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-   -   Might and Magic 7 (http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16849)

bloodlover April 14th, 2012 19:12

Might and Magic 7
 
Yes I know we have another thread like this but I didn't find my answer there so I had to open a new one.

I've been playing Legend of Grimrock lately and to my surprise I really enjoyed it. I never was a big fan of this type of games (I had a try with Wizardry 8 but abandoned it after the first city) but LoG made me really curious to find out more so I thought I'd give M&M 7 a try. Several reasons for this: I heard it's more n00b friendly than M&M6, HOMM 3 is one of my fav. games ever and the already mentioned curiosity. So I started reading few things here and there about the game but the amount of info about it (spells, classes, items etc) seems to never end. So I decided to just start playing the game and discover everything on my own.

My main problem (and the reason why I made this topic) is the party creation. I usually roll with tank/rogue-thief/wizard/healer combination. Any specific things I should know about the party, races, stat allocation etc? I suppose that it's obvious about wizards having high int. and stuff like that but with such a great variety I'm afraid not to screw up my game even before starting by making poor decisions for my party.

Also I have the GoG version I wouldn't like to install any mods or stuff like that since it;s my first time playing it :)

Pladio April 14th, 2012 19:53

http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16463

We've just discussed this not too long ago. :)

Dark Savant April 14th, 2012 19:59

You should read the manual for basic party creation info. Your classic combination is good. Of course there are better options but then it wouldn`t be so interesting to play the game with best possible party.

Also install this unofficial patch if it isn`t already included with GOG version.
http://sites.google.com/site/sergroj/mm

Might and Magic games aren`t classic dungeon crawlers like Legend of Grimrock. You should try some other games like Stonekeep, Anvil of Dawn or even older games like Eye of the Beholder 1&2, Dungeon Master and Lands of Lore: Throne of Chaos.

dteowner April 14th, 2012 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Savant (Post 1061138464)
Also install this unofficial patch if it isn`t already included with GOG version.
http://sites.google.com/site/sergroj/mm

That's not a mod, blood, so don't worry about it messing with the base game. There's one major bug that never got fixed in MM7. You might never see it, but it's annoying if you do. Grab the patch.

bloodlover April 14th, 2012 20:30

GrayFace MM7 Patch v1.6.1? I installed it but now Avast sees the game exe as some virus and mouse look does not seem to be enabled.

Also those pesky fireflies are killing me all the time >.>

Dark Savant April 14th, 2012 20:43

You must enable it first
Quote:

Mouse Look

To enable mouse look set MouseLook option to 1.
Mouse look can work in two modes. The default mode is like in 3D actions and alternative mode is closer to World of Worcraft and similar games.
Here is my preset for 3D action mode: http://sites.google.com/site/sergroj…7MouseLook.rar

You can activate alternative mode by setting MouseLookUseAltMode option to 1 or by pressing Caps Lock if the CapsLockToggleMouseLook option is set to 1.
MouseLookChangeKey is used to temporary switch mode (turn off mouse look in normal mode or turn it on in activate mode). The mode is restured if you open any other screen.
MouseLookTempKey changes mode while you hold it. Best fit for alternative (WoW) mode.
MouseSensitivityX and MouseSensitivityY control mouse sensitivity. If you want, you can invert Y axis by making its sensitivity negative. Note that you can set values over 100.
MouseSensitivityAltModeX and MouseSensitivityAltModeY are similar, but used for alternative mode.
MouseLookFly option lets you fly up/down by pointing your view in the desired direction.

Fnord April 16th, 2012 01:35

How does the game determine who in the party gets hit? I'm off the tutorial island, and have cleared out the castle, and the game won't even distribute any damage to any other party members than my cleric, before the cleric is down (cleric has position number 3)

Moriendor April 16th, 2012 01:48

The AI definitely likes to target healers. Since you already got your cleric in slot 3 instead of the more exposed 1 and 4 slots, I think you'll have to live with him/her getting more attention than you might like :) . I also believe that undead have a "preference" for clerics and after the tutorial isle you have to fight mostly skellies and undead or no? This will change later on in the game when you fight other critters. Definitely just try to keep your cleric fully buffed at all times with all defensive spells that you have access to etc.

Like in most -especially classic- RPGs magic classes are a bit of a bitch in the beginning but mid/end game you'll have tons of fun just bulldozing all over the game. If you go dark magic in MM7 and get that Armageddon spell near the end you'll remember why I said what I just said :) .

dteowner April 16th, 2012 04:21

There's actually a bug where the monster targetting gets screwed up and they only attack 1 toon. It's very rare for the bug to show up and I can't for the life of me remember the remedy, but I do remember someone fixing the problem when they had it. If you're seeing "more" attacks on the cleric, see Moriendor's explanation. If you're seeing "all" attacks on the cleric, you might have a problem.

bloodlover April 16th, 2012 12:24

I managed to finish the first area. It was a bit hard until I got the hang of the combat but after that it went smooth.

Is there a way to see where scrolls and books are placed so I don't have to randomly click the shelves?

How is the money/usefulness ratio in this game? I have around 4k gold right now but I hesitate on spending it on spells and skills.

edit: How does my thief disarm traps? Do I have to use the skill if I can or he does it automatically?

Fnord April 16th, 2012 12:31

I'm seeing all attacks hit the cleric firs, so I guess it is the bug that is making itself known.
Darn it, and here I was going to give the M&M series yet another chance :(

Pladio April 16th, 2012 13:28

@Fnord: You should try and find the fix before letting it down. MM7 has a nice story to it I thought.

@Bloodlover: If you're still in on the tutorial Island it's worth getting as many skills as you can. It's the only place where all ( or so many of) the skills are together in one spot.

Fnord April 16th, 2012 14:34

I've spent about 40min looking for the fix now, without any results. I guess I'm just not meant to play any M&M games past WoX.

*edit*
And a min later I found it. The reason why my character is getting mauled is because it is a dwarf, and goblins prefer to attack dwarfs first.

crpgnut April 16th, 2012 16:14

Ok, here are a few early game tips to make combat easier:

1. Fire Aura-put it on every bow and play in turn-based mode. Every character can and should learn the bow skill on Emerald Isle. A single point is all that is necessary for anyone that's not an Archer. This is a level 1 fire spell and sorcerers can learn it from the fire guild there. You will kill all fireflies/dragonflies without taking much damage with this spell.

2. Also, make sure to use the Day of the Gods pedestal every day on Emerald Isle.
There are 3 free skill points to be had for every member of the team by touching the flame on the hill behind the temple.

3. Of Shielding items: There are many random armor treasures in Castle Harmondale junk piles. Save before opening these and reload until you get at least one armor that has the Shielding property. Have the cleric wear this armor. I would suggest getting the cleric chain mail with the shielding spell. It will help immensely against the goblins. Also, beware the junk piles as they cause disease. You will almost always have one character who is unaffected by disease when clicking on the piles. Use that character, preferably with high luck, open all the piles.

Maylander April 16th, 2012 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by bloodlover (Post 1061138698)
Is there a way to see where scrolls and books are placed so I don't have to randomly click the shelves?

Not as far as I know. I usually end up running near book shelves spamming space bar to everything up. At least I think it was space bar, it's been a while.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bloodlover (Post 1061138698)
How is the money/usefulness ratio in this game? I have around 4k gold right now but I hesitate on spending it on spells and skills.

As far as I recall, skills/spells are the only things worth spending money on the first half of the game or so. It's quite expensive. Especially levelling up at the trainer gets rather expensive if you've gained several levels per character since the last time you visited.

In other words: Don't bother buying equipment during the first half of the game. You'll find what you need.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bloodlover (Post 1061138698)
edit: How does my thief disarm traps? Do I have to use the skill if I can or he does it automatically?

Traps will highlight as a red area. If it's on the ground, you have to jump over it. If it's on a chest, the character with disarm trap will try to disarm it automatically when you try to open the chest with that particular character. That character must be your selected character at the time. If it fails, it blows up. Otherwise, the trap is disarmed.

crpgnut April 16th, 2012 16:26

As far as party strategy, you can play the game to completion several ways. I like to use Paladin, Archer, Sorcerer, Cleric-in that order as a balanced party. However, I like elemental magic too so I also play Cleric, Druid, Sorcerer, Archer-in that order; giving me 3 elemental magic users. The Archer can tank a little bit if properly outfitted and I dump all endurance points into the two people on the ends. Generally, it's a good idea to buff any character that becomes a primary target. Goblins fight dwarves, Titans hate archers, etc.

Might and Magic can be played with a mostly melee party too. Playing Knight, Thief, Cleric, Monk can be lots of fun. Knights and Monks have ridiculous hitpoints :) Wands and scrolls are vital in these games though. If you play this party, make sure the give the Cleric master level meditation. He'll need the spell points if you want to use him as party buffer and damage spells. Don't disregard Flying Fist for ranged attacks or the wonderful Spirit Lash for melee. Spirit Lash can be devastating. Always, always, always bless and Heroism your party. It makes a massive difference.

crpgnut April 16th, 2012 16:50

Okay, another tip: Try to save up and train a handful of levels at a time. Also, try to purchase new skills around the same time. Why? Hirelings. What you want to do is hire merchant and trader NPC's right before training/buying/selling. These two NPCs will save you thousands of gold pieces. NPCs are random, so if you don't find the hirelings you need, just save and reload.

I'm an avid hireling user so I'll show how I play the game. Anytime I'm getting ready to fight a dungeon or clear an area I'll hire an Instructor, Teacher, or Scholar. Some towns (Harmondale is one), will not have instructors, so just go with Teacher and Scholar. Instructor is 700 gold to hire and will give you an extra 15% experience for every kill. Teachers give 10% and cost 300, Scholars give 5% and also give free item identification and cost 500. If you want to save money, don't pick up gold while you have these npcs in your party. Clear an area, pick up any non-gold treasures and let your scholar identify everything, then dump the hirelings and pick up the gold.

If you want to maximize your profits, you can come back to town before picking up all the gold and hire a banker/factor/pirate to replace the experience hirelings. Bankers take 10% of all gold found but give a 20% bonus, giving a 10% interest. Factors take 5% and give 10% and Pirates do the same as factors, but they also shorten boat travel time and decrease party reputation. Only use a Pirate if you're having trouble finding the other two.

Once you've gathered up all the loot and want to sell, dump the experience hirelings or money hirelings and pick up some professional barterers. Merchants give a 6 point increase to all characters merchant skill and traders give a 4 point bonus. You can hire a duper also, but since he lowers reputation he's not as good as a merchant/trader combo. Dupers give an 8 point bonus, but since they lower reputation it ends up only being a 3 point gain instead of 8. Once you have a character with a high merchant skill, you can stop hiring these guys. A grandmaster merchant buys and sells at cost. Also, once you've done a certain quest in Stone City you'll have a great reputation and it'll be a great place to sell. If you have a merchant/trader combo in Stone City, after doing the quest, you'll buy and sell at nearly full price. You can make tons of money, which helps when buying skills, training, etc.

Finally, if you're traveling and want/need to save time hire NPC's that shorten travel times. If you're walking, hire a pathfinder/tracker/guide/explorer. Ships will need navigators/sailors etc.

P.S There are hirelings available for just about every skill, so read about all their abilities and choose those that match your playstyle.

Found a chart:

http://shrines.rpgclassics.com/pc/mm7/hirelings.shtml

Fnord April 16th, 2012 16:59

I'm currently in the troglodyte cave under the dwarf city (really early in the game), and I'm again reminded of why I did not like Might & Magic 6: The long drawn out combat sections against hordes upon hordes of enemies. While outside it was not a big issue, I could move around, avoid getting into melee most of the time and just pelt the enemy with arrows, but down in the troglodyte caverns, I'm forced into close combat, and there are so many of them, which makes combat very tedious (though not exactly hard). Does it get better later on, or should I just drop the series altogether?

crpgnut April 16th, 2012 17:45

I'd say drop it. There are dozens of dungeons and while I was forced into melee at the start of the Trog caves, everything else I took out with bows/spells. As long as Wizard Eye is up, you'll know where the monsters are coming from and can drop to turn based and lure them to a more open area. The b key will bypass a character's turn if you want to skip rounds of combat for maneuvering.

Fnord April 16th, 2012 19:22

I'll do that then. The series looks like it has so much promise, but the combat just fails to engage me, and there is so much of it.


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