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July 22nd, 2013, 15:43
Originally Posted by ManWhoJaped View Post
This is what's called "evidence" to explain how science works again.

If you actually read the article and read the citations which you obviously didn't you'd see that there's a strong correlation between this gene and violence, as well as a clear reason why that's the case. So yes we do know how it's affecting them and why. Repeat sequences control how much of a coded gene get expressed, so it lowers the amount of the protein produced. Can't get any simpler than that, especially since we already know what happens when you take drugs that have this same effect.
I haven't said we don't know a gene is affecting them - but that we don't know what other factors are involved, and we don't know why lots of people with that "condition" aren't behaving violently - and why lots of people are behaving violently without it.

You see, "normal" people can be aggressive and violent too - so what use is a single proposed factor among potentially millions? It's a tiny step towards a tiny measure of understanding - and that's all it is.

Until we can establish exactly what causes violence - and not just a single factor that correlates with violent people - it's pretty useless.

We don't know what to do about it, either.

You either believe in genetics and science or don't, you seem to want to pick and choose.
What? Are you saying that I must accept all your conclusions and theories as fact or none? Because that's pretty stupid.

I don't dispute they've found a "warrior gene" - I'm disputing what we can deduce from that discovery.

And yes it's accepted, if you read the page you won't find lots of criticism. There's no valid criticism, if there were it would be listed especially as it seems controversial to some people.
What?

Please point out where it says that murderers are born murderers. When you manage to find a "scientific" article that spouts the kind of bullshit you're spouting, I'll garantee a level of criticism that's quite significant in return.

You can repeat all you want but it's obvious you just don't know what you're talking about and can't be bothered to remedy your ignorance and just ignore any facts that you find inconvenient.
Again, this - by itself - makes no impression on me. But if you enjoy calling me ignorant over and over, I won't stand in your way. It's kinda amusing.

Of course there's more than one gene that causes behavior but we do know this affects behavior and exactly how. They have made mice with the faulty gene as well, guess how that turned out.
So, by establishing a correlation between that gene and violence - we know EXACTLY how it works and what it does?

Uhm, no.

In fact they've done that with loads of brain genes. We do know exactly how many brain genes work. The coding genes are simple to figure out, they have different levels of a protein or different forms of it, many of which we have known about already for 70+ years like with MAO. Just a minute ago you denied that completely. It's clear you just don't know about it and as such you should stop backpedalling and start reading, and consider changing your opinion to be the one that is in line with reality.
We don't exactly how much of anything works - but we do have some theories. About the brain, we're very far from knowing anything of much use in terms of how to modify and control behavior, except in extreme and damaging ways.

As far as what's fair or not, life is not fair, but no I don't think that punishing criminals is helpful, there's really no rehabilitating most of them either, unfortunately. Maybe drugs will help in the future but the picture is complicated enough that it's unlikely.
You're not answering my question.

Why are murderers "bad" or "evil" if they're born that way, and have no way to change it?
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