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-   -   Torment: Tides of Numenera - Kickstarter Tiers Planned (http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19669)

Myrthos March 1st, 2013 01:07

Torment: Tides of Numenera - Kickstarter Tiers Planned
 
based on user feedback the tiers for the upcoming Kickstarter for Torment: Tides of Numenera have been announced. It is not possible to vote on these tiers or submit ideas, but comments on the tiers can still be placed.
The tiers are ranging from $25 to $10000, with the lowest tier giving you the game as a digital download and the highest tier giving you everything they could think of, including a party with the InXile staff and every game they will publish for the next 10 years.
More information.

Vindicator March 1st, 2013 01:07

I'll take the limited edition boxed version with a cloth map… only $95 for early birds. :)
Does anyone know when this Kickstarter begins?

gozioso March 1st, 2013 02:33

I'm not a big fan of Kickstarter inflation. Wasteland 2 was only $15 for a digital copy, but this game is $25??!!

Drithius March 1st, 2013 04:02

Not a fan of the arbitrary limits put on the hardcopy tiers. If I don't luck out on a hardcopy, I'll be pledging the minimum. I hate digital.

Vindicator March 1st, 2013 05:14

Yes, the game tiers are overpriced and the artificial limits and tier rewards are odd.
Why would anyone pay $95-$110 for a boxed LE with cloth map, when you can get a digital-only download and the privilege of describing an in-game item for only $350? Maybe it's just me, but for that price, I'd want a signed box and map to go along with it.

Nevertheless, rpgs like this aren’t mainstream games anymore. The original Torment, despite being one of the top crpgs of all time, didn’t sell very well (probably due to the grim cover art). So, smile when you bend over and cough up the dough.

jwmeep March 1st, 2013 06:47

90+ for a box is overdoing it too. If it was closer to the price of a retail box copy (like wasteland 2) I'd happily go for it.

Well, I'm not sold on this idea to begin with. I really would prefer Wasteland 2 be finished before pledging to InXile again. I realize it's just a cash grab… nah let me be more specific, I realize everybody who was doing concept and pre-production for Wasteland 2 probably has nothing to do while the W2 is production stages, and Brian has to pay these guys to be doing something, (and have money to pay them with). Still I've already given InExile money for lofty promises. I'd prefer they put something out before I give them more. The combat video is promising, but not substantial enough to justify the donating yet. In addition to that it sounds like the designer is shooting for an Infinity Engine style game which Project Eternity has covered. And he's leaning towards real time combat with pause (I know it's a matter of preference, but my preference leans towards turn-based.)

Oh well, I'll play it by ear when the campaign comes out, but as much as I like the idea of the setting, what I've seen in the press so far isn't reassuring. Granted I wasn't too sure about Wasteland 2, till they started saying the right things, and hiring back guys who made the first game.

I'll give Fargo this. The guy can market. My personal favorite is him talking in video interviews about how he thinks turn based combat is best for RPGs, but when asked about the combat for Torment he goes "Oh I'll let Colin answer that one". That way he can still save face with those who prefer turn based combat, and use Colin to appeal to guys who want real time combat with pause, and a more Infinity Engine type experience.

Roq March 1st, 2013 11:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by gozioso (Post 1061186399)
I'm not a big fan of Kickstarter inflation. Wasteland 2 was only $15 for a digital copy, but this game is $25??!!

IMOP the $25 tier for licence is pitched at the right level: Most people (I reckon) pledge because they want to support and follow the development of the types of game they want to play. Certainly I do. And the only valuable thing a developer has to give away is a future licence for the game (the rest is fluff), so it makes sense to pitch the licence at a level people are prepared to pay. Likely they'll make more on the $10 difference than they will lose from those not prepared to pay the extra. The result of them getting more cash could be, all other things being equal, a better game, in the long run.

Another thing to consider is that if we are going to have game designers make niche games that don't necessarily have mass market appeal, they have to have some combination of a lower budget and a higher price to be viable.

Roq March 1st, 2013 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwmeep (Post 1061186426)
I'll give Fargo this. The guy can market. My personal favorite is him talking in video interviews about how he thinks turn based combat is best for RPGs, but when asked about the combat for Torment he goes "Oh I'll let Colin answer that one". That way he can still save face with those who prefer turn based combat, and use Colin to appeal to guys who want real time combat with pause, and a more Infinity Engine type experience.

I enjoy both play styles, but the devil is in the detail. And if they were being cynical, they could have just changed the W2 rangers to dark elves or whatever and glossed over the artwork and story a bit. So the fact that they are planning a somewhat different type of game with TTON is encouraging from that angle.

Plus we need another decent game on KS. Most of the other stuff up now is dross. Need to stem the tide of cutesy adventure and action "RPG"s.

Sacred_Path March 1st, 2013 12:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roq (Post 1061186448)
The result of them getting more cash could be, all other things being equal, a better game, in the long run.

Too much faith and not enough information.

I'd like to see WL2 come out, play that and build an opinion before I pledge for another game. That said I suspect they will open a paypal option after the kickstarter as they did for WL2, and the 25$ tier is unlimited so you can wait for them to put forth more information (gameplay videos, screenshots etc.)

joxer March 1st, 2013 13:57

I only want things digital and in all cases I was in I've pledged on the highest digital possible tier. I really don't care for cloths, rags and other rubbish (would be nice to have stuff like the witcher medallion though), but 15 or 25 $ is all the same to me.

Whenever the campaign on this game starts, I'm in.

wolfing March 1st, 2013 15:04

this hit the magical $20 threshold in which I decide to not think too much about it. If they have an 'early buyer' tier for $15-$20 I'll get it. If there isn't one, or I can't get it, then the $25 means 'wait and see' which usually translates in 'too many games to play right now, I'll buy it when there is a Steam sale for $10'.

SpoonFULL March 1st, 2013 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfing (Post 1061186474)
this hit the magical $20 threshold in which I decide to not think too much about it. If they have an 'early buyer' tier for $15-$20 I'll get it. If there isn't one, or I can't get it, then the $25 means 'wait and see' which usually translates in 'too many games to play right now, I'll buy it when there is a Steam sale for $10'.

Same here. In addition to the backlog, I am sure that there will be more games coming later in the year that I want to play at a similar or lower price, which further increases my backlog!

One thing that I am almost certain that I will be backing (for PC's sake) is Arma 3 which the alpha will be hitting on Monday on Steam. They are offereing the alpha and beta at a reduced cost now, which will also give you the full game when released later in the year. This is a pure PC map editor and mod friendly heaven (with dedicated servers).

Oh, there you go, just read a new article on RPS on the new Space Hulk game coming this year! ooh by baaack looog!

gozioso March 1st, 2013 18:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roq (Post 1061186448)
IMOP the $25 tier for licence is pitched at the right level: Most people (I reckon) pledge because they want to support and follow the development of the types of game they want to play. Certainly I do. And the only valuable thing a developer has to give away is a future licence for the game (the rest is fluff), so it makes sense to pitch the licence at a level people are prepared to pay. Likely they'll make more on the $10 difference than they will lose from those not prepared to pay the extra. The result of them getting more cash could be, all other things being equal, a better game, in the long run.

Another thing to consider is that if we are going to have game designers make niche games that don't necessarily have mass market appeal, they have to have some combination of a lower budget and a higher price to be viable.

$10 is certainly trivial, but I already have a massive backlog of games (plus 7 Kickstarter games that I have yet to see released), so I don't feel particularly obligated to back this one. Like one of the other posters said, I would prefer Wasteland 2 to be released prior to this new Kickstarter. To be honest, Steam has really changed the way I think about game pricing. For $25, I can buy 3 or more good games during one of their big sales.

Caidh March 1st, 2013 18:53

I really am looking forward to Wasteland 2 and if that game comes out and meets or exceeds my expectations, I'd be more than happy enough to contribute to more inXile games. Now though? I'd rather wait and see. I don't want to fund a second of their games before getting the first.

Its just too premature in my opinion.

Asdraguuhl March 1st, 2013 19:15

I think that choosing 25$ as their lowest tier is from financial point of view a good decision. Half of the backers tend to be at the lowest tiers but despite their numbers, the major contribution of funds come from the mid-level tiers. "Sacrificing" those who only wish to "pre-order" at the lowest possible tier will IMO have little to no negative effect as they are not the main financial contributors anway.

What I don't understand is the limit on physical copies. Looking at P:E and WL2, there were many more pledgers who chose physical copies than these limits allow. Although I suspect that this is simply a tactic to get the hardcore crowd to pledge quickly in order to get a substantial boost during the first day. I wouldn't be surprised if they would increase that limit during the campaign.

This game does seem very attractive to me so I would certainly want it to succeed but somehow I fear that this KS will lack the same drive that WL2 or P:E had.

Kobu March 1st, 2013 19:50

As someone who has spent a lot of money on Kickstarters this last year, these lower tiers do nothing for me. Too high priced with too little benefit. I can wait while playing all the other games I've funded or otherwise have picked up and just download this later for less than $25.

crpgnut March 1st, 2013 19:56

I didn't finish the first Torment book, so I definitely won't pre-purchase the next. I didn't kickstart Wasteland 2 either though, since I'm not a big believer in Fargo. Time will tell if I was wrong, but my money stays safe until then ;)

jwmeep March 1st, 2013 19:58

https://torment.uservoice.com/forums…601-boxed-game

Quote:

We’re are planning to have a Collector’s Edition physical version. We may have another big box version, but are not planning to have a tier for it. If we have one, it would be available either as an add-on or through a separate online store after the project is funded.

A primary reason for this decision is that for Wasteland 2, we found the cost to the funds for the entry level box to be detrimental to funding the development. That is, the funds raised shown on Kickstarter is deceptive relative to the fund we have for the game. But if we instead provide the box through an online store after the game is funded, then we can be assured we have enough development resources, but can still make the box available to backers.
Not liking this. Not liking this at all. I understand it's probably a cost issue, but implying that you can only get a boxed after the game is funded doesn't seem to encourage backing. If someone wants a boxed copy, why should they back the project? It would seem to be in their interest not to become a backer. Pay $25 bucks for a promise of a digital copy, and then pay even more, through a separate system just to get a box? What if they want to back the kickstarter, and get a box, but don't want the $95 rewards? Aren't you guaranteeing someone won't pledge for the kickstarter since it's in their best interest to wait until after the kickstarter is funded? Doesn't that take away money that could be used for funding?

Vindicator March 1st, 2013 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwmeep (Post 1061186508)
If someone wants a boxed copy, why should they back the project? It would seem to be in their interest not to become a backer. Pay $25 bucks for a promise of a digital copy, and then pay even more, through a separate system just to get a box?

If it costs $15 each to produce 10K boxes, manuals and maps, it probably would't cost half that much for 50K units. My point is, that everyone above the lowest tier should get a boxed copy and a DL. Not only does it lower production costs due to higher quantity, but it makes for happier customers. The real killer is the shipping… I think everyone can understand the need not to let the shipping costs eat into your development budget. So, I would charge a flat $10 extra for domestic shipping, or $20 for international. And why do they need so many reward tiers? KISS… $20 DL, $50 box, $100 CE, $250 signed CE, …

Maylander March 1st, 2013 21:34

There's really no doubt about whether or not I'll back this, and it's most likely going to be a mid-to-high tier as well. There's just too much potential present for me not to.


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