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-   -   Are we in a new RPG Golden Age? (http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21283)

Dajjer July 26th, 2013 07:01

Are we in a new RPG Golden Age?
 
Mars came out of nowhere a few weeks ago, Legend of Dawn out last week. Shadow Run this week and with Consortium, Divinity, Wasteland and Southpark due shortly not to mention a ton of others I have left off, it is just wonderous.

I'm going to have to go back to my old habits in the 90's when I had to be more selective in my gaming dollars and time. Well I'm older now so maybe just time selective.

bjon045 July 26th, 2013 08:57

New RoA remake in a few weeks. If half of these games deliver it will certainly be the start of the 3rd golden age of the crpg.

Maylander July 26th, 2013 09:15

I'm mostly impressed by what's coming in 2014. It's going to be massive. I can't remember the last time I had so many potentially good RPGs on my radar.

joxer July 26th, 2013 10:34

Dunno about the genre but…

We're in golden age of dumbs and dumbers.
Millions of phonegames are released on daily basis, there are more DLC released than games, almost all f2p MMOs are in fact p2w - and each of those things gets sold numerous times like a "cure". Y'know, those advertised vitamins, minerals and whatnot everyone's buying and using although noone needs 'em.

DArtagnan July 26th, 2013 10:41

Well, as much as I'm not entirely comfortable with it - I sort of agree with Joxer.

At least, I'm not at all impressed by these KS games so far, and Shadowrun is definitely not part of any golden age I can detect. It's really a somewhat trivial little game (albeit with a fantastic setting) - but it's great for casual gamers looking to see what RPGs might once have looked like, a little. It's one of the most barebones RPGs I've ever played - and that's saying something.

It really does look like most games are aimed at the "phone-people" - and I can but wonder what people are so excited about.

I'm looking forward to Divinity and Wasteland 2 (and others) - but I'm still waiting for a Kickstarter launch that matches the insane hype surrounding it.

Yme July 26th, 2013 11:10

We wouldn't know until the games come out now would we? There is no guaranty they turn out good. That being said, we do have a lot to look forward to. Could be some exciting times ahead.

Couchpotato July 26th, 2013 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yme (Post 1061209566)
We wouldn't know until the games come out now would we? There is no guaranty they turn out good. That being said, we do have a lot to look forward to. Could be some exciting times ahead.

Ignore the two downers Yme.:ignore: I never expected kickstarter games to compete with publisher funded games anyway. Money does matter, but I still had fun with the ones I backed.

So bring on 2014 with the usual published RPG's and kickstarters. I can't wait.:salute:

wolfing July 26th, 2013 13:31

we already started a new Golden Age of RPGs, we're just in the beginning days.

Menigal July 26th, 2013 15:23

Nope, not at the moment.

If enough indie RPGs do well enough for people to expand further into the non-mainstream market then it could become one. We'll have to wait a few years to see how the ones being developed work out.

Ihaterpg July 26th, 2013 22:06

That's obviously a special time for CRPG, mainly from kickstarters that already generated (if most projects are achieved) something without any equivalent in the whole history of CRPG.

But for me more than CRPG it's the even more clear come back to turn based games. I consider it even more huge, not limited to kickstarters blow, and spreading and even more unexpected and surprising. So I'd say it's probably more the Turn based CG golden age currently growing and CRPG kickstarters are just a part of it.

ManWhoJaped July 26th, 2013 22:13

WL 2 is gonna be great but not too sure about anything else. Even the nex InXile project already seems like a letdown.

Dajjer July 26th, 2013 23:05

I guess I have a different take on this golden age than some here.

For me the golden age in the early 80s and then the 90s was not so much about the great games but about all the choices. Everybody remembers Might and Magic, Wizardry and the Utima games but there were a ton of other RPGs that game out in that same era. Anyone remember the Phantasy series?

I get it how some folks don't like the Kickstarter template but to just say there's nothing there is nonsense. When Might and Magic 1 first came out I was huckstering it with Jon C. at my Apple computer club. Who knew at the time that some 25 years later there would be a number 10 in the series.

I see some of these Kickstarter CRPG projects evolving to AAA game down the line if they just have a modicum of success.

Lucky Day July 26th, 2013 23:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by joxer (Post 1061209562)
Dunno about the genre butů

We're in golden age of dumbs and dumbers.
Millions of phonegames are released on daily basis…

One million and counting. I'll send you a review when mine is available.

Carnifex July 26th, 2013 23:55

Phantasy series, gold box games, Wizardry, and a couple of the Ultimas' as well as BaK and FO 1-2 hold my fondest crpg memories. One day I hope to see their kind return.



-Carn

wolfing July 27th, 2013 00:55

there were more, like lands of lore, eye of the beholder, something candle, the bard tales, there were also D&D games like Ravenloft and the desert one that I'm not sure if they're considered 'gold box'… So to me it's more about having lots of different games to choose from, more than having one or two very awesome games.

Scrav July 27th, 2013 06:10

Until a Kickstarter rpg delivers, there is no sign of any golden age. Shadowrun should be a wake up to reality and provide more caution to future kickstarter investors.

GhanBuriGhan July 27th, 2013 07:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrav (Post 1061209718)
Until a Kickstarter rpg delivers, there is no sign of any golden age. Shadowrun should be a wake up to reality and provide more caution to future kickstarter investors.

What does "deliver" mean for you? That it's as good or better than your favourits from the last decades? Yeah, that is unlikely.
For me Conquistadors already delivered I'd say. And Shadowrun - I only started But I see a fun short game that is a bit underwheming - but I also get another campaign, an Editor and Access to community created Content, all for $15 or whatever I pledged for it.
But yeah, People have to be somewhat realistic with what can be achieved with the Budget (and in most cases that also means budget = time constraints) that KS can provide to developers. Like Dajjer I do thoroughly enjoy seeing how the projets try out new ideas, revive old ones, mix and match into something new.
Sometimes I know how rune_74 must often feel on the Watch - a starry-eyed youth among grumbling old men ;)

greywolf00 July 27th, 2013 07:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhanBuriGhan (Post 1061209727)
What does "deliver" mean for you? That it's as good or better than your favourits from the last decades? Yeah, that is unlikely.

I think this is the key to a lot of the complaints about Kickstarter games. People seems to have massively inflated ideas about how much content will be delivered on such limited budgets. FTL has a lot of hours due to design, not due to content. RPGs cost so much more to develop than stuff like FPS, and Kickstarter projects are working on a fraction of what FPS are made with. I really don't think Kickstarter is capable of solely funding games with 40+ hours of gameplay that's oozing tons of reactivity, customization & depth.

I would love to see a side by side comparison of budgets of SR:R and BG 2 or KotoR. Even without adjusting for inflation, I think SR:R was working on a fraction of the resources. Comparisons next to something like Spiderweb or Eschalon would probably be better for budget size but the team size/cost and dev cycles are going to be very different.

As for a golden age, I think if you enjoy stuff like SR:R and you're willing to separate Kickstarter projects from AAA titles, and just compare them among themselves, the future looks promising.

Not saying it's impossible for something like Wasteland 2 to generally be thought of as better than Kingdoms of Amalur or another big budget title, just that it's going to be harder as they have to tightly focus their resources.

HiddenX July 27th, 2013 08:45

The New Golden Age -> wrong term IMHO - how about:

New Wave of kickstarted CRPGs.

It is really refreshing to see that old good concepts (turn based, C&C, party based,…) are mixed with new ideas, new Gfx and modern good concepts.

If a few of this wave get classics - great :party:

Scrav July 27th, 2013 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by GhanBuriGhan (Post 1061209727)
What does "deliver" mean for you? That it's as good or better than your favourits from the last decades? Yeah, that is unlikely.

I'm not after something better, just comparable. Good design decisions is the main thing I'm on the look out for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by greywolf00 (Post 1061209731)
I think this is the key to a lot of the complaints about Kickstarter games. People seems to have massively inflated ideas about how much content will be delivered on such limited budgets. FTL has a lot of hours due to design, not due to content. RPGs cost so much more to develop than stuff like FPS, and Kickstarter projects are working on a fraction of what FPS are made with. I really don't think Kickstarter is capable of solely funding games with 40+ hours of gameplay that's oozing tons of reactivity, customization & depth.

I'm not after quantity of content. I don't want a 40+ hour rpg with state of the art graphics. I'm happy with 10 hours. It's priced at quarter of the price of a local game in my region - I factor that in as well. I do expect a solid UI and compelling campaign. I don't think anyone is throwing money at kickstarter campaigns for a below average experience.


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