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RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » ES4: Oblivion - CRPG of the Year @ GameSpy

Default ES4: Oblivion - CRPG of the Year @ GameSpy

December 21st, 2006, 16:25
Originally Posted by Greymane View Post
Being a role player, means more of a desire to be transported to a magical land as a more than capable adventurer and forging your own destiny. Oblvion clearly provides that world in aces. I believe some of it's detractors simply can't handle 'white space' in a game and need that ring in the nose constantly leading them with new dancing ponies to entertain them at every new turn in the road, and I frankly have to say, if you're that type of player, you're not a role player, you're just a computer gamer.
In what way are you allowed to forge your own destiny? The game consists of only hand-holding linear quest lines! The only choices you get to make are things like, "Do I want to become the head of this guild, that one, or maybe all of them?". There aren't even any alternative ways to finish any quest. I must say I agree with hiciacit about the nose ring.

Originally Posted by Greymane View Post
I also don't think it's main detractors even finished 20% of the game. Just the Dark Brotherhood series of quests alone was a mini-masterpiece.
I've finished the main story-line, DB, the Fighters Guild, and what I estimate to be around half of the Thieves Guild and Mages Guild lines. The Dark Brotherhood is indeed excellent, until you start to work directly for Lucien about half/two thirds into the quest line, after which it goes turns mediocre. The ending was annoying, since the game didn't let me do as my character would have done. Instant "immersion" breaker.

Most of the quests in Oblivion are good, but I would have enjoyed them a lot more if it wasn't for the pop-ups telling me what to do, and the quest markers telling me exactly where to go. And, as mentioned, the lack of alternative ways to resolve quests, which severely hampers the role playing experience for me.

Originally Posted by Greymane View Post
I haven't purchased NWN2 or Gothic 3 , although I loved their predecessors greatly, due to their unfinished and nearly unplayable state in the case of Gothic 3, that is just not acceptable. I also see them both as more of a 'lead you around by the nose and show you dancing ponies at each turn' type of games and not true role playing worlds.. which is my personal preference.
Many Oblivion defenders accuse its detractors of not having played the game that they say they dislike. I actually felt like I had more freedom in NWN2, despite its rather railroaded approach to world exploration.

I can't say I've played any RPG released this year that I find worthy of being remembered as a "Best CRPG of the Year" however, but I haven't played Gothic 3 yet, even though it's sitting on my shelf. Partly because I'm awaiting patches, but I also have around 15 games (mainly older ones) on my "waiting to be played list", so I've been rather busy anyway.

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December 21st, 2006, 19:37
RPGCodex has an interesting take on the GameSpy awards here, noting:
As per its regrettable yearly habit, GameSpy has posted its 2006 Game of the Year lineup for PC. Apologies in advance for the length of this newspost, but 2006's GOTY account features delectable surprises for RPG aficionados:
And they go on to point out some 'interesting' stuff, most notably the cognitive dissonance of simultaneously giving Oblivion RPGotY and #2 overall, while also giving Mod of the Year to something that reworks many of the games flaws …
So, to recap: Oblivion is RPG of the Year and #2 on the list of best PC games of 2006, but it lacks "a feeling of progression", "satisfying" victories, and apparently even logic - all of which OOO introduces, thereby winning Mod of the Year.

— Mike
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December 21st, 2006, 21:37
Yar, that is hilarious.

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December 23rd, 2006, 04:09
HA! HA! Nice find there Mike.

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December 23rd, 2006, 17:54
You know, one of these days I'm going to have to try OOO. See if it really fixes all the problems with OB… I might then actually get my money's worth out of buying that game after all
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December 24th, 2006, 02:27
NWN2 is the only proper cRPG this year in my opinion. Games like Gothic 3, Oblivion and so on may be defined as action RPGs, and they may sell a lot and be hits and what not, but they are certainly not cRPGs. As much as I love Gothic 3 (not going to comment Oblivion) I'd still say it would be wrong for it to win a title in a category it's not in at all. NWN2 is, however, the best cRPG I've played for years.
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December 24th, 2006, 02:51
While there's a lot to like in NWN 2, there's also a great deal I don't like!! I still consider G3 an rpg, but that's a different thread!!

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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December 24th, 2006, 13:48
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
NWN2 is the only proper cRPG this year in my opinion. Games like Gothic 3, Oblivion and so on may be defined as action RPGs, and they may sell a lot and be hits and what not, but they are certainly not cRPGs. As much as I love Gothic 3 (not going to comment Oblivion) I'd still say it would be wrong for it to win a title in a category it's not in at all. NWN2 is, however, the best cRPG I've played for years.
Imo what all this really means is that 2006 has been a poor year for cRPG lovers. NWN2 not as polished as we would have liked, Oblivion and G3 arguably not true RPGs and both not polished enough either.
(one of) My wish for 2007 : a better year for RPGs

PS: RPG hungry as I am I ended up reinstalling and playing again this year Fallout 1, Fallout 2, BG1, BG2, Planescape: Torment, Kotor 1 and Kotor 2 on top of NWN2 (haven't tried Oblivion or G3) and a few indie releases. I hope 2007 will add fresh new names to my "played this year" list.
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December 25th, 2006, 23:44
Originally Posted by Sorcha Ravenlock View Post
I smirked. A bit.
Nice to know some people have some brain cells :-)

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December 25th, 2006, 23:56
VK 1 & 2 = dumbass(es)
Oblivion = RPG of the year

(No offense meant to Sorcha, by the way)
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December 29th, 2006, 02:15
Lets keep our fingers crossed that hellgate london and witcher can deliver us what they have promised
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January 4th, 2007, 15:45
Given the competitors I think Oblivion was probably the best candidate for GOTY.

That said, the game is mostly impressive from a technical standpoint. They managed to put together some pretty amazing features into a mostly seamless whole. When you consider what goes on, on screen, and under the hood, you can't help but be awestruck if you're running it on a decent rig.

Unfortunately they made a handful of utterly horrible design mistakes, which is particularly tragic when you think how easily they could have been avoided. Firstly, the idea of levelling encounters to match the player is simply incredible in its basic lack of comprehension of what makes a CRPG fun. Secondly, but perhaps more subjective, I've always found the character system in ES games extremely hollow. I like the idea of skillbased RPGs as much as the next guy, but the implementation in all ES games has always been unbelievably stolid and boring. No one enjoys seeing their skill go from 34 to 35, and it makes no tangible difference. I know they tried to introduce "feats" at certain intervals, but it was far from enough to compensate for the general shortcomings of the system.

Secondly, the idea that you had to anally micromanage your skilluse to avoid gimping your character (attributes) is inept to a high degree.

Those are probably the worst ideas and ultimately ruined the unmodded experience for me, and many others.

There were also some unfortunate side effects of matching the game for Xbox 360 specs, and here I'm particularly unfond of the unnecessarily small cells (causing constant loading interruptions, the horribly ugly distance textures, and last but not least the subpar interface.

I know most of these concerns are fixable with mods, but apart from that being a somewhat weak solution from Beth's perspective, it also has had the sad consequence of becoming a mini-game in itself. You know, browsing the web for new mods, always new mods, and the constant pains of trying to make them all work together. I think I've spent more time fiddling with mods than playing the damn game, and it's just not what it could have been.

Oh well…
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January 5th, 2007, 01:35
I think most of us would agree with you. The only point I could make is that despite its many faults (which can be fixed) G3 is a better GAME!!

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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January 5th, 2007, 11:54
G3 is potentially better, yes. But at its current stage, not to mention release stage, it's not better.

That HAS to be all that matters. PB/JW MUST learn to respect their customers enough to dedicate whatever time/resources are necessary for a stable release version. If it takes a less ambitious product, then so be it.
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January 5th, 2007, 14:15
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
G3 is potentially better, yes. But at its current stage, not to mention release stage, it's not better.
I think that several here disagree - we agree it is still very buggy and unoptimized and problematic … but many of us think it is still a better game.

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January 5th, 2007, 14:25
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
I think that several here disagree - we agree it is still very buggy and unoptimized and problematic … but many of us think it is still a better game.
Of course opinions differ.

But, still, are you truly willing to look beyond the absolutely HORRID balance of the combat system, and the equally sad state of item progression. I mean, you can STILL buy the best 1H sword in the game right from the get-go. Flame Sword, which completely eliminates the desire for upgrades to weapons.

I could of course go on about many other flaws, but you get what I mean. I also have a great respect for G3 because of the potential. The game itself has a lot more going for it than Oblivion, if you simply consider the "fun". Maybe it's just me, but no matter how good elements are in a game, I simply won't accept what IS basically a broken product. Call me a stubborn principle-driven moron, but it's just not right to the fans to release a game in this state.
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January 6th, 2007, 02:26
Hey, we're not arguing the game should have been released in the state it was in, but show me one recently released 'big' rpg that is in a proper state upon release!! And NO, I don't consider Oblivion to be a candidate for several reasons!!

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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January 6th, 2007, 04:18
Personally, I would say I like Gothic 3 more despite the release condition and other issues. I find it perfectly playable - just terribly unpolished.*

However, while I think it would be reasonable for a CRPG site such as ourselves to name Gothic as GotY, I think any mainstream site like GameSpy would be out of their minds to choose it - it just has too many issues for the average gamer. I would also argue (despite not being that big a fan) that Oblivion was one of (if not the) most polished and bug-free major CRPG release I can recall.

*"Polish" is an interesting thing. For example, Gothic 3 has weak combat but you can left-click-spam-fest through a lot of it. Does that make the combat any worse than a game where that sort of combat is expected, such as Diablo? It has some dodgy animations and graphical issues…but does that make it worse than a game that started with lower graphical standards in the first place…say, a Spiderweb game, which I perfectly enjoy?

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January 6th, 2007, 21:05
From a technical point of view, Oblivion is very far from impressive. Compared to the complexity of games like NWN2 and G3 it's a rather simple piece of coding. Why? Everything has a single startpoint and only one outcome - every quest, every dialogue, bugdetection in such a code, where everything is linear, is a whole lot easier than bugdetection in complex code with multiple outcomes on virtually everything.

If you truly look under the hood of Oblivion, it's actually even less impressive than the game itself is. In fact, it looks more like GTA under there than any of its competitors to the RPG GOTY award. Of course, Oblivion looks stunning, and there is no doubt it took skill to make it look so beautiful, but the code itself is not advanced or impressive.
Last edited by Maylander; January 6th, 2007 at 21:14.
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January 6th, 2007, 23:13
not to be insulting but you must have not gotten far in the game if you think the flame sword is the best sword in the game. not counting 2-handed weapons there are at least 6 six swords that are better than the flame sword. and i thought the 'item progression' was well done considering all of the unique gear (~50 items) you can't buy, unlike most rpgs. i will agree it is an overpowered sword in the begining and it makes no sense that it does 20 more damage than the much rarer ice sword (which doesn't even freeze enemies.) it would be nice if playing the game on a higher difficulty level restricted the more powerful items you could buy…but i doubt that is the case in gothic 3.

keep up the good discussion.
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