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December 28th, 2012, 17:52
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
(addressed a bit out of order):
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I like that Dark Souls does what it does well - but it's just not enough for me. Again, I guess you just really like combat - because no matter what you claim, that's basically all Dark Souls is.
Iīve already said that I like the game for its combat, level design, exploration and atmosphere.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
You don't seem to understand the concept of content gating.
It doesnīt matter whether the content in question is an area, a quest, or an item.
Level scaling that affects the existence of an item in the game world is a form of content gating. One item seems like a minor thing, but when this design is applied almost across the board it largely gates "bundles of content representing progress". I prefer when the item bundle is tied to exploration, not character level.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
It might suit you to own up to reality and just accept that Dark Souls have certain strengths and not certain other strengths. I mean, honestly, you're trying to paint a picture of Dark Souls like a game with a ton of story and lots of meaty NPC interaction. You're pulling all you can from the game that resembles what I'm looking for - and you're fully aware that those things won't suffice.
Iīve already said in response to your "narrow gameplay" comment that itīs "combat AND exploration" and in response to one about the gameīs qualities ("blast from the past with strong visuals and a great combat system") Iīve added "AND great level design, rewarding exploration, unique atmosphere", which is why I thought it would be obvious that the points Iīve made about story elements or puzzles werenīt supposed to paint them as something as major as combat.
I havenīt said "thereīs a crapload of puzzles, period". I described what I consider the gameīs puzzle elements too, so even if you disagree about some of the stuff being puzzle element, at least you knew what I was talking about.
Since you have barely played the game, I pointed out that NPCs have more to say than what youīve experienced. I didnīt say the game is filled with huge story arcs and Iīve given you an example of what I consider a mini story. I donīt care whether thatīll suffice for you or not.
Speaking of which,
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Let me guess, you don't get even get much of a story about the guy in question?
A small bit of background. No details on motivation.
Itīs just an NPC you crossed path with a few times. He had his own story, you got a glimpse of it. Some others give a bit more background or motivation, or you can infer such, but in general this game doesnīt spill all the beans in this regard (and itīs a part of what gives it a distinct character).
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Could you describe some of the puzzles? Because if there are actual puzzles or riddles - I might reconsider playing it.
"There are even few traditional ones" should tell you there probably isnīt much of what youīd consider "actual puzzles or riddles".
Spoiler

Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Ehm, why don't you think the puzzles in Skyrim fit organically into the gameworld? There are plenty of those.
They usually scream "puzzle time!", where something more complex would fit (Labyrinthian) there isnīt and, considering the overall volume of Skyrimīs content, "plenty" is a stretch, if I discount repetitive and arbitrary pillars and claws.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I believe I've already conceded that you find items, and I don't think mentioning that those items expand your arsenal changes anything. That's what items and spells do in RPGs.
In Dark Souls they do it to a more significant degree than in many other RPGs and none are level scaled.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Yes, you could strictly categorize a lot of things as a lot of things. But I think puzzle in quotation marks will suffice for anyone not stubbornly ignoring the facets of boss fights that resemble puzzle solving - if only partially. Looking at the wiki, the boss fights are not at all just regular fights - they seem to ALL have unique mechanics that you couldn't possible learn through playing normally until the encounter. So, you're not being truthful - or the wiki is a liar. Which is it?
The boss fights have unique mechanics and the encounters are unique largely because you meet them once per playthrough.
The other enemy types or groups also have unique mechanics and when you meet them for the first time you need to "learn" them too. Sometimes environments you have to fight them in make a difference too.
The principle of fighting normal enemies and bosses is the same.
You observe how they act and try to act accordingly. Sometimes you can use environments to your advantage.
The bosses tend to be more dangerous than normal enemies, thatīs what makes them bosses and, as I posted earlier, overcoming them boils down to tactics, common sense and good eye (mostly to catch their "tells" and such). You donīt need a special item, a special spell or pulling three levers hidden in shadows to defeat them. Some spells or weapons may make fighting them easier, just as fighting normal enemies.
Thatīs what my general impression of Dark Soulsī boss fights is.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Even with those events, I'm willing to bet they're rare and that story is, indeed, quite sparse. But you're not going to acknowledge that, are you?
Never claimed otherwise.
These events and NPCs are nevertheless an important part of the game and a major component of the atmosphere. Also, Iīve found Onion head or Solaire to be more memorable characters than any in, say, you guessed it, Skyrim.
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I'm not particularly impressed when a narrow design is executed well, because I care more about the overall experience - and I tend to be bored by narrow designs.
Yep, apparently youīre a quantity>quality guy .
Last edited by DeepO; December 28th, 2012 at 18:56.
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