Could you have the lazy gene?

http://www.livescience.com/28551-laziness-genes.html


I starting to think i may have some kind of lazy gene and i think so does my brother to an extent. I am so lazy i cant be bothered going down the road for 2 minutes and talking to my doctor to get my meds. It is starting to get at me. For the longest time i thought my laziness may be due to my mental condition but maybe i have the mental condition because i am lazy? I would be interested to see if this pans out.

Would you abort if your kid has this lazy gene and couldnt amount to anything?

While I can't say genetics aren't involved, I tend to think of laziness as a result of how you develop as a person, especially during the earlier years. But it's also about what kinds of habits you establish in your life - and whether or not you have other people to inspire and motivate "activity".

I definitely wouldn't sit on my ass and call it a genetic malfunction and then be done with it. I'm extremely lazy in some ways - but I have the capacity to overcome that - and I don't really think it's about genetics as much as the environment. But then again, that's my general position on human nature.

Unfortunately all you need to do is look in a multi-child family and realize you are mostly incorrect. Same family, same parents, same environment, different approaches. Sure there are environment (i.e. 'nurture') differences, but denying an in-born impact doesn't make sense. Otherwise all children in the same house and family should be nominally identical.

And that is the thing - in spite of identical upbringings you constantly see sibling differences that are stark and dramatic.

BUT that doesn't mean that some people aren't 'lazy' by choice or upbringing ...

First of all, I'm not denying genetics.

Second of all, sharing a roof, home, parents and so on - represents the tiniest fraction of what makes up our experiences from birth until adulthood.

This is something most people who don't spend a ridiculous amount of their time thinking about things like this miss.

So that's not what I mean when I say environment. For instance, entering exactly the same room in the same town with the same people at the same time will be completely and utterly different depending on things like your sex, your appearance, your clothing, your mood, your physical health and so on.

When you consider that life is made up of countless experiences like that, you start to understand that sharing a home, parents, school, upbringing and so forth has a much more limited share of your entire "environment" than you realise.

The above is, incidentally, exactly why siblings who share an "environment" tend to have vastly different experiences and lives. This does nothing but support my point - unless you're ignorant enough to believe that siblings who share the same roof, the same parents, the same school and so on - also share the exact same experiences of every single day of their lives.

No one who spends time thinking about this would think so. So, I can only suggest you start now

But again, I'm not denying genetics. I'm saying there's a lot more to how a person develops than most people realise.

So what you guys are saying is that there are 2 parts, (upbringing and choice) and genes?

Damian said:

So what you guys are saying is that there are 2 parts, (upbringing and choice) and genes?

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What we are saying is really three parts:
- Genetics
- Upbringing
- Choices / Interactions

The weighting of each I think is where there is some disagreement, but when you are born there is no 'tabula rasa' as some like to think, that has been pretty thoroughly debunked (orphans retain characteristics of parents they never meet/see/know, QED). Genetics play a very strong role.

Also, it is very clear that the home life of children plays a strong role in shaping belief systems and the way they approach human interactions ... which directly plays into ...

External impacts. That comes from all of the minutes that pass each day that are different for each individual.

All of these come to shape a person and how they interact with life.

I rather agree txa than anybody else in this thread so far.

Studies with twins are something people look into - and they offer interesting insights.
It goes even down to habits, sometimes.

How you are as a person depends on your brain chemistry. Some people are often very alert and motivated (has tons of dopamine and norepinephrine) some are often lazy and tired (too much melatonin / serotonin). Might be easier to understand how much of an impact it really has if you've used drugs that alters, for example, dopamine availability.

Your habits or upbringing really doesnt mean that much. It's not like you can be a lazy person that don't like to read or study or being creative if you're a person with a lot of dopamine.. you brain chemistry forms your habits, the other way around is true too though (but to a smaller extent), you can trigger alertness by changing habits.

vurt said:

How you are as a person depends on your brain chemistry. Some people are often very alert and motivated (has tons of dopamine and norepinephrine) some are often lazy and tired (too much melatonin / serotonin). Might be easier to understand how much of an impact it really has if you've used drugs that alters, for example, dopamine availability.

Your habits or upbringing really doesnt mean that much. It's not like you can be a lazy person that don't like to read or study or being creative if you're a person with a lot of dopamine.. you brain chemistry forms your habits, the other way around is true too though (but to a smaller extent), you can trigger alertness by changing habits.

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Except everything you listed is very much affected by your habits, upbringing and environment.

Sleep, diet,exercise, stress etc, all effect the levels of each chemical in your brain.

These levels are also affected by hormones and genetics.

All of these things play a role and make people who they are .

Which plays a bigger role I'm not sure?

A well adjusted person can become lazy and depressed after a traumatic event, so environment must play a bigger role right?

Except that the same thing can happen to someone else and they can come out of it just fine so maybe they were genetically more equipped to deal with it.....

Or had a better environment ( support system) to deal with it?

So who knows what plays a bigger role and it's probably different for each person.

I'm no expert though, just my 2 cents.

yeah, like i said, that too, but for the most part it's down to your genetics and each persons individual brain chemistry. Obviously depression can be triggered and you can also trigger short-term dopamine or melatonin release when doing something specific or being subjected to different situations.

vurt said:

How you are as a person depends on your brain chemistry. Some people are often very alert and motivated (has tons of dopamine and norepinephrine) some are often lazy and tired (too much melatonin / serotonin). Might be easier to understand how much of an impact it really has if you've used drugs that alters, for example, dopamine availability.

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Have you ever heard of high sensitivity ? Interesting topic.

Even more fascinating is Synaesthesia.

Yes those are interesting topics indeed

We know next to nothing about how the brain operates, and "brain chemistry" is a very blurry concept.

As someone mentioned, these things go hand in hand - and all we do and experience affects our brain in one way or the other, and we're nowhere near a stage where we can point out exactly what happens and when. To claim otherwise is blind faith in a pathetically incomplete science.

During the earliest years of our lives - our "brain chemistry" is obviously hugely affected by what happens around us and TO us. That includes the time we spend inside our mothers.

No, we don't pop out with a "clean slate" - but we also don't pop out as fully formed human beings with only one path to take. That would be the case if "genetics" was the only factor - and we all know that's bullshit.

Even in adults, you'll see major changes in personality and lifestyle - especially after traumatic or otherwise lifechanging events. Think war veterans or "born again christians" - things like that.

Claiming it's all genetic and "brain chemistry" is ridiculous, in my opinion.

I don't know what it is with people and their need to separate and divide these things in restrictive boxes.

It's very clear, to me anyway, that you can't separate the internal from the external - so we might as well give it up until we have something more than premature assumptions based on "areas of the brain" that light up during such and such.

Yes, we have done some research and yes, it seems something we choose to call Seratonin transmits signals using the nervous system - but we can't replace happiness and we can't generate lifestyle changes as we want, because we have no clue how to manipulate the brain on that level.

Essentially, we know next to nothing about the brain and we're still using people as lab rats - giving them pills because they seem to help in some ways. Whatever else those pills might do - is something we live with, because we just don't know any better.

It's simple, really. Once we actually KNOW something - we'll be able to cure people of their disorders and mental anguish.

Once that is the case, I'll concede we know enough about the brain to speak about it with authority.

Until then, the environment is an undeniable factor and a change there seems to be the only real way to something approaching a cure for these things. Now, there's also no denying that the environment has SOME effect on the "brain chemistry" - but I won't claim to understand it, because no one can as of yet.

Actually we know quite a lot about neuro transmitters and brain chemistry, but you're right that we're far from fully understanding the brain.

I'd say SSRI's can change people's life style, ADHD medicins too (i know people with ADHD and have seen the positive effect the drugs can have). It's not a complete cure and it can have side effects, sure. I personally like some St. John's Wort once in a while to fight off depression.. i've used it for 15 years or so, works quite well, i've tried many other SSRI's over the years too, i don't like most of them, makes me too sleepy (seems to really build up my melatonin levels instead of serotonin)

"Claiming it's all genetic and "brain chemistry" is ridiculous, in my opinion." No one has suggested it's just genetics or brain chemistry.

Then we probably agree for the most part, except that you seem to think more of our "knowledge" than I do.

Yes, we can help people to a certain extent - and some more than others. But we've yet to establish a cure for ANY disorder, as far as I'm aware. If we knew how the brain operated, logic dictates that we'd be able to do something about most or even any abnormalities.

But there's really no point in debating the finer points, when we essentially agree that there are more factors involved.

I'm sure many conditions could be cured without any medication at all, in many cases those disorders is just our brain/body's way of saying "you need to change what you're doing, otherwise i'm gonna make you feel shitty". It's a thing that's there for our own safety. But in this day and age it's hard to pin-point the wrongs, it's not like "oh i should probably stop eating the red berries, they make me feel bad after a while". We do all sorts of harm to ourselves, wrong food, wrong air, wrong life style. And often we're aware but just.. lazy.

I don't really buy into simplistic concepts like laziness. There's more to it in most cases, and if you're depressed or in a bad way in life - you don't have the same level of positive energy as a normal person would have.

There are countless factors involved, and I can't begin to quantify them on a level where I'd be comfortable calling people "lazy". It's like saying someone is of less value than another, which is something I feel completely unable to do.

But, yes, I do believe some disorders develop as a result of not responding wisely to the signals our own bodies and minds are sending. But those signals aren't always so easy to decipher, especially for a person who generally doesn't spend time looking inward.

We also have cultural and societal barriers preventing a lot of people from having the time or the state of mind required to analyse and understand what's happening inside them.

I think laziness is a consequence of a chain of events, which is more likely to happen to people with a certain set of genes.

However there is a way out of it, which is very simple, even if there is a strong sense of laziness, do it anyway, if you just are determined your genes will not acctually stop you from doing things... as you start doing more and more your laziness will for sure be less and less... just try it.

GothicGothicness said:

I think laziness is a consequence of a chain of events, which is more likely to happen to people with a certain set of genes.

However there is a way out of it, which is very simple, even if there is a strong sense of laziness, do it anyway, if you just are determined your genes will not acctually stop you from doing things… as you start doing more and more your laziness will for sure be less and less… just try it.

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The thing for me it the continuation of patterns, I cant for the life of me continue doing things. I start something and i push for 2-3 times of the same thing. People say it should get easier but it never does for me. And i quickly stop after that. Makes life really hell for things i dont really like doing.