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-   -   Richard Garriott - Most Game Designers Suck! (http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19814)

Myrthos March 20th, 2013 23:41

Richard Garriott - Most Game Designers Suck!
 
Richard Garriott was interviewed by PCGamer about game design and game designers in the industry where he used statements like:
Quote:

"I've met virtually no one…who I think is close to as good a game designer as I am."
"And every designer that I work with…I think, frankly, is lazy."
Fortunately this only applies to game designers Lord British actually met, so for those designers that have not met LB before you might still be good. However if you did meet him, you are lazy or suck… or both.
I'm sure he means to say it is just very hard to do well.
Besides that he also says some less controversial things.
Quote:

So how does a good game designer work? Garriott went on, explaining the design process which started back with that high school writing assignment. Using a “four-dimensional spreadsheet,” Garriott says he records every character, location, and item in a game and blends them into the whole.
“OK, here’s some magic items, have I distributed them around enough?” Garriott asked himself, miming his process. “How do they migrate across the story? What is the journey of that item through the game?”
“I think it’s this discipline of how I break down storytelling—not just the story, but each region, each thread, each object, and I kind of do them all simultaneously. I kind of have a four-dimensional spreadsheet in this sense, even before there were ‘spreadsheets,’ that’s how I broke them down in the beginning.
More information.

SpoonFULL March 20th, 2013 23:41

Someone maybe should come down to earth (they still think they are in space!).

These claims also remind me of Ken Rolsten and Peter Molynex, with the former's latest work being a single player MMO (ooops isn't that what his highness is trying to do as well!).

HiddenX March 21st, 2013 00:08

Warren Spector, John Romero, Chris Roberts … worked for Origin some time ago. And this cocky, self-important, big headed Mr. Garriot says he never met good game designers.

His best time is long gone….

Dajjer March 21st, 2013 00:40

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

I really liked many of the Ultima games. I got Utima 4 when it came out and sang its praises just like everyone else. However, there is no Ultima game in my top 10 and there might only be one in my top 25.

I'm glad he's out there making games again - we need him. But pleeeezze. He aint all that.

JDR13 March 21st, 2013 00:47

Not sure if he actually meant to sound like that much of a douchebag, but he did a pretty good job of it.

Caidh March 21st, 2013 00:54

His hubris is excessive considering Ultima 8, 9, and Tabula Rasa

Couchpotato March 21st, 2013 00:59

Well Pride Before The Fall as the proverb goes. He was good once upon a time but not now. I have played many games better than what he creates now.

CelticFrost March 21st, 2013 01:03

I have been going back and forth on what I thought about this new game and should I help with the kickstart. After reading I so glad I haven't and won't be sending a cent to him and his team. They can try and build all the best of every world into one game if he is that great…but unless I read reviews on this site once it comes out I have zero interest now…What an asshole…

Fantasm March 21st, 2013 01:50

Before we all pile on, I think there is some truth in the underlying point that he expands upon:

Quote:

“If you like games, you eventually get to the point where you’d like to make one,” said Garriott. “But if you had this magic art talent as a youth, you can refine your skills and show a portfolio and say, ‘I’m a good artist, go hire me’ If you’re nerdy enough to hack into a computer, programming on your own, you can go to school and learn proper structure, make code samples and go ‘Look, I’m a good programmer, hire me.’

“But if you’re not a good artist and not a good programmer, but you still like games, you become a designer, if you follow me. You get into Q&A and often design.

“And the most valuable part of creating a game is the design, which the programmers are technically executing. And they’d be happy to just execute some of them. But in my mind, most artists and programmers are just as much of gamers as the designers, and I usually find in my history that the artists and programmers are, in fact, as good of designers as the designers. They’re often better, because they understand the technology or the art.

“So we’re leaning on a lot of designers who get that job because they’re not qualified for the other jobs, rather than that they are really strongly qualified as a designer. It’s really hard to go to school to be a good designer.”
In general, I really don't find a whole lot that I disagree with in this assessment…

Vindicator March 21st, 2013 01:50

Richard Garriott feels that his signature on the SotA map is worth an extra $200… and at least 46 people agree. As I've said before, it's amazing Richard's ego can fit inside Britannia Manor. Nevertheless, unlike some other game designers who shall remain nameless (e.g. D.S. & J.R.), Richard's ballooned bobblehead is full of more than hot air.

rune_74 March 21st, 2013 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by HiddenX (Post 1061189133)
Warren Spector, John Romero, Chris Roberts … worked for Origin some time ago. And this cocky, self-important, big headed Mr. Garriot says he never met good game designers.

His best time is long gone….

You may want to read the actual interview before jumping to conclusions or you look like an ass.

He mentions a few who worked with him. It's amazing that you didn't read it at all.

Drithius March 21st, 2013 02:04

It's not that bad an article, though the writer suffers from a bout of hero worship. Many game designers *do* rise up from the Q/A department which, in itself, isn't a problem, but the lack of cohesive training on what makes for good design is.

Regardless, Garriot busting out his computer punch cards and High School English project is getting old and tired. I've gone ahead and canceled my minimalistic $30 pledge, not because of this article but my diminishing faith in what the Kickstarter project is looking to create.

rune_74 March 21st, 2013 02:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoonFULL (Post 1061189128)
Someone maybe should come down to earth (they still think they are in space!).

These claims also remind me of Ken Rolsten and Peter Molynex, with the former's latest work being a single player MMO (ooops isn't that what his highness is trying to do as well!).

You hate it so much that you backed it?

SpoonFULL March 21st, 2013 02:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by rune_74 (Post 1061189166)
You hate it so much that you backed it?

Backed it with the minimum so that I can ask questions about the story, companions, choices and consequences, and how populated is the world in the so called single player offline mode in the forum. As you are very aware, there isn't much detail on single player mode on the main project page.

Bound to cancel this minimum pledge as it's not going to give me anything.

Now seriously rune, I hope that you are getting paid by this project for your relentless efforts.

rune_74 March 21st, 2013 02:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoonFULL (Post 1061189169)
Backed it with the minimum so that I can ask questions about the story, companions, choices and consequences, and how populated is the world in the so called single player offline mode in the forum. As you are very aware, there isn't much detail on single player mode on the main project page.

Bound to cancel this minimum pledge as it's not going to give me anything.

Now seriously rune, I hope that you are getting paid by this project for your relentless efforts.


Ahh so you will get your trolls worth…

SpoonFULL March 21st, 2013 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by rune_74 (Post 1061189170)
Ahh so you will get your trolls worth…

Replied to your inquiry thinking I was talking to a decent person. But what else where you going to say - what a waste.

rune_74 March 21st, 2013 02:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoonFULL (Post 1061189171)
Replied to your inquiry thinking I was talking to a decent person. But what else where you going to say - what a waste.

Dude you have been ignoring everything said so far, how much more do you want me to type on a subject you obviously don't want to believe.

Vindicator March 21st, 2013 02:45

All hail Lord British, the court jester who would be king… a legend in his own mind.
Well, that’s not fair… after all, he is an astronaut. But at this point, it wouldn’t surprise me if Richard digs a moat around a patch of dirt and calls it Britannia, declares himself king and secedes from the United States.

Before we get too carried away with ripping Richard for his royal-sized ego, let’s remember, he’s not all that bad. Lord British used to open his castle to his fans during Halloween, spending a small fortune to turn it into a haunted house. If only he had that money now, he wouldn’t need this Kickstarter.

Ok, in spite of Richard’s arrogant comments, I’m still a fan… and Ultima 7 is still my favorite game of all time.

joxer March 21st, 2013 02:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpoonFULL (Post 1061189171)
Replied to your inquiry thinking I was talking to a decent person. But what else where you going to say - what a waste.

There is a great book/movie… Named:
The girl who kicked hornet's nest.

So lemme take the cross from you, willya… ;)

I remember a certain game named Ascension everyone called back then: Bugscension.
Hell because of Skyrim, I've forgot completely what a disappoinment that Ultima was. Regarding the amount of bugs. Did anyone compare the number of bugs here and there?

I'm aware that polishing the game is not a game design. But then again, you can't just spit on others without looking yourself in the mirror first. Insulting other game designers is not something I could ever respect. Sorry.

rune_74 March 21st, 2013 02:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by joxer (Post 1061189175)
There is a great book/movie… Named:
The girl who kicked hornet's nest.

So lemme take the cross from you, willya… ;)

I remember a certain game named Ascension everyone called back then: Bugscension.
Hell because of Skyrim, I've forgot completely what a disappoinment that Ultima was. Regarding the amount of bugs. Did anyone compare the number of bugs here and there?

You honestly added another forum entry about the bugs in Skyrim, wow.


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