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Default BioWare - Making LGBT Inclusive Games

August 6th, 2013, 17:47
Wow, I just read the above exchange and I don't even know where to begin…

As a gay man myself, I can say that GhanBuriGhan's comments were pretty spot on. I appreciate the fact that you handled the conversation so eloquently.

The writing of the characters in DA:O and DA:2 may have left something to be desired. But it was extremely refreshing to see a gay character featured in an RPG. It has happened a few times before, but the instances have traditionally been few and far between. I know a lot of gay gamers do appreciate having that viewpoint in a game, because it gets old always playing straight characters.

Could the characters have been handled better - yes (though honestly, Bioware has pretty handled the issue better than any other game portrayal). Was the fact that the games had gay characters a selling point for me? Definitely, YES. I enjoyed all of the Mass Effect games, but was far more excited for the third game, because of the gay Shepherd option. It may not make a big difference (the gay aspects of the game are fairly few and far between), but it adds a certain element of appeal to the game that is otherwise lacking. It's easier to relate to the character, which of course is important in a RPG.

And I certainly agree that talking about the issue is important. Burying your head in the sand and assuming change will just naturally happen is not the answer. There is a reason why gay folks talk about gay issues so openly these days, and if you notice, attitudes about the topic have change dramatically in the last few years. The more people are exposed to the issue, the less exotic it becomes and hopefully the day will come when it will no longer need to be talked about, because it will just be accepted.

Tolerance people… Just because it is an issue that doesn't matter to or affect you, doesn't mean it doesn't matter to someone else. If you don't want to hear about it, ignore the topic and move on. That's pretty much what I do every time I see an article about a Call of Duty game.
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August 6th, 2013, 18:26
Originally Posted by HiddenX View Post
I'm not so eloquent as Dart & Ghan so I searched the internet for an article that is close to my opinion:

I’ve Updated My Journal: Bioware’s Gay Problem
It's an interesting read, and as I said earlier, it is a good thing to debate whether the way Gaider/Bioware handled it is adequate. That is a very welcome discussion, but we can only have it by talking about it, and that article is another entry showing the interest to talk about it, that's my whole point. Regarding the actual criticism in the article - I partly agree and I find the points I would raise against it are already well represented in the comments below the article, so I'll leave it at that.
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August 6th, 2013, 18:55
As long as the characters and stories are interesting I'm all in for new ideas, character creations, customization and adult themes.

Heck, I played orcish females, alien sex fiends, gender switching mages, druids turning into animals, whore princesses … I like variety.

Homosexual humans are just normal for me - in game and in real life

For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong. - HL Mencken
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August 6th, 2013, 18:59
I'd prefer for there to be no romance options in games. It's always seemed a bit creepy and weird to me. I'd be fine with "LGBT" characters as long as it's possible to kill them, though.

In any case, I'm always careful about reading reviews before purchasing games, and will avoid purchasing those with "LGBT" propaganda.

Thankfully those kind of politically correct depravities seem to be completely absent from Central- and Eastern European games, which I tend to favor.
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August 6th, 2013, 19:02
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Fair enough - but I'm still sick of hearing about this.
Comment #81!
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August 6th, 2013, 19:15
Originally Posted by enm View Post
I'd prefer for there to be no romance options in games. It's always seemed a bit creepy and weird to me. I'd be fine with "LGBT" characters as long as it's possible to kill them, though.

Speaking of creepy and weird…
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August 6th, 2013, 19:17
When will they start making games inclusive to people with brains?
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August 6th, 2013, 19:43
Originally Posted by ManWhoJaped View Post
When will they start making games inclusive to people with brains?
When there's a market, I guess?

(I had to, it was too clear a set-up)
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August 6th, 2013, 21:04
Originally Posted by dpc76 View Post
The writing of the characters in DA:O and DA:2 may have left something to be desired. But it was extremely refreshing to see a gay character featured in an RPG. It has happened a few times before, but the instances have traditionally been few and far between. I know a lot of gay gamers do appreciate having that viewpoint in a game, because it gets old always playing straight characters.
I guess I must have missed something when I played DA:O. Which character was supposed to be gay?

*Edit* Ok, I think I misunderstood. I assume you're simply talking about the option of having the PC engage in a same-sex encounter. I still think that takes some imagination on the part of the player.
Last edited by JDR13; August 6th, 2013 at 21:18.
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August 6th, 2013, 21:13
Dacron, errr, Zevron…. You had to activate his gayness by being as friendly as possible with him, I think…. Otherwise you wouldn't get it. It's not like he was shoved down your throat, or something.
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August 6th, 2013, 21:15
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I guess I must have missed something when I played DA:O. Which character was supposed to be gay?
Zevran and Leliana are both bi. Although Gaider has since gone through some mental gymnastics to explain that just because they will sleep with both a male and female PC, they are not actually 'bi'. It's just that (apparently) a different 'reality' exists when you roll a male and a different one when you roll a female. In one reality Leliana is straight, and in another she's gay. Hespeth (Oghren's wife looking for the anvil) is also gay or bi. Then you have Shale who can be interpreted to be transgender.
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August 6th, 2013, 21:22
Originally Posted by Gaxkang View Post
Hespeth (Oghren's wife looking for the anvil) is also gay or bi.
Now that I can see.
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August 7th, 2013, 01:56
I don't mind Bioware including bi or homo as a romance option as long as you can kill the romance easily. But I do dislike the fact Bioware constantly goes back to the topic. Yes, you guys love to include bi/homo romance in your game, good for you, now lets move along. They've been doing it for years and they constantly voice it as if it's the only achievement they've made these recent years. Good for you, would you like a medal?

It irritates me a lot whenever they talk about it because I thought they are making RPG, not some romance dating games? I don't mind romance included in the game, so long as it is done well, and as a part of the PC/protagonist and NPC/companions relationship build. I quite enjoyed the romance in BG2, because I felt it was integrated well with building friendship/strong bonds with the companions you are traveling with.

What I would like to see more often is the romance between NPCs, not just between the protagonist and companion you are traveling with. I actually found it quite amusing when I discovered that Tali and Garrus enters relationship (sort of). Why shouldn't your companions have romance? It actually feels more natural when you get to help your traveling companions bond with each other than being forced into romance for your protagonist just for the sake of the story (sometimes).

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IWD: Orhlanna & Korin
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August 7th, 2013, 03:18
Originally Posted by ManWhoJaped View Post
When will they start making games inclusive to people with brains?
You mean start making them *again* …

— Mike
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August 10th, 2013, 00:11
Now that LGBT comes - what about HSPs ? Aspergers ? Synesthesia ? And handicapped people ?

There is already an Autistic Pride Day out there !

“ Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius – and a lot of courage – to move in the opposite direction.“ (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)
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