15 vs 30 vs 60 fps

Unrestigered · August 8, 2015

I have a program called afterburner I use to limit fps to 30 because it uses less electricity and I read a long time ago that people's eyes can't process more than 30 fps, so any more is a waste.

I noticed on steam people make a huge deal about games, usually console ports, that are capped at 30 fps.

Looking into it again, it seems people really do see an improvement with more than 30 fps.

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html

That site has a comparison. I can clearly see a difference between 15 and 30, but 30 and 60 look the same to me.

I wonder what percentage of the population can see a difference and why? Are they more evolved, like people no longer being born with wisdom teeth? Or is it if you are just really in to visual quality little insignificant gains in any aspect are a big deal.

Sacred_Path · August 8, 2015

I don't think it's that hard to make out the stuttering on the way down in the 30 FPS example, but then again I'm a highly evolved ~~Neanderthal programmer~~ super mutant.

Unrestigered · August 8, 2015

Sacred_Path said:
I don't think it's that hard to make out the stuttering on the way down in the 30 FPS example, but then again I'm a highly evolved ~~Neanderthal programmer~~ super mutant.

Do you think you see it because you are more evolved? I know a lot of females are being born that can see more colors than others. We also have the wisdom teeth people. Maybe visual cortexes are evolving?

I have low special intelligence, do you think that is why? Have you ever taken an IQ test and do you know what your special intelligence is? My wife has high spatial intelligence and she was able to see a difference, but she is mad at me because I made myself breakfast like four hours before she got up so she wouldn't go into details.

I asked my kids and they see a difference (they also think the 15 is going father than the 30 which is going father than the 60).

They did point out and explain to me and I slightly saw the stuttering of the 30 going down. But I had to really, really look and focus hard to get it.

Sacred_Path · August 8, 2015

Unrestigered said:
Do you think you see it because you are more evolved? I know a lot of females are being born that can see more colors than others. We also have the wisdom teeth people. Maybe visual cortexes are evolving?

Since I'm not exactly new to this earth I don't think you could blame it on evolution but possibly on training. Allegedly kids are getting better and better at processing visual information due to exposure to more electronic entertainment at a younger age (with the downside of the development of attention deficit syndromes).

I have low special intelligence, do you think that is why? Have you ever taken an IQ test and do you know what your special intelligence is? My wife has high spatial intelligence and she was able to see a difference, but she is mad at me because I made myself breakfast like four hours before she got up so she wouldn't go into details.

I'm not one to brag but I have been known to cook minute rice in 59 seconds. That's all I can say.

CelticFrost · August 8, 2015

Sacred_Path said:
I'm not one to brag but I have been known to cook minute rice in 59 seconds. That's all I can say.

I call bullcrap on this. If you could cook rice in under a minute every restaurant in the world be knocking on your door day and night. LOL

danutz_plusplus · August 8, 2015

I'm in the 60fps is needed for ideal play camp. It's just a great feeling having your input be rendered at such a smooth rate. But it's not absolutely needed. I could still enjoy myself. Heck, most of my childhood I played games at about 30 fps because I couldn't afford the ultimate hardware. I remember playing Gothic 2, and it really stuttered in places. But the game was so good, I didn't notice it anymore.

And ultimately, the biggest difference in visual experience isn't necessarily gained by having the biggest fps. It's by having a consistent fps. If you can't keep a consistent 60fps you should just decrease visual settings to something your machine can sustain consistently.

So, for me at least, it goes in this order of preference:
1. 60+ fps consistently
2. 30-60 fps consistently
3. 30 fps consistently
4. 60 fps with random dips
5. 30 fps with random dips (if the game is really great, and I can just ignore the issues)
6. under 30 - borderline unplayable

Sacred_Path · August 9, 2015

CelticFrost said:
I call bullcrap on this. If you could cook rice in under a minute every restaurant in the world be knocking on your door day and night. LOL

JDR13 · August 9, 2015

I disagree that there's a certain FPS needed that applies to all games. It really depends on the type of game you're talking about.

For most first-person shooters, I can definitely tell if I'm dipping below 30 fps, and that's not acceptable to me. That also applies to other fast-paced games like racing games or certain space\flight sims. I also think it's easier to tell the difference in a game that uses a first or third person point of view.

If it's a slower-paced game, like TES or Gothic/Risen, then I don't feel much of a difference with anything over 30 FPS. I also can't tell the difference with games that use an overhead or isometric point of view unless the framerate dips extremely low, like less than 20.

joxer · August 9, 2015

Unrestigered said:
15 vs 30 vs 60 fps

15 FPS - phonegames crapware
30 FPS - consolegames garbage
60 FPS - glorious PC master race masterpieces

Man, do you have something that actually needs to be discussed?

Drithius · August 9, 2015

FPS > 30 matters plenty where user input is required. If you're watching a movie, then it doesn't matter.

wolfing · August 9, 2015

I'm ok between about 20 and 30. Less than 20 I notice, more than 30 I don't notice. Between 20 and 30 I may notice a little jump here and there, but not enough to break my enjoyment.

Zloth · August 9, 2015

I'm with JDR... it depends on the game. The more reaction time matters, the more framerate matters. Also, the more things change on the screen the more it matters. If you're whirling around in first person mode, the background changes a lot so I believe you'll notice the framerate a bit more.

So the first person shooters are big on the frames per second. RPGs are less so. Board games where reaction time is irrelevant and almost none of the screen changes could probably be OK dipping down to single digits... but they're trivial to draw so they never do.

Fighting games are an exception to the rule. They like to depend on an exact frames per second for the move timings. If you cut one designed for 60fps down to 30fps then the game will actually play at half speed to make sure every frame gets drawn!

Unrestigered · August 9, 2015

Zloth said:
Fighting games are an exception to the rule. They like to depend on an exact frames per second for the move timings. If you cut one designed for 60fps down to 30fps then the game will actually play at half speed to make sure every frame gets drawn!

That is interesting. What is a fighting game? Like Street Fighter?

I'm ok between about 20 and 30. Less than 20 I notice, more than 30 I don't notice. Between 20 and 30 I may notice a little jump here and there, but not enough to break my enjoyment.

So far it's just me and you. Have you ever tested your spatial intelligence?

wolfing · August 9, 2015

Unrestigered said:
That is interesting. What is a fighting game? Like Street Fighter?

So far it's just me and you. Have you ever tested your spatial intelligence?

spatial intelligence? what's that?

lackblogger · August 9, 2015

Unrestigered said:
I have low special intelligence, do you think that is why? Have you ever taken an IQ test and do you know what your special intelligence is?

I know it's a typo... but I still laughed... out loud

Unrestigered · August 9, 2015

lackblogger said:
I know it's a typo… but I still laughed… out loud

Jesus, that is funny. I'm an idiot. I did it more than once too.

spatial intelligence? what's that?

http://www.brainmetrix.com/spatial-intelligence/

It is also supposed to help with math, and certain fields of science.

How they test it is by giving you crazy mutated zombie DNA type pictures and asking which one either fits or doesn't fit. My wife scores significantly higher than I do on these tests, but she is Asian and really good at advanced math and memorizing nonsense like the periodic table.

There is another special intelligence only online test that did it very differently where my wife scored average and I scored above average, but it took like 4 minutes and didn't seem very trustworthy.

wolfing · August 10, 2015

Unrestigered said:
Jesus, that is funny. I'm an idiot. I did it more than once too.

http://www.brainmetrix.com/spatial-intelligence/

It is also supposed to help with math, and certain fields of science.

How they test it is by giving you crazy mutated zombie DNA type pictures and asking which one either fits or doesn't fit. My wife scores significantly higher than I do on these tests, but she is Asian and really good at advanced math and memorizing nonsense like the periodic table.

There is another special intelligence only online test that did it very differently where my wife scored average and I scored above average, but it took like 4 minutes and didn't seem very trustworthy.

if you give me a url I can check. I googled and tried some random site's test and it just told me I'm "slightly above average".

Unrestigered · August 10, 2015

wolfing said:
if you give me a url I can check. I googled and tried some random site's test and it just told me I'm "slightly above average".

I can't find a good one online like what I've seen in paid IQ tests.

DArtagnan · August 10, 2015

Personally, I've found that I can't fully enjoy any kind of action game that dips below ~45 FPS (except on rare occasions) - and I definitely prefer 60.

Ever since the flatpanel revolution, I've been stuck with the limitations of vsync and the 60 FPS cap, since I usually can't stand the tearing involved without it.

Thankfully, I've gotten too old to compete in (or enjoy) competitive shooters, which is pretty much the only genre that benefits from going beyond 60 FPS.

That's just me, however.

As for "registering" FPS, that seems to be a very subjective and touchy subject. That said, I have an extremely hard time believing people who claim they can't detect the difference between 30 and 60 FPS. Even when going from 60 to 100 FPS, for instance, I find there's a very noticable difference.

Doesn't mean it's "better" - just obviously different.

Zloth · August 14, 2015

Unrestigered said:
That is interesting. What is a fighting game? Like Street Fighter?

Yep.

So far it's just me and you. Have you ever tested your spatial intelligence?

Oh yeah, I rate 13 stars. That is to say… I got all the normal puzzles plus 13 stars in Talos Principle with absolutely no help from within or without the game. It's easily the best score I've seen posted here on the Watch! (Also the worst - but I'm sure that's just a fluke.)

15 vs 30 vs 60 fps

Banned

Sacred_Path

Guest

Banned

Sacred_Path

Guest

SasqWatch

SasqWatch

Sacred_Path

Guest

SasqWatch

The Smoker

Magic & Loss

Dalek SasqWatch

I smell a... wumpus!?

Banned

Dalek SasqWatch

SasqWatch

Banned

Dalek SasqWatch

Banned

DArtagnan

Guest

I smell a... wumpus!?