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Default Dark Souls II - No Easy Mode Allowed

April 18th, 2013, 20:56
Well put TheMadGamer!
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April 18th, 2013, 20:59
Originally Posted by TimtheTaxMan View Post
But I also don't live in my mom's basement and have all day to master a video game either.
Yet you evidently have all day to argue about this…
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April 18th, 2013, 21:03
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Yet you evidently have all day to argue about this…
Some of us are grownups and can multitask at work.
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April 18th, 2013, 21:05
Sometimes they bury themselves and the weight of their arguments
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April 18th, 2013, 21:08
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Yet you evidently have all day to argue about this…
The irony is that this is coming from a guy with 15,000+ posts on one internet forum over a 7 year period. I don't see how that's likely UNLESS you live in your parent's basement.
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April 18th, 2013, 21:09
Well, I only have 10500 posts - so does that mean I can have a room at ground level now?
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April 18th, 2013, 21:12
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Since I'm not living in my mom's basement - I obviously can't invest myself during all those hours I spend playing games.

I do have the hours - but I don't have the "investment" energy.

Or something.
I'll just let this one linger a while.


edit: Ok, mini walkthru! I'm gonna help you guys! First thing any player crossing from noob to noob+1 is to get the Drake Sword! Youtube it.

Method1:
☺Start with master key, be a Bandit.
☺Get the Gold Pine Resin from the box in the locked room you find before you head up to the Taurus Demon (which you can easily beat with drop attacks like the intro boss!)
☺Run up to dragon and either throw a knife at him or stand near the wall and wait until he drops down
☺Use the pine resin to enchant lightning damage into your weapon which you'll use 2 handed.
☺Attack the dragons tail 2 or 3 times with power attacks.

Method2
☺Shoot the tail with a bow/crossbow. (wiki where to find one. Theres a light crossbow close by, and a skilled player can get the compound bow from new londo ruins)

Once you have this sword (requires 16 str and 12 dex, I think) you'll smash through the first half of the game.

When you get to sens fortress get the lightning spear! (wiki it!)
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April 18th, 2013, 21:16
Originally Posted by gozioso View Post
The irony is that this is coming from a guy with 15,000+ posts on one internet forum over a 7 year period. I don't see how that's likely UNLESS you live in your parent's basement.

Why don't you average that out? Unless it's too difficult for a misanthrope such as yourself.
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April 18th, 2013, 21:28
To those complaining about the difficulty. You are missing the point entirely.

Myself, I spent around 100h or so the first time I played it. That the game is hard (initially at least), however, is what often made me wander about the gameworld, exploring new regions, and invest myself in the lore - all while thinking about how to pass that obstacle or beat that one guy. The diifficulty pulled me into the game.

What causes people to keep playing, even though they die time upon time against certain bosses is the feeling of achievement when you finally beat its many challenges. This is fundamental to the design of the game and so is therefore the difficulty. Remove that, and you could burn through the game in half a day. You literally could (and I'm obviously not talking about speed runs here), cause it isn't really that long if you count only the places you need to visit. That, however, would cause you to miss out on a lot of content, but more importantly, it would make the game boring as hell. It would. You would play through, wonder what the hell was so special about that and throw it away.

Look at it like this, you can play the game without even realising there is a story - alot of people have done that. So why didn't they stop playing, why did they play through? Because the game offers a genuine challenge and an incredible feeling of reward to go with it. That is the core of the game.

Besides, as others have noted, it isn't even that hard. The key is knowledge. Knowing how to control your guy efficently, knowing enemies. Try a second playthrough and you will wonder why the hell you died so many times in the Undead Burg.

And about reflexes. You strictly speaking do not really need fast reflexes. Most fights are pretty slow. Some enemies and bosses are pretty fast, sure, but often you can avoid the need of quick reflexes by simply playing around with different weapons, different types of armour, and different playstyles to tie this together.
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April 18th, 2013, 21:35
I'm very happy that they seem to be sticking to the dark souls formula with the next game. I don't have time to play many games nowadays, the few I do play I invest myself into though and Dark Souls was one of those games that was worth spending my budgeted time on.

Gotto love designers who stick to their ideas and don't alter their visions becuase of money. Rare these days.
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April 18th, 2013, 21:47
I have to try this out. Darn DVD player…
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April 18th, 2013, 22:02
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
I have to try this out. Darn DVD player…
You should join the rest of us here in 2013.
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April 19th, 2013, 00:06
Originally Posted by dpc76 View Post
When I do play a game, I like to feel like I'm accomplishing something. If it takes me an hour to get past a boss battle (especially if I only have an hour to play), I lose interest very quick.
This comment makes absolutely no sense. Surely after taking an hour to get past a boss is the biggest accomplishment of all? That's what makes this game so special and unique. The game rewards patience, you can't go in button mashing and expect to survive.

After playing Assassins Creed, Skyrim and Dragons Dogma where there is no punishment for death, this game is a breath of fresh air. There is no other game out there that makes you feel so nervous about dying.

As long as you keep your shield up, keep on the move and wait for the right time to attack, you should be able to get through this game…….if your nerves can take it.
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April 19th, 2013, 00:29
Originally Posted by Ryder View Post
This comment makes absolutely no sense. Surely after taking an hour to get past a boss is the biggest accomplishment of all? That's what makes this game so special and unique. The game rewards patience, you can't go in button mashing and expect to survive.

After playing Assassins Creed, Skyrim and Dragons Dogma where there is no punishment for death, this game is a breath of fresh air. There is no other game out there that makes you feel so nervous about dying.

As long as you keep your shield up, keep on the move and wait for the right time to attack, you should be able to get through this game…….if your nerves can take it.
How does my comment make no sense? For me, spending an hour repeatedly trying to get past a boss battle is not fun. It's tedious and it feels like I just wasted an hour and made very little progress story-wise in the actual game. Especially if there is a checkpoint system and you have to repeat content. I have a very limited amount of gaming time per week, and being stuck on one area for too long will end up with me getting irritated and deciding to play something else.

You clearly feel differently and that's a valid opinion. For you, the challenge is what makes the game fun. I understand that and respect that. For me, I like games where there is no punishment for death. Dark Souls is not me for, and I can accept that. Maybe if it gets cheap on Steam, I'll give it a try.
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April 19th, 2013, 02:46
I obviously misunderstood your interpretation of acclompishment. Sorry bout that.

I've finished the game twice. Once as a Pyromancer, it took me 100 hours to finish. Last night I finished my Thief in 60 hours. It gets easier.

When I first started playing I was a Knight, put 42 hours into it and was struggling, i wasn't enjoying it. Skyrim (and then Dragons Dogma) came out and I didnt play DS again for a year. Started where I left off but still found it hard (even with Demon Souls experience) so started all over again.

The moral of my story is, it is a great unique game that keeps you on edge. If it does come down in price and you have the time to invest in it then you wont be disappointed. Just make sure you read sites that tell you the best way to start and the like. Makes it a little easier.

Having said all that, I play it on the PS3. There is not a hope in hell I'd play it on the pc having to use a keyboard. The thought scares me.
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April 19th, 2013, 05:46
When I do play a game, I like to feel like I'm accomplishing something. If it takes me an hour to get past a boss battle (especially if I only have an hour to play), I lose interest very quick.
I think I can explain this.

My friend is really into World of Warcraft and he convinced me to take a "scroll of resurrection" which gives you 7 days playtime for free.

He was going on about how its "new wow" and better and I should come tank for his leveling shaman. But when I ran the old dungeons with him all that had changed was it was really, really easy.

When I used to play you'd take each pull carefully and have a mage sheep one, etc, etc. Later on they introduced markers to make this easier. Now its just super easy and you can forget all that stuff and just run the whole thing in 1 pull.

So he tells me to tank bigger pulls. To hurry up. That we could be doing it faster and getting more done. He felt like he could accomplish more with his time. To him if he was leveling faster he was actually getting in MORE game time regardless of how much real time gameplay was had. If it takes 3 days /played to get to 90 and he did it in 1.5 he's actually played 3 days of game in only 1.5 days!

So, is he really enjoying the game? He can get a lot accomplished with his time and see the results. But from my perspective we were just doing hard work and not enjoying the game at all. Acting like gold farmers do, really.

He's got no interest in Dark Souls, either. His mind is stuck in work mode and learning something new is a waste of time that could be invested in efficiently repeating content for maximum gains. Grinding, pretty much.

So 1 hour in dark souls might give you a little knowledge and cost you all your XP (souls). 1 hour in wow will give you some accomplished quests, some nice XP bar you cant lose, a few gains in herbalism, some gold, some time to collect you auction money and rub your hands at the profits, etc, etc.
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April 19th, 2013, 06:38
Sir James that sounds exactly like my experience with Diablo 3 before I quit playing that. Blizzard trend?
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April 19th, 2013, 08:10
Originally Posted by Ryder View Post
I obviously misunderstood your interpretation of acclompishment. Sorry bout that.

I've finished the game twice. Once as a Pyromancer, it took me 100 hours to finish. Last night I finished my Thief in 60 hours. It gets easier.

When I first started playing I was a Knight, put 42 hours into it and was struggling, i wasn't enjoying it. Skyrim (and then Dragons Dogma) came out and I didnt play DS again for a year. Started where I left off but still found it hard (even with Demon Souls experience) so started all over again.

The moral of my story is, it is a great unique game that keeps you on edge. If it does come down in price and you have the time to invest in it then you wont be disappointed. Just make sure you read sites that tell you the best way to start and the like. Makes it a little easier.

Having said all that, I play it on the PS3. There is not a hope in hell I'd play it on the pc having to use a keyboard. The thought scares me.
No problem! I may still try it at some point just for curiosity's sake (when games get down to $5 on Steam, I sometimes buy things that are normally not my thing just to try them out).
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April 19th, 2013, 08:25
Originally Posted by SirJames View Post
I think I can explain this.

My friend is really into World of Warcraft and he convinced me to take a "scroll of resurrection" which gives you 7 days playtime for free.

He was going on about how its "new wow" and better and I should come tank for his leveling shaman. But when I ran the old dungeons with him all that had changed was it was really, really easy.

When I used to play you'd take each pull carefully and have a mage sheep one, etc, etc. Later on they introduced markers to make this easier. Now its just super easy and you can forget all that stuff and just run the whole thing in 1 pull.

So he tells me to tank bigger pulls. To hurry up. That we could be doing it faster and getting more done. He felt like he could accomplish more with his time. To him if he was leveling faster he was actually getting in MORE game time regardless of how much real time gameplay was had. If it takes 3 days /played to get to 90 and he did it in 1.5 he's actually played 3 days of game in only 1.5 days!

So, is he really enjoying the game? He can get a lot accomplished with his time and see the results. But from my perspective we were just doing hard work and not enjoying the game at all. Acting like gold farmers do, really.

He's got no interest in Dark Souls, either. His mind is stuck in work mode and learning something new is a waste of time that could be invested in efficiently repeating content for maximum gains. Grinding, pretty much.

So 1 hour in dark souls might give you a little knowledge and cost you all your XP (souls). 1 hour in wow will give you some accomplished quests, some nice XP bar you cant lose, a few gains in herbalism, some gold, some time to collect you auction money and rub your hands at the profits, etc, etc.
Hmmm… I don't know if I'd go that far, where gaming becomes so ultra goal-focused that it's almost a mechanical chore.

The problem for me is when I spend an hour and don't get past the difficult boss. Then, the next time I play, I remember that I'm stuck on that fight and say to myself "meh, I'm not spending another hour on that."

What I meant by 'accomplishing something' is that I like to have a good pace where the story is moving forward and there is the right balance of challenge and success. It gets boring if its too easy where you are breezing through the action, and boring if you are stuck on difficult battles that are preventing you from enjoying more of the game.

Using your WoW example - I actually played it for a long time, but didn't do a lot of group activity because I liked questing at a leisurely pace, and being able to stop at any time when real life needed my attention.

I'm not implying that Dark Souls needs to cater to my gaming style, I simply wanted to clarify why I feel the way I do.
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April 19th, 2013, 10:41
Sometimes I wish that somebody would come up with a better name for our hobby than "gaming". Because I don't really like games. Seriously.

Don't get me wrong; since the early 80s I have spent a huge chunk of my life playing computer and video games. But to be honest, the "game" aspect has always been something I endure rather than enjoy. This might seem strange to some of you, but I'm in it for the exploration. Lore and worldbuilding, design and atmosphere is everything.

Dark Souls reminds me of another fascinating, but ultimately frustrating gaming experience; playing Air Ball on the Atair ST. Yes, I played Air Ball for the exploration. I loved the game world, the atmosphere and design of it, for what it was. In those days, the challenge was necessary, because the game would not have lasted very long without it. But it was a necessary evil, not something good.

Let's get a bit philosophical about the idea of "game" here. There is no such thing as a fair game when the goal is "winning" as opposed to "losing". If a game was truly fair, then nobody would ever win or lose. Because in order to win, you must have some sort of advantage. And any sort of advantage is unfair, if you think about it.

It doesn't matter if your advantage is an easy mode or your own skill. It's still unfair.

To me, if you take the "game" out of a game, and it's still worthwhile, then you have something. If "game" is all there is, then you have nothing.

I spent well over 100 hours playing Dark Souls. I estimate that about 70 of those hours was pure "game", which is not an acceptable ratio to me these days. But I'm not complaining. Since there are so many other promising titles in development, I happily leave Dark Souls II to those who appreciate "gaming".
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