGs I loved them despite not much built on eye candy - thats just a possible bonus. As DaDoom said, "Hard to be a God" was indeed nice, because of the inner values, the story, the interesting world and such.#

Take Oblivion, it was nice to view and yet the story was very shallow presented. I loved the old Northland Trilogy (Nordland Trilogie) despite its even for their time antic graphics and hey Drakensang is a BIG leap ahead compared to them!

Witcher was good to look but IMO little that captured me story-wise or in the world-lore aspect AT ALL.

[DArtagnan]

Guys, a RPG like Dark Eye ones, are for the world to explore, a STORY to experience. Yeah yeah, combat and details are nice and fun. But its not what a ROLE PLAYING GAME is mainly about. Or should be. Ok I am biased being an old Dark Eye pen and paper gamer, but even in many other RPGs I loved them despite not much built on eye candy - thats just a possible bonus. As DaDoom said, "Hard to be a God" was indeed nice, because of the inner values, the story, the interesting world and such.#

Take Oblivion, it was nice to view and yet the story was very shallow presented. I loved the old Northland Trilogy (Nordland Trilogie) despite its even for their time antic graphics and hey Drakensang is a BIG leap ahead compared to them!

Witcher was good to look but IMO little that captured me story-wise or in the world-lore aspect AT ALL.

I like those things too, but the trailer showed none of that whatsoever.

[Alrik Fassbauer]

Of course, Drakensang is aimed to a broader audience.

The fear in the game community (official forum) is always that the game will become a "dumbed down" version of what "we" consider to be great - especially in the traditions of the NLT ( = RoA).

For example, the micromanagement and the turn-based combat have alwyys been declined - the developers didn't want it, apparently in order not to distract too many people.

But "we", the rather hardcore RPG faction in the official forum, we wanted this all of the time - and this have been always felt disappointed by the constant negating of what we personally perceived as "great".

In fact, the current fashion of making RPGs "more accessible for the masses" has clearly had its impact there - which "we" regret.

But - Radon Labs is forced to make profit out of this, so to say - because the development already was expensive. So, they have no choice, I fear it seems.

The result will be a great-looking game which tries to bring the world of Aventuria to the highest possible number of players - of German players, especially, because in my opinion this is still the core group of buyers.

They might have the international market in their plans already, but The Dark eye is a German RPG, so the gme is mainly aimed at a German audience.

It's a little bit like the Witcher aimed mainly at the Polish audience. (With the international market being secondary).

[ulixes]

For example, the micromanagement and the turn-based combat have alwyys been declined - the developers didn't want it, apparently in order not to distract too many people.

Just to make this clear:
The combat in Drakensang is, at its core, turn-based (perhaps round-based would be the better word).
It is very closely modeled after the original (4th Edition) pen&paper rules, the main difference being that not the player-characters take turns, but the whole party does. So in a way everybody is acting at the same time, not one after another (which is a convention forced upon p&p-players because of p&p's inherent mechanics - it would be confusing if in combat every character would act - and therefore its players speak - at the same real-world-time).

Hope you guys got what I meant ;)

[Alrik Fassbauer]

Yes, it is turn-based - but only in its core.
To enter "real" turns, one has to strike the space key, or so I read.
Or in other ords (which are a biit more exact) : In order to pause the combat, one has to strike the space key ...

At least that is what I have learned ... And the way how I understood it ...

[Brother None]

I like those things too, but the trailer showed none of that whatsoever.

It's very typical of what's wrong with game publishing today.

They can't afford the cutting edge graphics to compete with the mainstream AAA RPG titles, yet they still attempt to design their game as an AAA RPG "to make a profit"

That's just backasswards. If you can't compete with AAA RPGs, why are you designing your RPG as one? It's insanity to think an inferior product can operate in the same market as superior ones and still make a profit. If your product is inferior in certain ways, like graphics, then you need to be in another market.

The license and European market will hopefully pull them through, but it's got "bad idea" written all over it. Still, the German PC market is the biggest in the world, so it's hardly like they have to worry that much about international sales.

PS: combat is like Baldur's Gate. The system runs in turns underneath, determining player actions by turns, but in real-time on the surface.

[Fenris]

I think this will be the next Ultima IX ....

[Turjan]

The result will be a great-looking game which tries to bring the world of Aventuria to the highest possible number of players - of German players, especially, because in my opinion this is still the core group of buyers.

They might have the international market in their plans already, but The Dark eye is a German RPG, so the gme is mainly aimed at a German audience.
I fear that this might be a big problem for them. I have the feeling that this game will sit between all chairs. The rabid hardcore DSA fans will scream that the game has been "dumbed down", whereas players who never heard of DSA will probably bitch about the arcane system.

Of course, I'm just speculating here. Let's hope that the game will be a nice middle ground that makes most people happy.

[DArtagnan]

It's very typical of what's wrong with game publishing today.

They can't afford the cutting edge graphics to compete with the mainstream AAA RPG titles, yet they still attempt to design their game as an AAA RPG "to make a profit"

That's just backasswards. If you can't compete with AAA RPGs, why are you designing your RPG as one? It's insanity to think an inferior product can operate in the same market as superior ones and still make a profit. If your product is inferior in certain ways, like graphics, then you need to be in another market.

The license and European market will hopefully pull them through, but it's got "bad idea" written all over it. Still, the German PC market is the biggest in the world, so it's hardly like they have to worry that much about international sales.

PS: combat is like Baldur's Gate. The system runs in turns underneath, determining player actions by turns, but in real-time on the surface.

I would have to agree with that.

I have no idea what developers that are into great game design are doing messing around with the mass market. They don't have the funds and what's worse, they try to market their products with trailers like this which would seem to target the same kind of people who enjoyed Oblivion. Those people will be severely underwhelmed with a game like this - or at least most of them will.

But the thing is, some developers aren't willing to settle for smaller markets and the limited financing they can get by targeting them. So they're probably pitching their game in a way that lures publishers into coughing up larger sums. That's quite a risk to take, but I can sympathize with that choice - as I prefer a certain standard in terms of production values.

The middle ground approach we could call it, but I still don't appreciate stupid trailers like this - as they pretty much require the hardcore gamer to look beyond the surface and understand the potential beneath. But I'm not convinced as of yet in this case.

[Alrik Fassbauer]

Who defines what specifications AAA titles have, by the way ?

[Brother None]

Who defines what specifications AAA titles have, by the way ?

The latest AAA release does. If you mean technical specifications.

[Gorath]

Who defines what specifications AAA titles have, by the way ?
Marketing, focus testing, sales statistics and of course comparison with the competition. Your product needs at least as high production values as the last AAA game in the same genre.
For a shooter this means that if you want to to sell your game based on the graphics you have to beat Crysis.

[Gorath]

Now I have finally watched the trailer ... and I wonder why they released it?! I can see its value in marketing a computer game to a crowd who mostly prefer LARPs and table-top products. Create atmosphere, show the combat is without hurry, all fine. But why release such a movie full of uninteresting rendered sequences plus a bit of unspectacular gameplay to the general public, especially if the hook so far was the nice medieval world with lots of details?

[Gorath]

They might have the international market in their plans already, but The Dark eye is a German RPG, so the gme is mainly aimed at a German audience.

It's a little bit like the Witcher aimed mainly at the Polish audience. (With the international market being secondary).

The Witcher was meant to become a big international franchise from day one. It was never meant to be a local product. CD Projekt has the money to stem this.

Drakensang on OTOH is probably indeed primarily targeted on the German market, simply because the license is well known here. The game´s mass market appeal is unproven though, which explains why dtp, unlike most big mainstream publishers, still works hard to get close to core gamers and the RPG crowd.