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December 20th, 2012, 09:42
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
It's really fairly simple, DArt. You Euros feel that government is a good thing. It provides for you and gives each and every citizen a kiss goodnight at bedtime and there is much rejoicing. We (or at least the targets of your derision, for whom I'm speaking) do not trust government and do not particularly like it. That radically alters one's views on what "free society" really means.
Oh, so you don't like your government? Do you know what the absence of government is called? That's anarchy. I'm not surprised that's what you'd prefer. I'm sure you don't appreciate your laws or your police force. I'm sure you don't enjoy walking down the street in the relative safety you've made possible through government, despite the gun fetish.

Nah, so typical that you'd enjoy the benefits of what you've been given while pretending you're still living in the wild west like some lonewolf cowboy who hates all the privileges.

Just another load of bullshit that has nothing to do with reality. Of course you like government in some form or another.

As for what we "Euros" like, I'm pretty sure it's very much the same thing. Nobody fully trusts the government - because you'd have to be a fool to trust people in power. But we need government to make civilization work until we're ready to do without it - which is very, very far into the future.

But you're right. I do like that people without means are taken care of, and I do like that we've managed to dispell the obscene myth of equal opportunity and realised that there can never be equal opportunity when you're dealing with human beings and systems created and enforced by human beings. We're quite ahead of you there.

Y'all are also using sloppy logic by painting all gun owners as the loose cannons you need them to be to justify your indignation. There are millions of gun owners out there that acquired their weapons legally, are trained in their use, maintain them properly, and properly respect their lethality. There's absolutely no justification to take weapons from those people. You're blindly casting an overly broad net, and treating anyone that doesn't agree like some sort of mouthbreather while completely ignoring all attempts to point out your flawed logic.
What are you talking about? What fantasy scenario is this where I'm painting all gun owners as loose cannons. Could you stick to something I've actually said - and let's dispense with your deranged tirades.

I've specifically said that those people need to make a sacrifice to get guns off the streets. It has nothing to do with justice - it has to do with saving lives, which is a lot more interesting than justice to me. I believe most people WOULD willingly give up the right to bear arms if they really believed it would help. Naturally, not everyone would do it - as there are always very selfish people around. But most would.

Allow me to demonstrate what you're really doing. Criminals use their penis to rape. There are plenty of impressive textbooks that claim that not only is that the tool, but also the justification in and of itself. Your response is that we should remove all penises from everyone.
That's pretty stupid, even coming from you. The difference between my penis and my gun, is that you can't take my penis and rape someone with it. That's on me.

Can you follow this distinction?

Yes, your proposal really is that stupid. Walk thru the logic—it's the exact same nonsense y'all are using to "prove" that guns should be taken away.
If your logic is what you're proposing as a smarter alternative, then I'd rather remain really, really stupid - thank you.
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