CountChocula
Keeper of the Watch
Simple question, then. Is Grimrock an RPG, and why?
Unfortunately, I haven't played Grimrock, and my knowledge of the game is pretty limited.
Simple question, then. Is Grimrock an RPG, and why?
You cannot play a role without dialogue.
Simple question, then. Is Grimrock an RPG, and why?
No Grimrock is not an RPG.
There is no character progression dialogue as in 'to advance' or 'to develop' the character through dialogue - so there is no *choice variance* pertaining to the character. Therefore the player cannot add influence to the direction of the dialogue path relating to the outcome that leads to the conclusion via the choices….so there is no role to play.
You cannot play a role without dialogue.
A role playing game without role playing is like a strategy game with no strategy, a fighting game with no fighting, a shooter with no shooting, a puzzler with no puzzles, a racing game with no racing, etc…(I think you see where I'm going with this )
The essence of a roleplaying game is not the math, but when your GM asks you that awesome question, "What do you want to do next?" and you use your imagination to consider your character, deciding what your character would want to do in a given situation.
By putting a word like roleplaying between " ", it tells all.
The genre RPG is defined. That the definition is not applied or respected is another story. That is one point not to bother with definitions. That is another to claim the definition does not exist.
There is no role in Diablo to be played. Roles are contextualized and roleplay is achieved by playing against an archetype, with the quality of roleplay being assessed through the deviation from the archetype.
Character customization leads to developp and equip a unique character, no matter the game genre this means is used.
There is no ground to make character customization an exclusivity to RPGs. Every other genres has the liberty to introduce it to support a gameplay end. On what ground a sportsgame should be denied character customization? And character customization does not make a sports game a RPG or featuring RPG elements.
In addition, role play can happen without a character customization system.
Same old, same old.
If Legend of Grimrock is not a RPG for those reasons, then neither is Wizardry, Might and Magic, Bards Tale, many of the Ultima games, Dungeon Master, Eye of the Beholder, or any of the Gold Box Series of D&D games.
Any definition of a RPG that excludes all of the classic RPGS that defined the genre is, in my opnion, an extremely bad definition.
Again, I don't think the genre is remotely defined even in P&P games. Go to any P&P RPG forum and you will find people arguing about what is and isn't roleplaying. Your statement that quality of roleplaying is defined by going against archetype is purely an opinion, many would disagree, and many play games like D&D which are merely pen and paper forms of the hack and slash found in Diablo.
I certainly play a role when I play games like Grand Theft Auto or Call of Duty as well.
It is answered in the previous posts with the circularity bit.
Either some games were introduced through the back door while not being RPGs, but nevertheless growing into classics. So yes, anyone sticking to the general definition, which is not a bad definition, but was not respected or applied, exclude classics which were not RPGs in the first place.
Unrespected definitions are not bad definitions.
Or these games belong to cRPG debut and therefore started small.
cRPGs is that computer games genre that took the technology evolution ride not to expand role playing but to decrease RPGs.
How? There is little to no role playing in those games.
In those games, the character has a role. Which does not mean there is role playing.
In those games, roles are not contextualized. There is no archetype to play against. And there is no feedback mechanism.
I imagine conceivably you could play a role in a game where your character cannot speak, but "someone who bashes monsters" is not exactly a role.
Again, I don't think the genre is remotely defined even in P&P games. Go to any P&P RPG forum and you will find people arguing about what is and isn't roleplaying.
Well I'm not even sure what the whole archetype to play again, and feedback system you are talking about even means. But certainly they are just your opinion about what is important.
But in many of these types of games (Well GTA more then call of duty) you certainly have a background, and your actions do effect the story and have consequences.
It qualifies as a role. Most characters in a video game have a role. It does not mean roleplaying is involved.
A character can be a paladin. it does not mean that through gameplay you will roleplay it in a paladin.
The character is a paladin. Paladins are brave and honest. Therefore your character will behave bravely and honestly.
That is the sequence adopted by games like hitman, call of duty etc All the characters have a role. No roleplaying involved.
In a RPG, the sequence differs:
Paladins are brave and honest. The character behaves bravely and honestly. Therefore the character might be elegible as a paladin.
In many so called cRPGs, actions are totally disconnected from the outcome. In some cRPG games, a thief character can be without ever performing a thief characterizing action like theft.
I'm wasn't referring to class archetypes or stereotypes, etc.
"Someone who bashes monsters" is not a role.
Roles are more than classes but a monster basher can be a role.