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Default Iphone RPGs with depth?

May 6th, 2013, 09:39
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
The iPad is just fine for complex [turn based]rpg games or tun based strategy games. They are porting the full xcom to it after all.
Real time rpgs that are complex on ipad? Just no. I tried to like that ravensword game, absolutely disgusting.
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May 6th, 2013, 10:42
The first one is, the second one is quite good actually, esp for the price. Hou wont find a freerer and more western rpg on any portable including the original psp, ds, 3ds or vita. Its much closer to elder scrolls than most portable games. Again you cant compare to he pc which is a much more mature platform. I hope you were talking about the original, because the sequel's reviews all agree with me look at itunes or the big portable gaming sites like Pocketgamer.
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May 6th, 2013, 10:53
Its a great effort just watch the video review here:
http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/iPhon…ew.asp?c=47450

You wont really get anything better no matter who the eev is with touch controls and a game sesigned either for iPhone or as an universal app from the get go. Keep in mind the review is for iPhone, so you can add another point or two tothe 8/10 score if you play it on the iPad. Imo its much better than something like the zelda ds games or any game gamecbe rpg and again closer to morrowind than anything out there on portables.
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May 6th, 2013, 11:22
Speaking of which, to lifhten up the mood here is what Adam Seasler thinks Apple should do for gaming with the iPad (add lucas arts adventure games):
http://www.g4tv.com/thefeed/blog/pos…fect-2/?page=2
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May 6th, 2013, 11:37
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
The first one is, the second one is quite good actually, esp for the price. Hou wont find a freerer and more western rpg on any portable including the original psp, ds, 3ds or vita. Its much closer to elder scrolls than most portable games. Again you cant compare to he pc which is a much more mature platform. I hope you were talking about the original, because the sequel's reviews all agree with me look at itunes or the big portable gaming sites like Pocketgamer.
The second one. It scored 78 on metacritic and that is with 3 app sites inflating it. It isnt the content that i have an issue with, it is the controls and how it was reflected in combat design. All the enemies attack very slowly giving you time to attack with the dodgy controls. The problem is the lack of tactile feedback on the ipad, you "miss" sometimes and that doesnt cut it for me. Would a real Elderscrolls games work on the ipad, from my experience in ravensword 2, no.
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May 6th, 2013, 12:11
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
The iPad is just fine for complex rpg games or tun based strategy games. They are porting the full xcom to it after all.
Yes and it's from 1994 - and the controls are abysmally bad.
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May 6th, 2013, 12:32
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
Nope:
http://toucharcade.com/2013/03/23/pa…s-this-summer/
Oh, that X-Com. Well, let's see the game before we talk about how good it is, shall we.

I was talking about the fan-made X-Com that I can't remember the name of. THAT has an abysmal interface.
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May 6th, 2013, 13:11
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Even with all the issues txa brought up, it still only takes a SINGLE fantastic complex/meaty CRPG that's fully unique to the iPad platform to turn things around.

That, my friends, is the heart of the issue. The PC is simply an infinitely superior platform for a game like that.
TOTALLY agree … and you know I am a huge iOS fan. Real time controls on a touchscreen are non-deterministic, so at best they are 'not disappointing'. And they HAVE gotten better, but it is still a compromise.

Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
iPad/iPhone fans need to wake up and realise the natural inferiority of the platform, if you ask me.
I would put a 'that depends' … because there are several things at play here:
- the hardware in these things is actually pretty staggering. Definitely more powerful as a computer than eithr X360 or PS3. SO there is the one thing where there is a ton of computing capability to be utilized - but also that the OS will not allow for full utilization like devs can do on consoles.

BUT …

- if all we are asking for is ports or 'just likes', we can NEVER get or expect a superior experience. It is impossible - at best we will get a 'wow, just like on PC, but I can carry it everywhere!'.

- Also, I among others have pointed out areas where the iPad is really a better experience - things like adventure games - but they are not RPGs!

- Others have talked about turn-based, and I agree to an extent - you can think about all of the mouse-driven stuff and see how well it would work on iPad/Android tablets. But then you think about the 27 keys you have on your favorite strategy game and realize how much you would have to adapt the interface. It would be compromise loaded - oh, sure I would LOVE playing Civilization IV on iPad, but let's be realistic.

- I think that if you look at the games that have really excelled, they all bring forward the unique interaction we have with a smartphone. We need something in a RPG that takes that same leap - in other words, something you CAN'T easily do on a PC.

And back to the hardware stuff - because we are anticipating yet ANOTHER leap in iPad hardware in the next couple of months … what sense would it really make to optimize your code for one specific model? None. And that is a major issue - it is why weaker consoles can seem to perform better than beefy PCs … because teams are squeezing every drop of performance out of them. For iPads, like PC, people just throw the code at the system and do a bit of general optimization.

I hope Ossian's The Shadow Sun is good (and arrives soon) … but my expectations are based on the '… for an iPad game' model.

Finally … why compare to the DS/PSP/ 3DS/Vita? No one here cares about those … we are PC gamers, and because smartphones/tablets have taken over all growth in the computing space and most of us carry one or both … we care about how oru preferred gaming can interact with these new technologies.

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May 6th, 2013, 13:29
I would put a 'that depends' because there are several things at play here:- the hardware in these things is actually pretty staggering. Definitely more powerful as a computer than eithr X360 or PS3. SO there is the one thing where there is a ton of computing capability to be utilized - but also that the OS will not allow for full utilization like devs can do on consoles.
I wouldn't say they're more powerful - but more comfortable for certain tasks, like surfing and reading.

You should compare it to the upcoming PS4 and Xbox 720 - as they will be the new console standard. For non-casual gaming, there will be no comparison. You can take that to the bank.

- Also, I among others have pointed out areas where the iPad is really a better experience - things like adventure games - but they are not RPGs!
I don't agree they're better experiences - but they're among the most comfortable on the platform. I get no greater pleasure in terms of the actual gaming experience. I'm VERY comfortable in front of my screen at home - and I prefer mouse/keyboard for almost everything.

But, yeah, I'm talking about RPGs in particular.

- Others have talked about turn-based, and I agree to an extent - you can think about all of the mouse-driven stuff and see how well it would work on iPad/Android tablets. But then you think about the 27 keys you have on your favorite strategy game and realize how much you would have to adapt the interface. It would be compromise loaded - oh, sure I would LOVE playing Civilization IV on iPad, but let's be realistic.
Yup, I agree.

But you're also underestimating the computer-power needed to drive a game with Civ 4-5 complexity. Those games bog down SEVERELY in the mid-late game even on the most powerful PCs.

- I think that if you look at the games that have really excelled, they all bring forward the unique interaction we have with a smartphone. We need something in a RPG that takes that same leap - in other words, something you CAN'T easily do on a PC.
I'm still waiting

I'm all for trying new things - and I'm not denying that touch-screen interfaces could potentially bring something significant and new to the table. However, especially in the case of RPGs - I think it's going to be a tiny, tiny exception.

The heart of any RPG would not be the interface - but the feature-set and the content.

And back to the hardware stuff - because we are anticipating yet ANOTHER leap in iPad hardware in the next couple of months what sense would it really make to optimize your code for one specific model? None. And that is a major issue - it is why weaker consoles can seem to perform better than beefy PCs because teams are squeezing every drop of performance out of them. For iPads, like PC, people just throw the code at the system and do a bit of general optimization.
Agreed again. Also, things evolve all the time - and no one can predict all the new platforms.

I hope Ossian's The Shadow Sun is good (and arrives soon) but my expectations are based on the ' for an iPad game' model.
It's definitely on my radar. I'm looking forward to it.

Finally why compare to the DS/PSP/ 3DS/Vita? No one here cares about those we are PC gamers, and because smartphones/tablets have taken over all growth in the computing space and most of us carry one or both we care about how oru preferred gaming can interact with these new technologies.
Sure - but my point was that I didn't mention them - and as such they're not relevant when countering.

As you can imagine - I feel the same way about those platforms - largely. Except of course that they're dedicated gaming platforms - and as such, they will tend to have better games - simply because that's what the audience will expect.
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May 6th, 2013, 22:01
Here is what I was talking about:
http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/iPad/…ws.asp?c=50659

A great classic rpg game (from 1999 with great reviews though) reworked for tablets with icons as keyboard shortcuts. It is making these games reborn and more accessible. This is great for the gaming community enlarge and opening up the market. Also, it is allowing great graphical updates and remakes to take place of some of our favorite games.
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May 6th, 2013, 22:04
Also, TXA they are actually considering porting civ 5 to the pad:
http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/iPad/…ws.asp?c=49984

It is already fully playable and shown it can work:
http://www.nineoverten.com/2013/03/1…o-on-the-ipad/

Some of you just do not keep up with this news do you?
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May 6th, 2013, 22:09
This is what reworking an interface from pc to tablet and making it more accessible and enjoyable looks like (as well as improving graphics):


Even the developers state this:

"This new version is more accessible and the new interface allows action phases that are much more dynamic, thanks to the touch features of those devices."
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May 7th, 2013, 02:45
Fact is we have a Combat Mission:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/comb…496265964?mt=8

Do Sony and Nintendo handheld users have a combat mission or even other pc franchises like baldurs gate? No they do not. Do they have battle of the Bulge?
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/batt…521833787?mt=8
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May 7th, 2013, 03:55
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
Do Sony and Nintendo handheld users have a combat mission or even other pc franchises like baldurs gate? No they do not. Do they have battle of the Bulge?
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/batt…521833787?mt=8
PLEASE stop posting about Sony/Nintendo … because not only are those things niche at this point (Apple sold more iPad Minis Q1 of this year than Nintendo and Sony will sell of ALL their handheld stuff combined ALL YEAR) … but ALSO - NO ONE here cares about them. Not even ME, who owns all of them!

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May 7th, 2013, 04:52
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I wouldn't say they're more powerful - but more comfortable for certain tasks, like surfing and reading.
Technically they are about on equal footing … but the only reason I mention that is because you have to ask yourself: what iPad games wow you like, for example, Bioshock Infinite? Exactly … so there is much more going on than just hardware.

But you're also underestimating the computer-power needed to drive a game with Civ 4-5 complexity. Those games bog down SEVERELY in the mid-late game even on the most powerful PCs.
My statement was that I would love to play those games BUT … which I meant to imply that there was much more to it than just a simple port. When you look at running Civ IV in 2005 on a 512MB graphics card on a 2GB RAM system, you were pounding through heat (imagine me playing on a laptop!).

And I think that will impact how the XCOM and Civ ports work and are handled.

The heart of any RPG would not be the interface - but the feature-set and the content.
Very true - which makes it even MORE of a challenge! We need someone to innovate an entirely new paradigm for tablet RPGs … and come up with a great game… and manage to charge enough to make it all worthwhile!

Agreed again. Also, things evolve all the time - and no one can predict all the new platforms.
Which is what I meant by the inability to really SQUEEZE a system for performance - because everything you do might be moot in 6 months.

Sure - but my point was that I didn't mention them - and as such they're not relevant when countering.

As you can imagine - I feel the same way about those platforms - largely. Except of course that they're dedicated gaming platforms - and as such, they will tend to have better games - simply because that's what the audience will expect.
I know YOU didn't mention them, and we BOTH know who did The problem is, now that you are lucky to sell 50,000 copies of a Vita game, publishers are getting even MORE selective!

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May 7th, 2013, 05:22
Well on gamefaqs they dont even mention tablets or ios or the iPad and almost every handheld topic is vita vs 3ds vita vs 3ds or 3ds vs ita like theyre the only players in town:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/62027…-vita/66080945

Vita is already a much better system and in a different competition than nintendo fanboy base that wouldswallow the bintendo pill all day without anything but ports or remakes to back it up. The iPad and vita is where its really at and psp if youre on a budget.
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May 7th, 2013, 07:07
I mean just look how confusing and overcomplicated even the original baldurs gate is:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1…ilebasic?pli=1

Do we really want this form of archaic and complex gaming esp on tablets? Where we have to memorize thacos, saving throws, rounds, etc. or do we actually wnat to lay down or sit down and enjoy our game without giving ourselves a headache? Thats the future of gaming not the past which was baldurs gate.
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May 7th, 2013, 10:29
Originally Posted by AppleIntimidation View Post
Well on gamefaqs they dont even mention tablets or ios or the iPad and almost every handheld topic is vita vs 3ds vita vs 3ds or 3ds vs ita like theyre the only players in town:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/62027…-vita/66080945

Vita is already a much better system and in a different competition than nintendo fanboy base that wouldswallow the bintendo pill all day without anything but ports or remakes to back it up. The iPad and vita is where its really at and psp if youre on a budget.
When it comes to rpgs the 3ds owns the vita. The fact that SMT4 is coming to the 3ds cements it. But why are we arguing about the vita and 3ds in an iphone thread?
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May 7th, 2013, 10:39
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
Technically they are about on equal footing … but the only reason I mention that is because you have to ask yourself: what iPad games wow you like, for example, Bioshock Infinite? Exactly … so there is much more going on than just hardware.
I'm "wow'ed" by the concept of having a reasonably powerful computer in such a convenient package.

That's something you could only dream of a few years ago. I mean that, I'm extremely impressed.

I'm extremely impressed with the "power-current" based touch-screen (forget what it's called) - but I think it's brilliant. Absolutely brilliant.

I'm impressed with the Apple design and the Apple interface. Fantastically accessible.

But I'm not the sort of person who will let that sort of impression dispel reality. Reality is that the platform is inferior - and I don't see how you could possibly call consoles and an iPad on equal footing when it comes to gaming.

The power of their GPU alone absolutely trumps the iPad utterly and totally. There's absolutely no way you could make something like Skyrim or Read Dead Redemption happen without them looking like cardboard-based games.

Just like all the 3D games that have true freeform gameplay look like.

You're dreaming if you think the current hardware can come even close to those games.

And I think that will impact how the XCOM and Civ ports work and are handled.
Most definitely. Also, I think X-Com is particularly UNIMPRESSIVE as it is. I think it's clunky and slow on both PCs and consoles.

Very true - which makes it even MORE of a challenge! We need someone to innovate an entirely new paradigm for tablet RPGs … and come up with a great game… and manage to charge enough to make it all worthwhile!
You mean YOU need

I don't need something until I know what it is

Which is what I meant by the inability to really SQUEEZE a system for performance - because everything you do might be moot in 6 months.
Yup, another awful aspect of following the trends. Even when I'm in consumer-mode - I think it's tremendously demotivating to realise that the shiny new gadget will be outdated almost before I'm used to having it.

I know YOU didn't mention them, and we BOTH know who did The problem is, now that you are lucky to sell 50,000 copies of a Vita game, publishers are getting even MORE selective!
Yeah, but the person in question obviously isn't quite sane. I've often wondered if it's an elaborate bot
Last edited by DArtagnan; May 7th, 2013 at 12:21.
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