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Default The Nature and Origin of Human Rights

September 6th, 2009, 16:46
Originally Posted by Corwin View Post
I think Jimminy Cricket had a good answer: Always Let Your Conscience Be Your Guide!! Now, what is your conscience?
Corwin, don't be afraid to anger the people.
One step farther is to have a good conscience toward God.
Look at to the ten comandments. This covers all.

You don't have to believe in God, just follow the ten laws.

I call this civil libertareanism.

But don't take me wrong, I am a believer!
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September 6th, 2009, 17:40
Trouble is, the first three (or four, depending on who's counting) don't make much sense if you don't believe in God — and IMO what remains is insufficient as a basis either for public or private morality. For example, there's nothing in there prohibiting physical violence short of homicide.
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September 6th, 2009, 17:43
And the last two are thought crimes, as well.
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September 6th, 2009, 17:55
There's nothing wrong with "thought crimes" in systems of personal ethics codes of ethics you follow voluntarily, for whatever purpose. They're horrible in systems of public morality, naturally — once you start attempting to enforce them, anything can happen, and usually does.

In this case, I took it that the context we're speaking in is about personal ethics and as such things go, the Ten Commandments are perfectly serviceable as a basis for that anyway. Cf. the Ten Grave Precepts in Zen, which are specifically intended as personal ethics, the idea being that following them will make practice easier and better — they contain a number of "thought crimes" as well:

Affirm life; Do not kill
Be giving; Do not steal
Honor the body; Do not misuse sexuality
Manifest truth; Do not lie
Proceed clearly; Do not cloud the mind
See the perfection; Do not speak of others errors and faults
Realize self and other as one; Do not elevate the self and blame others
Give generously; Do not be withholding
Actualize harmony; Do not be angry
Experience the intimacy of things; Do not defile the Three Treasures
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September 6th, 2009, 18:12
The last two prohibits the invisible hand.

Mankind must put an end to war or war will put an end to mankind. - John F Kennedy
An eye for an eye, and soon the whole world is blind. - Mahatma Gandhi
The world is my country. To do good is my religion. My mind is my own church. This simple creed is all we need to enjoy peace on earth. - Thomas Paine
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September 6th, 2009, 18:13
The wheel in Buddhism:
1. Strive for knowledge (understand that everything is stuffering, desires is the source for suffering, reduce desire to reach nirvana, follow the wheel to reach this goal).
2. Control your thought, do not harm or tempt others. Expand thought and make it free from jealousy and unfriendliness.
3. Control your speech, do not curse or condemn. Speak friendly and do not lie.
4. Control your actions (do not kill (vegitarians), do not lie, do not steal, do not commit adultery, do not drink alcohol)
5. Pick the right profession, do not work with something that harm or tempt others. (Ahimsa = nonviolence)
6. Strive to do good
7. Consciousness, be aware of your body, your emotions, your senses and your consciousness. Learn.
8. Meditation/Concentration - Leads to wisdom

Mankind must put an end to war or war will put an end to mankind. - John F Kennedy
An eye for an eye, and soon the whole world is blind. - Mahatma Gandhi
The world is my country. To do good is my religion. My mind is my own church. This simple creed is all we need to enjoy peace on earth. - Thomas Paine
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September 6th, 2009, 21:20
The wheel in Buddhism:
1. Strive for knowledge (understand that everything is stuffering, desires is the source for suffering, reduce desire to reach nirvana, follow the wheel to reach this goal).
If you don't want anything, you will be happy?

2. Control your thought, do not harm or tempt others. Expand thought and make it free from jealousy and unfriendliness.
Your thoughts don't harm anyone, but your physical actions might.

3. Control your speech, do not curse or condemn. Speak friendly and do not lie.
Agreed. spoken word is powerful.

4. Control your actions (do not kill (vegitarians), do not lie, do not steal, do not commit adultery, do not drink alcohol)
Control your self and stay out of McDonalds. I geuss that is ok.
I think 2,3,&4 are covered by the Big Ten.

5. Pick the right profession, do not work with something that harm or tempt others. (Ahimsa = nonviolence)
Don't be a cop or a mafia capo?

6. Strive to do good
That should be the main focus for all people.

7. Consciousness, be aware of your body, your emotions, your senses and your consciousness. Learn.
Sorry, this sounds like just think about yourself.

8. Meditation/Concentration - Leads to wisdom
JemyJ, depends what is the focus there of as to where it leads.

But seriously, Respect to JemyJ, and all ideas. JemyJ is quite a thinker
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September 6th, 2009, 22:05
Originally Posted by old fool View Post
Your thoughts don't harm anyone, but your physical actions might.
But they will harm yourself — or that's what Buddhists teach, anyway. These are precepts, not commandments — nobody will punish you if you don't live by them. The idea is that keeping the precepts helps yourself as well as others.

5. Pick the right profession, do not work with something that harm or tempt others. (Ahimsa = nonviolence)
Don't be a cop or a mafia capo?
Close: don't be a butcher, soldier, cop, arms dealer, or dealer in intoxicants.

7. Consciousness, be aware of your body, your emotions, your senses and your consciousness. Learn.
Sorry, this sounds like just think about yourself.
Not the same at all. The opposite, in fact. This refers to "mindfulness," which is at the core of Taoist, Yogic, and Buddhist teaching: a practice that teaches you to be aware of what's going on in your mind and body at any given time. The theory is that you do harmful ("unskilful") things out of delusion; to do good ("skillful") things, you have to rid yourself of delusion and perceive both yourself and the world as it really is. Someone who is deluded (i.e., all of us, pretty much) will inevitably do harm out of anger, jealousy, greed, lust, ignorance, or thoughtlessness. The first step in freeing yourself of delusion is to become aware of it — to consciously note that, for example, you're angry, or sad, or depressed, or whatever. That done, it becomes possible to practice letting go of these delusions, and not letting them rule you.

8. Meditation/Concentration - Leads to wisdom
JemyJ, depends what is the focus there of as to where it leads.
Certainly. It's most definitely possible to get lost in meditation, to start chasing the shadows conjured up by your mind. I hear they can be quite fascinating.

But seriously, Respect to JemyJ, and all ideas. JemyJ is quite a thinker
Hey now, watch it — you don't want it to go to his head.
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September 6th, 2009, 22:45
Originally Posted by old fool View Post
But seriously, Respect to JemyJ, and all ideas. JemyJ is quite a thinker
They weren't my ideas really, but the core ethics in Buddhism. They are known as the "wheel", and they represent how a Buddhist should live their lives if they want to reach the ultimate goal (Nirvana). I am not a Buddhist myself.


Mankind must put an end to war or war will put an end to mankind. - John F Kennedy
An eye for an eye, and soon the whole world is blind. - Mahatma Gandhi
The world is my country. To do good is my religion. My mind is my own church. This simple creed is all we need to enjoy peace on earth. - Thomas Paine
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September 7th, 2009, 00:05
JemyM: He wasn't talking to you …



.
.
.
.
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He was talking to JemyJ
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September 7th, 2009, 00:46
Originally Posted by Pladio View Post
JemyM: He wasn't talking to you …

He was talking to JemyJ
Thus the old fool!

Please don't let an old fool stop you from posting in a great thread.
Sorry JemyM
Last edited by old fool; September 8th, 2009 at 18:16. Reason: I STOPPED THIS THREAD DEAD
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