Why such bad reviews of Alpha Protocol

Hard is considerably harder than Normal, but mostly because enemies will do a lot more damage.

As for money: There are quite a few items in the game costing 150.000+. Affording all those items is far from easy. The best batches of bullets cost 5000 per 12 bullets.

Regular bullets are rarely a problem unless you only use one item (I did run out with the Assault Rifle a few times), but the special ones are certainly rare, though their effect usually makes up for it.

Heh, I actually found that the most fun way to play it was a melee specialist mixed with a bit of stealth/pistol. Nothing like punching my way through the game. Master rank Fury is incredibly powerful.
 
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SoW had better be good after that!! :)
 
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SoW had better be good after that!!

Heh, agreed. I shall expect to be torn apart by an angry mob should I fail. ;)

A bit harsh with certain details - but many good points.

Honestly, it's the whole package. Many of the small complaints, alone, wouldn't be deal breakers. But stacking them all together just results in an experience that comes across as really poor, overall.

When I originally read that 'American vs European reviews of AP' article, before I played AP, I was thinking 'Bloody Americans, it must be the action kiddies and their need for instant gratification/action'. But it really isn't. I have no idea how some of this crap got through QA.
 
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I'll take a shot in the dark here: He never even got past Saudi.

I don't think anyone has ever stated the start is good. Everyone says it improves later on.

Similar to NWN2, which has the most boring start in the history of computer gaming. I'd replay it a lot more often if I could skip the first 10 hours.
 
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He mentions that he never got past Saudi.

I very much enjoyed the start of NWN2 - so I don't know what you're talking about.

Then again, not everyone enjoys replaying games over and over, and I don't think NWN2 is particularly well suited for that, and i'm sure i'd be bored after 2-3 times.

Ironically, I enjoyed the Saudi missions just fine - and I'm not sure why everyone is so down on that part of the game.

Maybe it's because I knew my skills would increase, and they very obviously didn't intend for the game to feel like a shooter. It has crappy mechanics for that, even when you're maxed out.

But I don't think the game changes enough for him to enjoy it, though he might get used to how it works.

Seems to have had much the same reaction to the story aspect as I did, and that certainly doesn't change. It remains painfully dull and uninspiring, and even though I had ~20% of the game left - I can't imagine anything in that last part of the game to change what came before.
 
Honestly, it's the whole package. Many of the small complaints, alone, wouldn't be deal breakers. But stacking them all together just results in an experience that comes across as really poor, overall.

When I originally read that 'American vs European reviews of AP' article, before I played AP, I was thinking 'Bloody Americans, it must be the action kiddies and their need for instant gratification/action'. But it really isn't. I have no idea how some of this crap got through QA.

Agreed.

Again, I insist there were either two COMPLETELY different mindsets each controlling ~50% of development, or the person in charge was insane.

I could deal with the quirky typical Obsidian stuff, like crappy animations and in general the result of subpar technical people (considering the game is going for the semi-AAA presentation).

But the design decisions, like the Boss fights - I can't abide. The shooter mechanics could very simply be "normal", and skills could have focused on the powers - instead of making weapons marginally less crappy per investment when used as a normal weapon without the powers. That would have pleased both shooter and RPG fans, but I guess that would require a focused lead designer with a brain.
 
I also enjoyed The Saudi missions and thought they where really good. Perhaps "i knew" they should suck more cause i read about the "bad" start and was pleasingly surprised when i found out that i was having fun.
 
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Sorry you didn't enjoy it, Ninja. I think you're missing a unique game (yes, a flawed one) with a huge number of choices.

At the risk of starting a pointless argument on personal taste, you're pretty harsh on the plot intro. BG2 saw Irenicus torturing the player? No, BG2 saw you standing in a cage and then trudging through a dull, big-ass dungeon, whereupon you get to chase down the useless sister I already killed off in BG. Fallout saw you leaving home? Who cares? I had no emotional bond to the place and getting out to explore is the whole point. I'll leave ME2's ridiculous plot to the side. No doubt BG2 and Fallout are much superior overall but AP's narrative is pretty strong and woven with choices.
 
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Why the bad reviews for AP? This is why.
Loaded conclusions and exaggerated nitpicking, what else is new?

Also, ME2´s dying a good hook? Hahaha. That was merely a marketing hook and just about the cheapest one ever.

Honestly, it's the whole package.
Honestly, finish the game and then talk about the whole package.

For the record, I do agree the game does a pretty bad job at making a good initial impression, but, for example, imo you really shouldn´t jump to conclusions in regards to gameplay so quickly. It´s an RPG after all so it takes some time till your character gets better, investing into skills does make a difference and has significant impact on how you play the game. Btw, in my first (on normal) playthrough I sneaked through the whole Saudi Arabia portion with about 1 or 2 alarms fired off.
 
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I think you're missing a unique game (yes, a flawed one) with a huge number of choices.

I hadn't planned to quit yet. I've seen enough 'it gets better after Saudi Arabia' claims to give it a bash. I'm almost finished in Saudi anyway.

My problem is that 'choices' alone don't make a good game for me. If the gameplay sucks I'm going to have a hard time enjoying any good C&C. If the story gets (a lot) better soon, then that's ok. Generally :

- I'll tolerate bad gameplay for an good story
- I'll tolerate a cheese story for great gameplay.

I'll give AP a chance to demonstrate one or the other, but I have to question how anyone can NOT see why so many reviews are (legitimately) negative. Say 'yes, but, it's a rough gem!', sure. But denying that they have a real point with their criticism?

BG2 saw Irenicus torturing the player? No, BG2 saw you standing in a cage and then trudging through a dull, big-ass dungeon

You're referring to the initial gameplay, not really the narrative hook.

It's kind of a 'fuzzy' thing to define, given how subjective it is, but some games do their story hook mainly with the introductory video and narration, some give you a sequence to play which introduces that hook. For Bloodlines, the narrative hook was the scripted introductory cut-scene with the Prince. For Planescape, it was the section of gameplay at the start, where you wake up and interact with Morte and are presented with the mystery of your past to unravel. The 'hook' is not simply what your goal is or the first actions you take, it's that initial presentation of the plot/theme/scenario which must interest the player and make them want more.

For this reason I include any intro videos/cut-scenes under the concept 'plot hook'. And in the intro video, Irenicus captures you silently in the night and tortures you, and would have continued if not for an interruption by unknown assailants. That's how you came to be standing in that cage, it's not like you were born there. It's the equivalent of the Dungeon Master presenting you with the background of your characters, in Dungeons and Dragons.

You can, of course, say the video/cut-scenes had no impact on you, that you found the premise rubbish or that the gameplay was all you noticed and that you weren't impressed. *Shrug*

It's all subjective, as you said. But I found the way the hook was presented to the player in the games I mentioned much stronger, AP's more muddled.

Fallout saw you leaving home? Who cares? I had no emotional bond to the place and getting out to explore is the whole point.

I didn't care about the vault either. But the intro video did a great job of establishing the grim mood of the setting, then you have the chat with the overseer who introduces you to why you're being sent out from your safe haven, then you see your character standing in front of the vault, jumpsuited skeleton of a previous vault dweller in front of him. I thought it was a great introduction to Fallout's setting and plot, which was more about being forced out into that strange and hostile world from your comfort and safety than about the water chip. Although the water chip idea wasn't bad either, as it presented the struggle just to survive the hostile wastes as the real enemy, not some mustache twirling villain. It may not have provided a clear next step, but it hooked me on the setting/tone, which was more what Fallout was about than a linear storyline.

Again, subjective. But I was certainly interested at that point. Far more interested than I am in finding the terrorists with the missiles in AP right now.
 
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Dhruin also referred to the narrative hook - the capture of Imoen. I have to admit, as brilliant as BG2 is, the start is hardly great. As with NWN2, the start is the main reason I don't replay it more often.

I found the start of BG1 a lot better - finding out about Gorion, the armored figure, the ore crisis and above all else: The background of the main character. Now there's a narrative hook that worked!
 
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Hard is considerably harder than Normal, but mostly because enemies will do a lot more damage.

I restarted on Hard, and you're right, it is a LOT harder. I got to Moscow and couldn't continue, it was too tough. It would be fine if it weren't for checkpoint save. If I could quicksave and load where I want it wouldn't be a problem. But having to go back and redo sections over and over when I die... sheesh. That's why I don't play games like Rainbow Six and the like.

I've restarted on Normal and I'm having to go through all the Saudi missions again. Hearing all the criticisms of the game, that right there (the difficulty and lack of quicksave) is my biggest gripe. Plus you can't turn the sensitivity down in aiming mode. That's a pain.
 
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As far as I know, you have to use both. Personally, I found high level pistol, assault rifles and martial arts to be the most efficient combat types. Pistol + Martial Arts + Toughness and 2 points Sabotage was a fairly straight forward build I had lots of fun with.

The remaining points can be put in either stealth or tech/sabotage depending on what approach suits the character: Sneaky or boom.

Pretty much everything works though, but if you use SMGs exclusively you'll probably run out of bullets. I'd add at least one more type of combat.
 
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As far as I know, you have to use both. Personally, I found high level pistol, assault rifles and martial arts to be the most efficient combat types. Pistol + Martial Arts + Toughness and 2 points Sabotage was a fairly straight forward build I had lots of fun with.

The remaining points can be put in either stealth or tech/sabotage depending on what approach suits the character: Sneaky or boom.

Pretty much everything works though, but if you use SMGs exclusively you'll probably run out of bullets. I'd add at least one more type of combat.

Thanks, I think I'll go with assault rifle and pistol too. Although I've not run out of ammo for the rifle as yet, I suppose I'll need a backup weapon.
 
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I was wondering what you guys think of the mini games. Not just in Alpha Protocol but in other games such as Mass Effect 2. I've decided I hate them in this game. I'm not a fan of mini games in RPGs in general. I'd prefer to use skills instead. Skills an integral part of RPGs to me, and having mini games for things like lock picking and similar things seems like an attempt to appeal to... I dunno, people who like arcade games I guess. I may be wrong about that. If they're going to have mini games I think at the very least they should have skill requirements like in Fallout 3.

I know some of the hacking in this game is mission-critical, so what would happen if you didn't put points into the hacking skill? You'd be stuffed. But you could always use an EMP (or somesuch device) for times when it's mission critical. The trade off for using them and not spending points on the skills is they cost a lot.

For me personally, if they did it this way it would improve the game in two ways. One it would give me some skills to invest in that I actually found useful. Really, the only thing I need is assault rifle. The games too easy to require investment in physical toughness or martial arts (at least so far) and I haven't found much use for sabotage and technical aptitude. So when I level up it's like "ho-hum, more points that I don't really need or know what to do with."

The other advantage of course is not having to play the stupid mini games over and over.

What do you think? Do you like mini games in general and in AP? And do you think they're here to stay?
 
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Haven't bought/played AP, but in general I loathe mini-games as well. I detest ANYTHING which even remotely looks like an arcade type game!!
 
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