Which Gothic game was your favorite?

[SirDeity]

I'm very curious to see which Gothic game was the favorite of the majority here. Please participate in the poll and let us know why you selected the answer you chose. Personally, I think the original Gothic was the best of all... I don't honestly know why... it just felt more... real... if that makes any sense at all. Gothic 2 was my second favorite and Gothic 3 is my third... but it goes without saying that all of them were amazing, great games!

[Moriendor]

I voted for the 1st one because it completely blew me away when it came out in March 2001 in Germany. I was working for a PC system builder/retailer back then and the company was also selling games in the retail outlets. Purchasing those games was one of my tasks and we got Gothic a couple of days before the German street date. There was zero hype for Gothic at that time, no forums posts with impressions because no one had the game yet, and the print press had barely covered it at all. I knew very little about the game. Only that it was supposed to be some kind of fantasy-style Tomb Raider (that's how the German print mags labeled Gothic before its release due to the 3rd person perspective and the control scheme). I fully expected the game to suck just like the other forgettable Tomb Raider clones before it. Well, and the rest -as they say- is history :) .

[Alrik Fassbauer]

My old PC I'm using now was then at the very height of good systems. It was a very good machine then, and I use it even now while I write these lines.

I bought it some time after the hype had began, and actually became intrigued so that I finally bought the game - at an reduced price at thge last of a closing computer games shop.

Like Moriendor already wrote, I was blown away. This (Gothis 1) is - from the point of deep immersion - one of the best games I've ever played.

I must admit, that I can't really vote in here, because OI've never played any Gothic part than that (bought Gothic 2 only a few weeks ago).

I just wanted to emphasize that feeling of "being blown away" that Moriendor had, too. I'm actually a bit astonished that someone had exactly the same impression ... - although I really shouldn't be surprised, because the rest is history.

Over the next few months (given no adventure game hinders me from that :D ) I'll try whether Gothic 2 will or will not run on my old Athlon 800 Mhz PC. :D ;)

EDiot : Just to add : I became very proud that German developers had managed to do what nobody had expected from them : To actually build an very good game. ;)
The same happened with Far Cry, by the way. ;)

[SirDeity]

Wow you're lucky! So you were one of the first to ever play the game =) I remember actually having some really hard times with the original because the game wouldn't run good on Windows ME. The game was awesome and I wanted to play it so desperately, that I actually went through three different operating systems before finally finding one that worked good with it. Before then it'd crash way too frequently (kind of like Gothic 3 does for me now).

Anyway, after I fixed it it was like smooth heaven. Everything about the game is just so memorable. I don't know how else to explain it except to say that you just know when someone has poured their hearts into something. I really believe Pirahna Bytes poured their hearts in the original Gothic and that is what made it truly spectacular! It's not just the graphics detail at the time, it was the attention to the landscapes, the fluid and fantasy-realistic flow of everything and how it all meshed together like a good dream you just hate waking from. And the innovation! OMG, who ever saw something that looked like a scavenger and sounded like chicken or rooster before? Maybe they got the idea from a dinosaur? I have no idea but the whole "world" design was brilliant and so new. The monsters were so different from any other game, movie, or other form of entertainment I had ever seen before. I only wish instead of using the same old stuff on a larger scale, Pirahna Bytes had maintained the same scale while introducing an abundance of new and innovative stuff like the original stuff was. I mean, for example, on earth you see different species depending on where you go. Sure, there are a handful of new MOBs in each of the Gothic games... but overall its more of the same stuff... I hate to sound like I'm complaining because ALL of the Gothic games are really great games but I can't shake the feeling that Pirahna Bytes is losing whatever spark it had with the original. I think maybe they are too focused on what other games are doing... I think Morrowind or Elder Scrolls probably prompted them to spend an enourmous amount of resources on creating a huge world for Gothic 3 when it just wasn't necessary. It's not quantity that matters, it's value. I'd rather have a world the size of the original Gothic and equally as imaginative, diverse, and unique, than a world 100 times the size of Gothic 3 or any of the Elder Scrolls games. Can anyone honestly say that Gothic 3 doesn't seem at least a little repetative at times?

I consider myself one of the most biased and stubborn people when it comes to the Gothic games. I've written reviews on the past two games (one was published and copywritten on quandary) and have always stood up for the Gothic games... it's always annoyed me terribly when people talk badly about these games because they're so great.... but at the same time I can't help but notice the gradual misdirection of the Gothic series. I guess I'm just sharing all of these thoughts because I'd like to know if anyone feels similarly. It's possible that I simply enjoyed the other two Gothic games so much that my expectations have become too high for reason.

[Moriendor]

I fully second your sentiments. Another thing that made Gothic stand out IMHO was that the goal of the game didn't immediately become clear. Breaking out of the jail/barrier or destroying the barrier by the end of the game just seemed like one of many possibilities. For a long time, you didn't really know what was going on regarding the grand scheme of things because you had to focus on much more mundane tasks like gaining rep and rank with (one of) the different factions. I really liked it a lot how they revealed only little pieces of the grand scheme bit by bit before it became clear that there might indeed be a way to bring down the barrier.
Gothic II and III on the other hand are lacking that kind of mystery. It's pretty obvious in both games what the bigger goals are. There are a few minor surprises on your way to reach your goals but both games don't have the same "building up the story as you move along" approach that made the first game so great in addition to all the other things you mentioned.

[curious]

...and then there were the unknown lands...

[SirDeity]

If this thread gets enough posts I'll email Kai Rosenkranz (one of the developers - the Music, Sound, and Effects Design developer) the link and maybe he'll actually take a look at it and get the attention of the rest of the Pirahna Bytes team. I haven't talked to him a long time so I doubt he remembers me but he seemed like a really nice guy who was genuinely interested in what the fans had to say. He even read my review at Quandary for Gothic 2 and commented on it.

[Dez]

I'll go with the crowd. First one is definitely the best. The game kept the tension of story all through the game. I really adore gothic 1 because the flow was so natural. Instead in g2 xardas explains right away what we must do, so because of that it didn't feel same....

In g3 they went back to the roots as player did not have any preset goals other than finding xardas... But at some point i simply ignored it and started doing my own thing. maybe there should have been more gentle push from devs. Oh gosh ain''t I such a whiner, but what can I say, g1 was the most balanced in terms of how story proggessed :)

g1 > g3 > g2 ;)

[cptmaxon]

I love gothic 1, really I do, I played it on an old machine and waited for like 6 mintues each time for it too load because it was that good and worth it....
i rememeber the feeling of complete immersion, the feeling that the world is a real breathing world.... not something created by people, which I don't see in many computer games anymore.
it felt so real and so big(even though that in retrospect it's not as big as other games) I got lost in the woods on my way to the sect camp many many times(till I got a map of course) ..... , it also felt like a prison, you got roughed up (who among us doesn't rememeber the words"thanks for the ore you hero")and got mugged you were asked to pay protection money and if you didn't things could have gotten ugly, and after a while you did the same to others just to get thier gear and ore(might makes right in gothic1).it just felt real which is something any computer game should aspire too

[Danicek]

Don't beat me but I'm enjoying the latest one the most. Yes, I have to admit that I'm not all the way through. Also I liked the previous two parts a lot...

[Gorath]

I think G2 Gold is the best of them, followed by Gothic. G3 is clear third.
Gothic is the most immersive but G2 has the better gameplay and holds the pace for a much longer time.

[KasperFauerby]

I cast my vote for G2 (especially with Notr added).

I love the entire gothic series and when the first one arrived it completely blew me away. Going down that winding road and discovering a big city with lots of interesting NPCs with their own daily tasks reminded me of "Ultima 7 Serpent Isle" - just in full 3d :) Later, when I found myself sneaking around the woods at night hunting scavengers with a bow and trying to avoid roaming wolf packs and sleeping shadowbeasts it just hit me - this was the most immersive RPG I had played for a very long time. I felt like being a part of the world!

When G2 arrived I basically just wanted more of the same - and in my opinion that's pretty much what we got, just bigger and prettier :) Now, for me both the story and the exploration part of the Gothics are the most important things - possibly with exploration being the most important one for me. And this is what tips the scale towards G2 for me I think. I just *love* walking through the world, looking for small hidden caves or tombs. As cliche as it might sound I *love* finding hidden caves when I swim behind a waterfall :) G1 had some of these locations, but G2 was just completely *stuffed* with them. All designed by hand and with carefully distributed loot to be found. One of the best examples is the treasure island in G2. I was standing at the harbor, looking out over the open sea - and there in the distance there seems to be an small island. I swim to it and find it inhabited by a pack of beasts which I manage to defeat. Then I find the hidden entrance to a treasure cave, complete with a spike trap, hidden switch and everything. I mean, what's not to love here :)

G3 is also great. It's absolutely huge, looks great and also has lots of secret caves to find. Unfortunately there are way too few items in the game, so you very very rarely find any really interesting loot. Also the content of the chests has been randomized (there are probably too many for the devs to fill manually), which in my opinion also makes it less interesting to go exploring for them.

So, bottom line - G2:NOTR is the best Gothic for me :)

[Gorath]

Are you sure you really voted?

[ToddMcF2002]

G2 Gold. Gothic 1 a very close second.

[KasperFauerby]

I voted yesterday, but didn't have the time to add a comment until today :)

[curious]

im with dez, in that i think the 1st is my favourite with 3 next and then the 2nd. for all the people who voted for the 2nd, i'm wondering how much time passed between when you played them. ie did you play gothic 1, less than a year, less than 2 years, or more than 2 years before playing gothic 2. i really believe that the 'when'of playing a game relative to its release, escpecially when a series is involved has an impact, even if small, on possible levels of enjoyment of a game. i played gothic 1 when it came out, but having to 'wait' for gothic 2, escpecially the expanision to be realeased coupled with it being mostly the same but 'bigger and prettier' as kasperfauerby explained, as well as more refined, made it not as great for me though still i had no complaints with the game. and the changes in gothic 3 added a freshness to me, whether or not they were better i can't say, that i enjoyed greatly.

games like deus ex i didn't play 'til it was a year or more old so i had less expectations for and time to wait for deus ex 2 which i enjoyed. the same with the thief games which 1 and 2 i played only 1-2 years before the 3rd came out which i enjoyed alot. and then there's playing a sequel first, like with system shock 2 which i played close to when it came out. one of my favourites, which then i went back to play the original which i thought was good, but nothing like the second.

anyone else share these feelings?

[Corwin]

I disagree on SS. I know the graphics aren't as good, but I found the original a much better game. I enjoyed the sequel, but it didn't have the lasting, dare I say for the time groundbreaking impact of the first!!

[curious]

yes corwin that's fine, but what i wanted to know was the order you played them in and when. judging by your comment it looks as if you played ss1 when it came out, which is exactly what i'm getting at. the 'groundbreakingness' of an original game played when it comes out, and played before you play other games (not necessarily in that franchise) that have similar or copied elements in them will lessen the novelty of your experience with the 'first' game like it did for me.

[JDR13]

Curious, I understand what you're saying. In fact, the System Shock series is a great example. I played SS2 first and thought that game was a little better than
SS1.

However, I voted for Gothic 2 even though I played both when they were first released. I just feel that Gothic 2, especially when you add in NOTR, just offered so much more. I think there's a lot of nostalgia involved in all these people voting for Gothic 1.

[Dr. A]

Gothic 2+ NoTR for me.

Gothic was an incredible game for sure. But the controls (c'mon all ye faithful, admit it) were cumbersome. Anybody know the story behind that?

Gothic 2 had fantastic gameplay and the controls were waaaay improved. Also the gameworld was twice as large (with NoTR, three times). Sure, the atmosphere doesn't match its precursor. That's because it was designed to be completely different. You're not a prisoner trapped in a mining-based prison colony encompassed by a deadly barrier. Now you're a free man, a man who has accomplished much (Banishing the Sleeper, destroying the barrier) and must seek out old friends (and enemies!).

As for Gothic 3...I'm waiting for a new rig and at least another patch :)

[SirDeity]

Call me strange but after I got used to the controls in the original Gothic, I was just as good with them as I am with any other controls. They worked perfectly fine for me... yea they were different than any other game I played and yeah they took me a little while to figure out and get used to... but after the learning curve it was every bit as smooth and effective as any other control scheme I can imagine.

[SirDeity]

Oh... in Gothic 2 I actually kept the classic controls because I was so used to them that they were actually easier for me because I already knew how to use them and it meant not having to get used to another control scheme all over again.

[JDR13]

Nothing wrong with that. I also used the Gothic 1 controls in Gothic 2.

[curious]

can't remember if i used the gothic 1 controls for gothic 2 or not. but the only time i found the controls awkward for gothic 1 was about the first 15 min or so of the 60+ hours i spent with the demo. couldn't figure out how to do anything with those meatbugs which i later went back for after i got it all worked out. i know i'm in the minority here but although the combat was fun in gothic 1 and 2 for its own different reasons, and i didn't have a problem with it (would have been happy with it again) i enjoy it a lot more in gothic 3. i think that melee combat is better for beasts (having to alternate between attacks is far more challenging to me than back and forth, but obviously the human melee definately has its problems and am really interested to see how its handled in the upcoming patch. maybe they should do some scaling with the a.i.'s stamina which would allow for them to block more, since even as a pure mage i mauled them with my staff when i needed to. oh and one of my 'funniest' memories of gothic 3 was during the first hour of play finding more fire arrows than in all of notr!

i do think gothic 2+notr (minus lares not giving up the goods) was 'better', and i will probably be comfortable saying that 3 is better than 2 after the patch. but favourites involve emotion for me and gothic 1 affected me so much that it increase dmy level and time spent in pc gaming significantly from under 6 games a year to, alot more than that in a year!

[Thaurin]

I voted the first Gothic. Why? I can't really tell you why, because saying that it was the first time I played a Gothic game is not reason enough.

You know the very first time you play or do something really cool? You'll never really experience anything like it again. When Gothic 2 came round, it was more of the same. That wasn't a bad thing, but it wasn't my first time with Gothic anymore.

But I'm not sure if that's the only reason. Like someone else said, the way the world is laid out in Gothic 1, the landscape, the way the rivers flowed, it all made perfect sense. I've never felt that level of exploration with the other Gothics, even if they had a bigger land mass.

I used to dream about a game just like Gothic, but with super next-gen graphics: real-time shadows on everything, more detail, etc. Now that we actually have it, it's not quite the same. :) Don't get me wrong, I love all three. But I played Gothic straight through, while it took me two times to get through the second. I'm still playing the third now that I've finally finished Gothic 2. :)

Whatever anyone says, I will always hold that the controls in Gothic 1 were the best in any game I have ever played. Read that sentence again! Never have I had such exciting combat. I used the same controls with Gothic 2, but mapped to a gamepad. That was much better; I can recommend it! But no, Dr. A: I didn't find them all that cumbersome. :)

You can't get back that old feeling, because everything was different then.

[cptmaxon]

I really think that the control scheme in gothic 1 was the best, I used it with gothic 2 and had a blast, I did think the NPC combat was better in G2 with the parry option, and I also like hte fact they gave you a sort of block for beasts(the jump backwards move), it's combat in G3 I have problems with...
for instance all of the npcs that I partied with were only there for fodder, they didn't engage in combat even when the beasts were on top of them , even the mighty gorn which helped me take down a troll in gothic got killed repeatdly when we stormed the old pally stronghold.
anyway I felt it was more cubersome then the old system if you can believe that:)

[Zaleukos]

I also used G1 controls in Gothic 2, and find that the only problem with those controls is switching target while fighting large groups of enemies.

Gothic 1 was probably the best for me. I have had great fun with all three though. There is one thing I dislike with the first two incarnations (particularly with the NotR expansion). That is the need to overly carefully plan your spending of learning points, and having to save potions for later use (I built a mage in G1 that ended up with way too little mana because I had spent my permanent mana potions before getting to 100 mana). I prefer games where you have the time to repair a character build, and proceed in the game, even if it takes some extra time. Gothic 3 solves that by not having any artificial caps and having an over-abundance of roaming monsters to kill, so I never felt the need to vacuum clean wilderness areas in G3.

Essentially G1 and G2 are better for storyline and NPC depth but a bit linear. G3 seems to have more replay potential, but the NPCs, and particularly your old friends from previous adventures, are very underdeveloped.

G1 and G2 remains my favourite RPGs of all time though. The world and the NPCs are so rich that it compensates for the relative linearity, and that is with me really valuing replay value above many other factors in RPGs:)

[Wulf]

For me, spending exp was not a problem in G1, neither was the keyboard, here's a few things i completed on my G1 travels and experiences.

(using "initial" cheats - preset at game start then playing normal storyline)
1. Took Mud all the way through the game and he killed the sleeper.
2. Completed G1 as a non-combatant yet reciever of exp of others eg: Mud, Shrat etc'

(with no cheats)
3. Completed the game with only diggers trousers and discipline sword.
4. Completed the game with no melee weapons, just the bow and magics.
5. Completed the game with fist/kickfighting and some magics.
6. Completed the game with no agressive killing of opponents but by other means, summons etc'
7. Enabled the true chromanin quest and opened the monastery portal without realising or completing the game.

G1 is unequalled, it is the best for atmospherics and depth, it hasn't been fully completed yet by anyone (aka:chromanin) this fact alone places the game at the pinacle of excellence.

I vote without hesitation for G1.

[txa1265]

I voted Gothic 2. I have played this a ton, and Gothic 1 only a couple of times. Of course, I played Gothic 2 *first* and it really hooked me! I also loved Gothic 3, but for me it is the least of the series.

i really believe that the 'when'of playing a game relative to its release, escpecially when a series is involved has an impact, even if small, on possible levels of enjoyment of a game.
I agree - since I played all Gothic games well after release date, and had to eBay all of them (except G2 Gold ... so yes I have 2 copies of G2!)), I feel I missed that whole 'day of release' thing. So I was going backward after adapting to G2's controls, and trying to learn G1's controls. They never felt as fluid to me.

[JDR13]

[QUOTE=cptmaxon;12012]I really think that the control scheme in gothic 1 was the best, I used it with gothic 2 and had a blast, I did think the NPC combat was better in G2 with the parry option, QUOTE]

Couldn't you parry in Gothic 1 also? It's been quite a while since I've played it but I thought I remember being able to parry.


*Edit* Just booted up Gothic, (didn't even realize I still had it installed) and yes, you can parry\block.

[Bigpapa]

Gothic 1 is the one which caused my addiction to this game type, i do like G2 and G3, but since G1 is the one to be blamed, i had to vote it ;)

[Shrapnel]

Gothic 1 was my favorite because when the demo hit the US, no one really knew how to categorize it. It was when I first entered the old camp: the hushed voices talking around the campfires, the whole 'psst hey you, come here' got me immersed.
But it was when I got caught in that first hut that hooked me. The realization that, while these NPCs are going about their business, they are watching 'the stranger' and everything he does while in camp. It freaked me out! I must have played the demo about 8x over waiting for the full version to hit the states. And like someone said earlier, it was the way the entire plot came in piece-meal that kept you hooked.
The whole time you're focused on bringing down this barrier, it isnt until the last 2 cahpter that the REAL end mission is revealed. But again, it wasnt the grand plot that caught my attention it was the very little details that did it for me.
The multiple ways to finish a task, the process to cooking, and smithing and alchemy and weed smoking...and llooking for the texts and books all over the place.
It made the long run to the end a lot more fun that in a usual CRPG and it really showed that they took their time with G1

[titus]

haven't played gothic 3 yet, just the demo, so I will not vote yet.
I liked G1 more, why? especially the story, or not knowing the story, and the little pieces falling together bit by bit untill you finally realize what the purpose of the game is. That was what G2 never had.
Also the opening sequence was great of G1. I will never forget the punch in the face.
And of course the old friends who you just started to learn. They didnt had such a big role in 2.
I know it sounds like I didn't liked G2 but I do love it. just liked G1 more.
But I won't vote because I noticed with only playing the demo, I really fellt like playing gothic1 again but in a totally different setting. I will vote a soon as I played G3 long enough to be able to compare it, or when I finished it

[migwell]

G1 and G2 were both great games, but I voted for G2 because of NOTR and because I played it more times, more recently.

Unfortunately, once you get past the bugs, G3 as a kind of Gothic Lite which resembles a pale copy the two earlier games in so many respects, but adds little that is truly compelling to the franchise. Coming down to the end of my first play-throughs of G1 and G2, I was happily anticipating the chance to replay them both. With G3, what I felt was relief that it was finally over. No desire for a replay except perhaps after some extensive patching... someday.

[Alrik Fassbauer]

I never had any problems with the controls in Gothic 1 in general, because I was already used to the use of they keyboards from jump&run games (originally my favourite genre next to adventures).

This might sound very weird to you, but from a keyboard use point of view, Gothic 1 appeared just as another jump & run game to me. :D

One thing that strongly remained in my memory was Mud. :)
And the possibility to forge your own swords, and roast you own meals. :)

Am I wrong or was it the first game wherein you could do this ? Especially in 3D ?

[Thaurin]

I remember games like Ultima Underworld II had things like this, or at least you could fish in water and catch fish for food. But then those games were ultimate classics as well. :)

I never finished that game. :(

[Bartacus]

I voted for Gothic 1, but I do think another option should have been enabled -> Gothic 2 + addon! It's for me of similar quality as the first game.

Gothic 3 misses a lot of features that were possible in Gothic 1. I'm suprised that PB gave this away just for some graphics and a larger world. I don't mind a slightly smaller world, cause I'm one of those guys who go lurking in each cave they find and try to get on higher points like mountains.(Real funny to kill a Black Troll with just a bunch of arrows -> you simply have to run away a few times and everything is ok)

[SirDeity]

I e-mailed KaiRo and gave him a link to this thread. Let's hope he still uses that e-mail address, and cross your fingers so he might visit us here. =)

[Maylander]

The 1st one. It set a new standard for me when it comes to 3D Action-RPGs, just like BG2 once set a new standard for 2D CRPGs. Games like that I never forget, and will always think more highly of than others.

[Angelo]

Yep, for me Gothic1 is definitely a legend. G2+tnotr comes quite close, but G1 has something special. I re-played both, g1 and g2+tnotr again before g3 and then compared them with g3 when it came out. The most interesting thing is, that I still after all these years found a few things about g1 that I didn't know (for example that ghost tower and chromanin quest, I don't know how I missed it last times) :) . So mi list would be G1>G2>G3.
P.S. I completely agree with Bartacus, gothic1 has way smaller world and bad graphics, but I still enjoy playing it more than G3. And like someone already said in another topic, PB probably wanted to make G3 better than Oblivion and weren't making another gothic.

[Sir Markus]

I played Gothic II Gold (with NOTR) and was completely blown away. It was one of the longest and most challenging games I've ever played.

[Wulf]

Looking at the graph state and weighing up the nomographic projection (using a straight edge along the tips of results) if a G4 should ever be released, then going along with the current trend flow suggests it would not even show on the popularity scale!

.....i sincerely hope i'm wrong. :'(

[Jabberwocky]

Wulf, regarding your first post, all I can say is you are HARD CORE!! I can't imagine trying to go through Gothic with all those different methods, especially the fist/kick fighting only.

Incidentally, I remember the first time an unarmed NPC attacked me. When I saw him fly through the air kung fu style I about peed my pants laughing with glee! What a game Gothic was!

That being said, I actually voted for Gothic 2 (and that's including NOTR of course).
To me it's such a close call that it basically came down to technicalities. The graphics and controls (strafing and single click to use items) were better in G2. The music was better, the characters (aside from Mud) were just as memorable. I also appreciated the greater diversity of the landscape. Although after Wulf's post reminding me about Chromanin and all that, I almost regret not voting for G1. Speaking of which Obi Wulf Kenobi, do you really think there is more to Chromanin than what everyone has found? ....

It's really too bad that G3 strayed from the formula. As it has been said many times before, it's still unquestionably "Gothic," but lacks the spark the first two games had. At the same time, I remember thinking the same thing about the vanilla version of Gothic 2. Then NOTR came out, (in German...grrrhh... nevertheless made do) and it catapulted G2 into first place in my "order of appreciation for Gothic games."

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the same thing is still possible with Gothic 3....

[Wulf]

Well Jabbs' - Rordog (also a chromanin seeker) at rpgdot was also inspired and attempted the same kickfighting approach and with *no* magics, an almost impossibility to overcome the G1 opponents (fanatic templars) without weapons.
Mazu, also at rpgdot also completed the 'Mud kills the sleeper' experiment. Also Imposteraz, pioneer of the 'followers' tecnique, (also a chromanin seeker) perfected the followers exp' to nameless's attributes tecnique - amongs others.

What many G1 fans perhaps didn't realise, especially when discussing attributes and leveling exp etc' was the actual *level* attribute, each opponent assesses the other's level when in 'hostile' combat mode to see if they have a 'chance' of outperforming, this is why we would sometimes see the opponent in a stance to attack yet not actually attack. On editing my level to 300 or more and in the new camp as i stood near to rogues or merc's they would run away in fear without any interaction.

On reading the many forums posts in the past, i found mostly that a players first gothic game experience greatly influences their preferred gothic liking. Players who who hadn't tried G1 before playing G2, liked G2 mostly, conversely players who progressed naturally through the trilogy said that G1 was the godfather, this is understandable.

So now while playing G3, and (because of finding the G1 chromanin old man) can see the strong referrences to G1 at many points within the game (the portal of Innos being a good example). This isn't some fanboy fanaticism but more of a gaming foresight of understanding the gamewriters motives, it is in someways like G1 revisited, and indeed this is what KaiRo promised and has kept his word.......and i am somewhat gagged on talking about the subject....such a great gaming shame....and that is where my heart lies grieved, i am sad for the gaming worlds loss. The hidden beauty of G1 was rebuked by forum orcish disbelief, although i did try in a fumbled kind of way to explain what i had found.

It is that "unknowing" yet "being aware of" element contained in G1 that many feel is real, this is ironic because it *is* still there.
Yes i found what Xardas's extra dialogue says! - yes i found where the secret trigger-box is located! - yes i found where the data is held-off until required! - yes i found which graphic items are in-game and used! - such a masterpiece of incomplete realisation, unequalled by any other rpg game of it's fanbase following in the world and i was left alone with all of this.

"Chromanin's visions HAVE opened my eyes. No price could be high enough to ever renounce my faith in them, for it touched my heart too intensely" - (book 2)

So in respect of this hidden element, it is as yet impossible to say which is the "deepest" G1 or G3 until some player solves the suggestion 'overtone' contained within the books.

[JDR13]

"Yes i found what Xardas's extra dialogue says! - yes i found where the secret trigger-box is located! - yes i found where the data is held-off until required! - yes i found which graphic items are in-game and used"


Well don't just stand there, tell me how to find them!

[mudsling3]

I have to rank G3 the lowest :( Not a single quest or NPC left much of an imprint on my memory. But I can tell you that Grim, leader of Wolf Clan share the same name with one of diggers in G2... need I say more.

[Parmenion]

I played gothic 2 first and was blown away by it . Usually in RPGs you do not meet high level characters/monsters at the beginning of the game. Not so in the gothic series - this gave the game an element of danger - you didnt know what was around the corner. I think gothic 2 and the add on is the best RPG I have ever played and I have palyed RPGs from ultima VI onwards. I palyed the original gothic several years later - it was hard to get hold of in the UK until recently. I really enjoyed it but I think that gothic 2 and the add on have a slight edge on it - for the greater richness of the game world - and the increase in challenge in getting through it. I have played once through gothic 3 (orginally on a Athlon 1900+ and 6600GT - played to level 17 on that system- then moved to dual core 6700 and 7900GT). The bugs didnt affect me too much - a few restarts of the computer but I am very forgiving as far as buggy games are concerned - as long as saved games are OK. I really enjoyed the open game world and the graphics. I wasnt too bothered about the wild boars - there are always ways round problems with tough monsters - one thing that the gothic series excels in. I enjoyed the challenge of the game at the beginning but as you go through it in my opinion it gets too easy and the ending is a big let down compared to the other two games so I would have to rate gothic 3 as the weakest game of the three. Lets hope that the add on is better - I will of course snap it up as soon as it comes out. I would say that all three games are better than Oblivion - in my opinion the Elder Scrolls games are too repetitive - I didnt finish Oblivion it was far too easy - I could destroy any opponent easily - no challenge at all and far too repetitive.

[Sem]

I think G2 (especially with NotR) is the best.
G1 has some very strong points, I still remember the first time I played through the orc cemetery. I was still looking around and saving because I was absolutely sure that at some point those mummies would come alife. But overall I think G2 is better.

G3 is a rough diamond. With an addon and an improved engine it will be a blast. I'm enjoying the game more and more, but I think it's a shame that many opportunities weren't used.
For example: I've just freed Gotha for the first time and finished the "quest" to rebuild Gotha. Why didn't they do anything with the appearance of Gotha? The city is rebuild but it still looks the same. And why aren't there any quests to do in the new city, why aren't the rebels and freed slaves in the city praising my deeds, etc. That's just too bad.

[darghan]

G2 certainly - i was not so fond of Raven though
Land, quests, combat, in comparison with G3 bugfree, chars, little surprises, big surprises :) etc.
Hardcore game when playing as merc - too easy as pally
I just loved it in almost every aspect - it was a miracle
Anyways i still cannot believe what PB guys did to G3 :P - my DVD here collecting dust

[darghan]

i agree with that rough diamond thing youve said
things i need improved upon in order to play
Combat (problems regarding stamina mostly) - no i do not care that PB wanted to make combat mainstream-friendly - just make it work :)
Running (please make it so i cannot run from everything) - sry PB thats bullshit
Monster and NPC fading (how can i hunt a deer when it just vanishes into nothingness a few meters away?) - i can live with that :)