|
Your continuous donations keep RPGWatch running!
RPGWatch Forums » Games » Gothic 3 » Gothic 3 Spoilers » Maxing with zero orc rep' quests.

Default Maxing with zero orc rep' quests.

July 4th, 2012, 16:39
To any G3 gamer interested.

I have been experimenting or messing about trying to achieve toward max reputation within different factions but to zero reputation with the orcs, also maxing chosen skills with the quests, lots of doubling-back and maxing the use of animal transposition - - hence the long play time currently of 300+ hours with no orc rep' gained and liberations primed but not executed.

To end the game for Innos or Beliar is conceptually wrong as to please one god will irate the other/s and will only continue the conflict. To destroy the divine artifacts is also wrong as it will irate one of the gods, Saturas says to "keep them safe". So to gain just one *orc rep'* point (which aligns to Beliar) is a failure to appease the gods, likewise to complete a mercenary rep' quest is to fail also, a fine single line through the game will permit audience with orc leaders while gaining 75% qualifying rep' per town yet without orc rep' except in Faring, siding with rebels aligns to Innos which will also irate Beliar.

Many gamers don't understand G3, i am not aware of anyone getting it right, myself included. To maintain a balance or solve the conflict you can only either: please all gods or not please any gods - or perhaps and most likely, please the associated god within the three kingdoms, Varant, Myrtana, or Nordmar as per the eternal wanderer lore - you have to interpret the meanings into the solution - the clues are there yet there is no correct and proper walkthrough available or explained for G3.

Link to download original complete "Eternal Wanderer" text file (with thanks to gaoneng)
http://gaoneng.googlepages.com/TheEternalWanderer.txt

After four full years with G3, I have failed to find the solution to the conflict (a similar tack on G1's chromanin) that is two PB games i've failed. The challenge was the ultimate experience of all the many game i've played.

I can vouch that PB are very responsive and listening devs, in a past discussion prior to G3, i mentioned to PB that chromanin is too hard because it is hidden and the clues are invisible to the intelligent gamer (via the sense of logic) the normal gamer would not even consider them and would ignore them. They gave strong hints that they would approach the chromanin equivalent again in G3. When i mentioned about:- Q:- 'when is a secret not a secret' A:- when it is known' - i went on to explain/suggest that a secret can be gradually introduced in a way that becomes known to the player that *there is a secret* without revealing it and from that point onward through the game you will now be aware of *the search* for the secret. I knew before G3 was released there would be a chromanin equivalent and to my delight PB did implement similar to what i had sugestested - yet i have failed to achieve within my own suggestion !!!

So unlike with the vagueness of G1 -> ("it's said they worshiped a god that gave them the power to transform into animals") PB made it more positive to the G3 player via the druids gradually releasing info via dialogue, that the power of Adanos is received via the druid stones (mentioned in old posts of mine).

You pray to Innos or Beliar at the shrines but there is no Adanos shrine, the equivalent is to transpose because you gradually learn via the highest divine knowledge of the druids that the power increases with each transformation to animals. Kill a beast say as a wolf and you immediately level-up, not as a human but as a beast, yet there are no stats shown for a transposed beast because it is actually NH himself- you would have to experiment to the max in an unknowing way (extremely time consuming). This was altered in one of the CP patches.

I would have the highest esteem for any gamer capable of solving the conflict of the gods, which is what both G1 and G3 is totally about.

So within this context, how you might equate the various 'patch-to-quests' differences is left to the imagination of the G3 gamer. Using no CP patch is probably the safest route to experimentation to max - the other patches might be questionable to effect the cancellation of an otherwise satisfactory and ultimate conclusion - no one knows and PB will not explain, though they did once say the game fulfills their concept intentions (which was long before any community patches)

Kind Regards from Wulf,
founder of the past 'Chromanin Seekers' user group.
Wulf is offline

Wulf

Wulf's Avatar
Inquisitor

#1

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-West England
Posts: 1,096

Default 

July 4th, 2012, 18:20
Thank you Wulf for highlighting this part of Gothic 3 that I totally missed. I spent more than 160 hours on it treating it as an open world rpg with tight, varied and interesting faction mechanics, which it is, but missed the god's alignment issue.

This makes me wonder: developers of rpgs like PB put a magnificent amount of effort (time, thought, mechanics, interaction, story .. etc.) on games like this, but is this effort matched by the amount of time that we spend on these games? My personal view is that I doubt it.

Another view that I have: developers like PB should not make a game every year or so to match the market at the expense of the magic and quality of their previous games.
SpoonFULL is offline

SpoonFULL

SpoonFULL's Avatar
Keeper of the Watch

#2

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1,159

Default 

July 11th, 2012, 10:38
That's a very interesting read.

So did you try all of the roads you suggest yourself: pleasing them all, pleasing none and pleasing the associated one within each of the kingdoms?
I never finished G3 completely, but don't you have to side with one of them eventually?

Exitus acta probat.
wiretripped is offline

wiretripped

wiretripped's Avatar
Machiavellian

#3

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Leuven, BE
Posts: 549

Default 

July 11th, 2012, 11:57
Yes you do. Wulf is simply a bit superstitious when it comes to games developed by Piranha Bytes.
Maylander is offline

Maylander

SasqWatch

#4

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bergen
Posts: 5,179
Send a message via MSN to Maylander

Default 

July 12th, 2012, 17:38
Re:- but don't you have to side with one of them eventually?

Theoretically there's a strong case for not having to, if NH has gained the trust of all factions but without orcs reputation then that is the conceptual status limit. From thereon It would be NH himself causing the aggression by being manipulated into thinking he has to choose for either Innos or Beliar.

I believe initial Ardea liberation to be a brain-wash ploy by PB to fool unsuspecting gamers to jump in with both feet and liberate as soon as possible, the consequence of which will make the gamer stop and think, only by conforming to a stricter role-play method can other desired C&C alternatives be tried and maybe achieved. A beautifully orchestrated RPG gaming method from PB.

Some current experimental objectives…

1. Not to responsibly kill any non-hostile orcs.

2. Not be directly responsible for killing any humans.

3. Gain legitimate hashishin reputation access to Ishtar.

4. Increase skills only available in Ishtar.

5. Not to open a locked temple which will release the undead.

6. Retain all artifacts both divine and ancient, have non destroyed or deceptively taken.

7. Obtain the focus stone, Rhobars staff, Zubens staff, etc'

8. Win the minimum qualifying trust level of all factions.

9. Maintain a zero orc reputation throughout the game.

10. Access via portal to the unknown lands remains conceptually plausible.

Still trying but ready to give up soon, have not found any definitive alternate consequences.
Wulf is offline

Wulf

Wulf's Avatar
Inquisitor

#5

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-West England
Posts: 1,096

Default 

July 13th, 2012, 14:19
Are you sure you're not reading slightly too much into things?

In either case, your objectives seem challenging. Let us know how it turns out.

Exitus acta probat.
wiretripped is offline

wiretripped

wiretripped's Avatar
Machiavellian

#6

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Leuven, BE
Posts: 549

Default 

July 13th, 2012, 16:32
Originally Posted by Wulf View Post
To destroy the divine artifacts is also wrong as it will irate one of the gods, Saturas says to "keep them safe".
But you know, what Saturas says after you destroy them and you go back to him?
Spoiler – What he says…
bkrueger is offline

bkrueger

Nothing to see here.

#7

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 787

Default 

July 13th, 2012, 17:44
The problem is that the god's stuff is so hidden int he background that you CAN play for 160 hours (as above) and not really realize it is there. Having subtle stuff in a game is great but there ought to be some major clues as to what is going on.
BillSeurer is offline

BillSeurer

BillSeurer's Avatar
Eternal Supreme Dictator

#8

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Minnesota, USA
Posts: 1,725

Default 

July 13th, 2012, 23:21
@wiretripped - i can personally assure you this is no fairy tale, i wouldn't be doing all this searching for nothing but you are right, time will tell the wiser. If i don't solve this thing on this final run-through, i doubt if anyone ever will.
……………………..
@bkrueger- Yes that is what Saturas mentions 'after' destroying the divine artifacts. My experiment is not to destroy them. Saturas suggests to meet Xardas (with the artifacts) then when asked by NH -> what would YOU do, Saturas replies "that is up to you - you are the decider"
……………………….
@BillSeurer - Re:- Having subtle stuff in a game is great but there ought to be some major clues as to what is going on.

I agree (to a limited degree) I remember insisting the point (as explained in OP) that any hand-holding would make the whole concept both obvious and in effect, pointless. Slight hints being progressively revealed in line with the storyline, nudges, clues, suggestive dialogue etc' yes - but *major* clues? - the game could not exist in that mode, the secret is at the heart of the game, to solve and find the solution by gamer intuition. The clues are there, a lot more obvious than in G1, yet some are not so obvious (or taken seriously enough) it seems.
……………………..
Xardas is the key, the pivotal point to the whole plot, he holds the solution.
Wulf is offline

Wulf

Wulf's Avatar
Inquisitor

#9

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-West England
Posts: 1,096

Default The end.

July 15th, 2012, 11:54
After many months, the experiments are over without any satisfactory conclusion. The game has been uninstalled for good.

PB gave us gaming excellence beyond our abilities to reason the correct path to follow to achieve an end to the conflict of the gods.

In G1, Xardas is influenced by Beliar, even the books say "and he left the world to Adanos and was content" but there is no reference to Xardas being influenced by another god (other than the satisfaction of knowing Innos and Adanos are themselves contented) which suggests not to advance further into necromancer alignment.

In G3, We learn Xardas is influenced and aligned to two gods, his alignment to Beliar being feigned or pretentious, gamers can only theoretically imagine which is the other god.

In both games, the concept remains the same - that Xardas will only reveal more info only if Beliars two blood brothers are themselves at ease and contented.

It is better to have tried and failed than never tried at all.

Thank you for reading
Wulf is offline

Wulf

Wulf's Avatar
Inquisitor

#10

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: North-West England
Posts: 1,096
RPGWatch Forums » Games » Gothic 3 » Gothic 3 Spoilers » Maxing with zero orc rep' quests.
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT +2. The time now is 12:19.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright by RPGWatch