GothicGothicness
SasqWatch
- Joined
- October 25, 2006
- Messages
- 6,292
After doing some more thinking I guess it has to be Zork!
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2006
- Messages
- 6,292
With a heavy heart I'd have to say Diablo, because it showed developers that they could dispense with plot, complexity and dialogue in favour of mindless but strangely compelling clickfests, spawning more clones than anything else, sucking life and investment out of the more thoughtful ends of the rpg spectrum...
And the mouse! Why do you think I called it "point and click"? Back in those days, most (all?) games actually said on the box "Mouse Optional", and damnit they meant it!
Interesting point, what first games used mouse, what first games didn't had good controls without a mouse, what first games required a mouse.Depends on the genre. In adventure games, the mouse wasn't optional at that time, if I remember correctly.
They weren't called "point & click interfaces" for no reason.
I didn't play any but only tried Ultima III a little but from what I read I doubt it's any Ultima that has been the direct influence of most JRPG. Some Ultima has certainly been the influence for Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest but that's much more Final Fantasy 2 that is the major influence for JPRG not Ultima. Final Fantasy 2 setup the strong story, strong characters, and deep NPC at the price of a global linearity. That's FF2 the major influence to JPRG, not Ultima approach which is an indirect influence.I would say Ultima. U4 basically is copied down by most JRPGs, basically creating an entire genre of RPG by itself. It's also the first really persistent, inhabited world I can recall; while other games had NPCs; U4 really HAD NPCs. Up until U7 at least, that fact persisted.
I didn't play any but only tried Ultima III a little but from what I read I doubt it's any Ultima that has been the direct influence of most JRPG. Some Ultima has certainly been the influence for Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest but that's much more Final Fantasy 2 that is the major influence for JPRG not Ultima. Final Fantasy 2 setup the strong story, strong characters, and deep NPC at the price of a global linearity. That's FF2 the major influence to JPRG, not Ultima approach which is an indirect influence.
About the persistent world and inhabited world, I already read it for Ultima 3 so it couldn't be for the 4 too. Additionally it wasn't the first with the persistence approach. Also Ultima 1&2 had already done a step forward with the world approach. Ha well that's my 2 cents but well all of that is much more evolution than revolution. The Ultima series setup a whole genre and eventually Ultima III bring more points similar to more modern RPG but all Ultima bring some new points like the IV and other.
New thread for Mike! "Top 6.3 Reasons Why 'Name the Best' Lists are Teh SuXXorz"
I wonder why you think you can read my mind, and understand my intentions You can't, just like you can't grasp the fact that Ultima inspired early JRPGs. I'd argue, but since your only refute is to claim I'm starting a flame war, I'll leave it.
I still think all of these 'name the best' things are idiotic - even more so than 'top XX lists'.
About the persistent world and inhabited world, I already read it for Ultima 3 so it couldn't be for the 4 too. Additionally it wasn't the first with the persistence approach. Also Ultima 1&2 had already done a step forward with the world approach. Ha well that's my 2 cents but well all of that is much more evolution than revolution. The Ultima series setup a whole genre and eventually Ultima III bring more points similar to more modern RPG but all Ultima bring some new points like the IV and other.
I agree with that Ultima series inspired Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest but not Ultima IV like you stated.I wonder why you think you can read my mind, and understand my intentions You can't, just like you can't grasp the fact that Ultima inspired early JRPGs. I'd argue, but since your only refute is to claim I'm starting a flame war, I'll leave it.
The difference between U3 and U4 was that in U4, each NPC had their own schedule. You couldn't go into the armor shop at 3 AM and expect someone to be there. I could be wrong, but I thought U4 was the first to actually utilize that concept. If I am, it would seem to be the first that was a massive success.
I guess the "most important" games should be the ones that proved a certain style of game (or subgenre) would be viable economically and thus shaped what CRPGS are today. I don't know in all cases what these games were. Diablo for the action RPG, I guess, Arena for the open world sandbox RPG, BG for the modern RT/isometric RPG, Ultima Underworld for the RPG/FPS hybrid?