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Default Thoughts on DA2 after completing it

March 22nd, 2011, 17:03
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
Completely agree. Varric has better talents, no doubt about it. Also, it's rather annoying that you can't get him until chapter 2 - I usually "set" my party long before that.
Chapter 2? What are you naming chapter 1? The introduction? Myself I got Varric before any other rogue ie long before Isabella and Sebastian. I also got him before Merrill, Fenris, Isabella and Anders. And Sebastian couldn't join before chapter 2. In fact I got Varric at beginning of chapter 1. It's why I wonder what you name chapter 2.

EDIT: Ok you mean Sebastian, I do agree it's boring you can't get it sooner.
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March 22nd, 2011, 17:08
Originally Posted by Benedict View Post
Sebastien was a massive letdown after the golem from DAO. Him and Aveline are really dull characters.
I haven't pick Aveline apart during first parts and during some events or personal quests but you interact a lot with her and myself I liked the picture, interesting and not at all dull.

EDIT: From my first play and without to have try Sebastian, in a rough order the most interesting characters was Merrill, Aveline, Varric, and Fenris, Isabella and Anders in the closing pack. Lol forgot Carver, but he is ok and fit the closing pack.
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March 22nd, 2011, 19:19
If you are roleplaying a "good" Merrill who does not use Blood Magic, then ironically her rivalry bonus is the best. Being her friend only benefits her BM abilities which you do not utilize at all if you don't follow the "Blood of the Fist" tree. I used Merril as Entropy/Spirit/Nature person and she still kicked ass. This is due to her bonus damage resistance, the upgraded armor she gets if you romance her, and the true awesomeness of the "Walking Bomb" & Spirit Bolt spells.

Isabella is the least useful as a companion. She dies way to easily and there is also a very serious bug related to her Friendship bonus.
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March 22nd, 2011, 19:32
Originally Posted by purpleblob View Post
Only one I lost was Isabela. Thought I had enough friendship with her, but she didn't come back with relics. Bitch.
This happened to me too and I'm not sure why. Do you have to romance her in order to get her back? In any case I agree with you. She's a…
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March 22nd, 2011, 20:09
Originally Posted by elkston View Post
If you are roleplaying a "good" Merrill who does not use Blood Magic, then ironically her rivalry bonus is the best. Being her friend only benefits her BM abilities which you do not utilize at all if you don't follow the "Blood of the Fist" tree. I used Merril as Entropy/Spirit/Nature person and she still kicked ass. This is due to her bonus damage resistance, the upgraded armor she gets if you romance her, and the true awesomeness of the "Walking Bomb" & Spirit Bolt spells.

Isabella is the least useful as a companion. She dies way to easily and there is also a very serious bug related to her Friendship bonus.
You can romance her and get the negative bonus? I noticed the armor change but not the stats change I forget compare. But also I had her at 100% friendship. Even if not roleplay and with the negative bonus, blood mage is certainly a good choice anyway. In fact blood mage for Hawke as first specialization to switch to cons upgrade instead of wiz is certainly a rather good build.

Dam I had forget the Isabella bug, crap seeing all those complain how weak she is have increased my wish to use her at next replay, something I had already in mind anyway. There's a manual fix for the bug alas I'm playing on Mac and use it will be a pain. the fix is quoted in the thread you link, it's the savegame editor of DAO working for DA2, be sure to get last version.
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March 22nd, 2011, 20:18
Originally Posted by joxer View Post
This happened to me too and I'm not sure why. Do you have to romance her in order to get her back? In any case I agree with you. She's a…
You don't need to romance her, but you need above 50% friendship/Rival and to do her quest first when the Aveline/Isabela confrontation happen.

Also, you can have "rival" romance, not just friendship ones.

And Isabela is good if you take threat reduction abilities and stealth "stuff". She's like all the Rogue mobs in my game now…whouahahah.
*Stealth*,
*move in the back of a high level enemies*,
*attack*
Massive Critical!
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March 22nd, 2011, 20:32
Wooo rival romance that's a concept, and a good idea. How do you go through Isabella bug?
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March 22nd, 2011, 21:26
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
Wooo rival romance that's a concept, and a good idea. How do you go through Isabella bug?
I haven't successfully make her friend enough to get it yet. Conflict of "personalities"… But the whole point of my second playthrough was to get her to 100% friendship and use her all the time in my party. Although, I didn't know about the bug when I decided that. Looks like it will be harder than I anticipated and I might go rival with her to avoid the bug…

As for the rival stuff, Merrill rival is the best conclusion to her quest, if you don't like what she become, don't be her friends. Logic!
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March 22nd, 2011, 21:42
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
As for the rival stuff, Merrill rival is the best conclusion to her quest, if you don't like what she become, don't be her friends. Logic!
Woo why this tendency to throw spoil for DA2? Is it because anyway the game is crap so it's not important to spoil it? I have zero clue about what you are mentioning, but well with Anders giving me a clue too, I suspect you just spoil me a mid surprise. For now I know Merrill is taking risk but I'm at her side ready to help, and she is sort of wife, and I'm faithful in her. Ha well bad ending are always the best ending so I won't lost all.

The multiple little quests bugs of chapter 3 and this awful bug with two companions is really terrible details, that should be fixed asap but will need month to be be fixed. I wonder if Mac saves are totally identical to PC saves.
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March 22nd, 2011, 22:42
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
Woo why this tendency to throw spoil for DA2? Is it because anyway the game is crap so it's not important to spoil it? I have zero clue about what you are mentioning, but well with Anders giving me a clue too, I suspect you just spoil me a mid surprise. For now I know Merrill is taking risk but I'm at her side ready to help, and she is sort of wife, and I'm faithful in her. Ha well bad ending are always the best ending so I won't lost all.

The multiple little quests bugs of chapter 3 and this awful bug with two companions is really terrible details, that should be fixed asap but will need month to be be fixed. I wonder if Mac saves are totally identical to PC saves.
I didn't spoil anything, I just said the best conclusion was rival Merrill (IMHO). And nothing in common with Anders. Although, I'm not sure how dependent that conclusion is on previous quest/dialog choices, I just know you need to be rival to have it…and Merrill is bugged for some too.

As for bugs, I have been lucky so far. Actually, I'm always lucky with BioWare games it would seems. I never get more then 1 or 2 minor ones.

As for fixes, the tech forums seems to have a lot of dev looking at it and filling bugs. Considering that current "atmosphere" for the game, releasing patches that fix stuff will help a lot and I think they know it. As for the save, I don't see why they wouldn't be the same (example: Mass Effect save are the same between the PC and XBox).
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March 23rd, 2011, 00:20
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
Hmm, did you go to the Arishok instead of helping her get the relic? I lost her when I did that.
I'm not sure what you mean. You can go talk to Arishok before you retrieve relics? In my 1st playthrough, I told Isabela that we will retrieve relics to return it to Arishok. She didn't like it at all, but she still came back to save my ass later. In my 2nd playthrough, I told Isabela that I will get relics back to save Isabela's ass from Castillon. She was really happy and that's when "Questioning belief" quest poped up but I couldn't finish it since Isabela grabed relic and never came back. I guess I was just wee bit short on friendship point there. Damn.


By the way, the savegame import thing actually does have an impact. For example, Alistair can not only be met as King Alistair, he can also be met as a drunkard in the Hanged Man if you picked Loghain and let Alistair live.
That's awesome :O

In my 1st playthrough, I imported my old game (Alistair is king, my Warden is a queen, killed Architect). When I met Alistair, he was making fun of my Warden saying "just because she killed Archdemon, doens't mean I'm scared of her". When I forgot to import game in my 2nd playthrough (used default setting; Alistair is king, warden killed archdemon, didn't play Awakening) Nathaniel didn't show up at all. So disappointed =\

Sebastien was a massive letdown after the golem from DAO. Him and Aveline are really dull characters.
I didn't find Aveline dull at all. I absolutely loved her. That quest where you try to get Aveline and Donnic together was absolutely hilarious.

About romance:

I did friendship romance with Anders and looked up youtube video for rival romance with Anders. Not much difference at the end. You just get few different dialogues. At least with Anders anyway. I just don't like getting on bad side of anyone (all except for Merrill). Even though Fenris hates mages guts (and I'm the one) and I supported/romanced Anders in all mage quests, I managed to get almost max friendship with Fenris. w00t. It's really about knowing their personality and picking right party combination to get max friendship points. For me, only time I took Fenris and Anders together was when I'm doing Merrill quests. I insult her outright, and both Anders and Fenris are happy.

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March 23rd, 2011, 08:14
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
I didn't spoil anything, I just said the best conclusion was rival Merrill (IMHO). And nothing in common with Anders. Although, I'm not sure how dependent that conclusion is on previous quest/dialog choices, I just know you need to be rival to have it…and Merrill is bugged for some too.

As for bugs, I have been lucky so far. Actually, I'm always lucky with BioWare games it would seems. I never get more then 1 or 2 minor ones.

As for fixes, the tech forums seems to have a lot of dev looking at it and filling bugs. Considering that current "atmosphere" for the game, releasing patches that fix stuff will help a lot and I think they know it. As for the save, I don't see why they wouldn't be the same (example: Mass Effect save are the same between the PC and XBox).
I quoted Anders because in game session before I read your post he said something about Merrill and
Spoiler – spoil
, despite she wasn't in the party (replaced by Anders who was a forced pick for the quest).

Yes says that Merrill rival is the best ending for her is an awful spoil for me, it means Merrill friend will end bad, that let her try achieve her goal will end bad, and so on. It's really an awful spoil but it's ok I totally understand it can slip through.

For the bugs, well I didn't quoted that many, in chapter 3 a series of quest end with a dialog chaining with another quest, and the series of quest keep unfinished in diary, and next quest seems not available apart if the location mentioned in the dialog is wrong, this quest isn't anywhere diary, map, so I suspect I got something broken and quite important. I also got a quest finished and concluded and still in active quests of the diary. But also the companion bugs for Isabella and Sebastian is a quite ugly bug.
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March 23rd, 2011, 10:19
Originally Posted by purpleblob View Post
I'm not sure what you mean. You can go talk to Arishok before you retrieve relics? In my 1st playthrough, I told Isabela that we will retrieve relics to return it to Arishok. She didn't like it at all, but she still came back to save my ass later. In my 2nd playthrough, I told Isabela that I will get relics back to save Isabela's ass from Castillon. She was really happy and that's when "Questioning belief" quest poped up but I couldn't finish it since Isabela grabed relic and never came back. I guess I was just wee bit short on friendship point there. Damn.
Well, you can decide if you want to go with Aveline straight to the Arishok to deal with the elven prisoner situation, or if you want to go with Isabela to get the relic. If you go with Aveline first, Isabela will vanish. Either that, or your friendship was too low I assume.

Originally Posted by purpleblob View Post
In my 1st playthrough, I imported my old game (Alistair is king, my Warden is a queen, killed Architect). When I met Alistair, he was making fun of my Warden saying "just because she killed Archdemon, doens't mean I'm scared of her". When I forgot to import game in my 2nd playthrough (used default setting; Alistair is king, warden killed archdemon, didn't play Awakening) Nathaniel didn't show up at all. So disappointed =\
That's certainly a bit meh. Seems importing is definitely the way to go then.
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March 23rd, 2011, 13:22
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
Yes says that Merrill rival is the best ending for her is an awful spoil for me, it means Merrill friend will end bad, that let her try achieve her goal will end bad, and so on. It's really an awful spoil but it's ok I totally understand it can slip through.
You misunderstood something, it's the best ending to me, not necessarily for her (doesn't mean it's a bad ending either).

Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
For the bugs, well I didn't quoted that many, in chapter 3 a series of quest end with a dialog chaining with another quest, and the series of quest keep unfinished in diary, and next quest seems not available apart if the location mentioned in the dialog is wrong, this quest isn't anywhere diary, map, so I suspect I got something broken and quite important. I also got a quest finished and concluded and still in active quests of the diary. But also the companion bugs for Isabella and Sebastian is a quite ugly bug.
The "Who need Rescuing?" in chapter 3 doesn't trigger (bug on all platform). That's like the only bug I have, because everybody have it…
Last edited by azarhal; March 23rd, 2011 at 16:34. Reason: edited more possible missunderstanding
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March 23rd, 2011, 15:50
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
You misunderstood something, it's the best ending to me, not necessarily for her.
… I hate bad endings … *makes a mental notice for the future*

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March 23rd, 2011, 20:44
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
…The "Who need Rescuing?" in chapter 3 doesn't trigger (bug on all platform). That's like the only bug I have, because everybody have it…
Mmm I still believed in this one, that exploring the area quoted would solve the quest anyway, no it's another that frustrated me a lot, but after to check it again it's ok, just the quest that doesn't show in diary:
Spoiler – SPOIL

I got another quest that seems closed and received the reward but the quest didn't switch to achieved tasks, it's the quest "rudimentary mission" in act 2. I also got a quest in chapter 1 despite I should not have it. Well ok for now it's not a lot and I failed yet notice quests really not working, it's more diary problem and bugs in consequences management. Perhaps "Who need Rescuing?" will be my first true bugged quest.
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March 23rd, 2011, 20:48
Originally Posted by Alrik Fassbauer View Post
… I hate bad endings … *makes a mental notice for the future*
I hate them too, but they are often quite good anyway. Perhaps the best trick would be a first false very bad ending, and then an unexpected but logical happy end. That remind me the total abuse of that made in FF4, at third time the trick was used I had already mildly stop believe in, and after I totally stop believe in any bad/sad event and you know why? I proved to be right up to end of game. What an awful example of abuse of a plot trick, still it's a game with good writing.
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March 23rd, 2011, 20:53
Yes, I understand what you mean - but for me it's … well, I'm rather … what's the word ? "straight" in terms of movie/game endings - and of "good vs. bad". I prefer clear sides, clear endings. It's just the way I am.

And that's exactly what made me so angry about Dragon Age Origins - espcially the Dwarven part.

I felt like being manipulated, like being tricked, like being meddled with by giving me choices that weren't clear to me.

And at that point I just stopped to play the whole game. I just hate being manipulated.

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March 24th, 2011, 08:35
You mean the Dwarf origins? Well yeah it's about manipulation for one, not really for the other. But in any cases that could be considered as the two best of the origins available. If it's just the dwarf part well I don't remember much the details at this moment.

The problem of choices available is something I understand and when you see the manipulation coming it can be frustrating. Yesterday I got this exact problem with Anders in DA2 and not have all the choices, but well I also don't know yet for what Anders manipulated me. But it's also satisfying that dialogs allowed make clear I agree help but that I know I was manipulated and didn't appreciate, plus at end I could anyway refuse.
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March 25th, 2011, 13:42
I loved the Dwarf Noble and Human Noble Origins. Sure, there aren't many choices right at the start, but you will get options related to the Origins later on, and I find them quite satisfying.

PS. I dislike Behlen with a passion.
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