What games are you playing now?

wolfing · November 4, 2013

Just "finished" Risen. This would be a perfect example of how a reviewer should finish a game before reviewing it. In this case, if I had to write a review of Risen, I would have given it like an 80-85 for the first 2 chapters. If I had done it during my playing of chapter 3, it would have gone down to like 73. But after "finishing" it, I give it a 55/100.

Basically the first two chapters were great! Different factions, faction related quests, side quests, etc. But then chapter 3 threw all that away and it turned into a dungeon-after-dungeon killing the same 3 creatures over and over. And the end fight? LOL I can't think of one good thing to say about it. First, remember that character you built up for those 3 chapters, that fireball-hurling mage, or that sniper-archer? Well, forget them and the end fight you become a shield+hammer guy. Second, a big console-like enemy that pushes you, sends laser rays, drops your floor to the lava, etc. At the end I just went to youtube and watched the ending (which after killing the console-boss is just you walking away from the fight, game over).

Now back to EU4 for me.

Thrasher · November 4, 2013

Still playing New Vegas. I've joined the Brotherhood of Steel, and cleared South Vegas of Fiend radiers. Just started the Old World Blues DLC. Wow! Impressed so far. The silly over-the-top mad scientist vibe is just about perfect, although a bit too long winded at times. Also liking the Lovercraftian vibes regarding brains. However, as someone said on the forums, the enemies are major "bullet sponges". At least when they are level scaled up to 38. And once again, enemies respawn too quickly in an open world/zone setting. I really recommend to anyone that's a completist like me, to grab one of the XP reduction mods before starting if one intends to play all the DLC.

Ursusdraconis · November 4, 2013

Funny, i had exactly the same thoughts about risen as wolfling.

Decent game, but towards the end it got worse. I also did not finish the end boss but just watched it on youtube. Horrible ending!!!!

Thrasher · November 4, 2013

These Risen complaints, which I've heard before, BTW, don't resonate with me at all. The final boss was relatively easy, and I like dugeon crawls as much as large open world exploration (especially with secrets to find). I do think some people are too finicky though.

wolfing · November 5, 2013

Thrasher said:
These Risen complaints, which I've heard before, BTW, don't resonate with me at all. The final boss was relatively easy, and I like dugeon crawls as much as large open world exploration (especially with secrets to find). I do think some people are too finicky though.

It's not finicky at all, basically the final boss is like if you played a different game. The character fighting the boss is not your character at all (my mage never wore anything heavier than robes, suddenly he was wearing a full plate. He swung a sword a few times then a stick a few more times and then he just hurled fireballs left and right for most of his life, yet, he had to kill a God with a hammer he probably couldn't even lift. The boss fight was not how combat worked in the game, you couldn't block, chain attacks, move around. It basically was a console boss fight with QTE pretty much (wait for lasers, use shield, stun God, move and swing hammer once, hop over shockwaves). It really was like playing another game.

joxer · November 5, 2013

The complaint I believe is not if it's hard or easy, but the problem is it's big fat consoleboss. And we don't need that on PC, do we?

But I don't share the feeling, it was just a bit annoying boss, nothing more. I liked the game a lot.

Thrasher · November 5, 2013

The final boss was a very tiny part of the game. It wasn't a great climax. Too bad. Boo hoo. But so what?

The rest of the game was excellent (although I thought the magic system was kind of mediocre).

If you let the last minute of a game ruin the previous 40 hours of fun (much more for me, of course) you are definitely being entirely too picky and lose credibility around here... Unless you are joking...

See I'm giving you an out.

SpoonFULL · November 5, 2013

I agree with Wolfing's assessment on Risen; it was great until you had to give up all your hard earned kit and experience with the given armour to defeat the final boss (which involved running around the thing and button mashing it with the hammer). It also became stale in the last parts because of the dungeons and relatively limited exploration. Two worlds 2 I guess suffered from the same shortcomings and it was bashed more than Risen.

Nevertheless, Risen is still, compared with e.g. bioware games, one of the excellent rpgs around. I enjoyed the atmosphere, the combat and the overall Gothic 1 feel.

JDR13 · November 5, 2013

No, Thrasher is right for once.

While the last two chapters weren't as good as the first two, to claim Risen goes from an 85 to a 55 because of them is ridiculous. The final boss was an annoyance but nothing more. You're talking about a fight that takes all of 5 minutes if that.

SpoonFULL · November 5, 2013

It was not just the final boss. The last chapters before the final fight were almost linear and limited to following linear (main) quests and fighting in dungeons. I ran out of quests to do in the last two chapters to gain more experience and making the decision early on to commit to one of the two factions contributed to the game's limitations.

I would not go as far as giving it 55/100, but a good 75/100 at least for the gothic feel and early chapters.

txa1265 · November 5, 2013

Crap ... my earlier reply got eaten somewhere ...

My basic point is that I really like Risen, but ignoring or pooh-poohing its shortcomings is no better than amplifying them. So ...

Thrasher said:
The final boss was a very tiny part of the game. It wasn't a great climax. Too bad. Boo hoo. But so what?

Um, no it was an ATROCIOUS finale. 'Not great' doesn't cover it - it is like saying Dungeon Lords needed a bit more polish before release. Everything you worked for throughout the game was thrown away. Every system abandoned ... it was an affront to the rest of the game and an insult to the entire history of PB as developers.

Thrasher said:
The rest of the game was excellent (although I thought the magic system was kind of mediocre).

SOME of the game was excellent. OK, rather than keep going, here are a few quotes from my 2009 review:

for the first 20 or so hours while I played Risen I thought “this is MY RPG of the year”. Sadly I began to see some flaws at as I passed the half way point, so while I still consider Risen an excellent RPG it isn’t a ‘game of the year’ candidate – it falls below the classic Gothic and Gothic II, but ahead of the overly ambitious Gothic 3.

And here I clarify that a bit:

after the first half of the game, the rest of the game has the world, the quests, and the scope of the experience constantly shrinking.

As for the finale:

Risen has one of the worst and most unsatisfying end-battles in recent years.

So yeah it is a very good game, and remains a game I very much like ... but let us not pretend it is all butterflies and unicorns.

Thrasher · November 5, 2013

Well to each his own. I LIKED the dungeon crawl in the last chapter. And the dungeon was far from linear if you wanted to get to everything. If you don't like that well too bad. I thought it was excellent for what it was.

As far the the boss finale goes. Really? They are almost always crap. They should be forever banned from all future games. I though the finale was crap for Gothic 2 and Gothic 1 too. So there. But I still think those games are excellent. I have yet to remember a final boss that wasn't a let down, or exercise in frustration.

wolfing · November 5, 2013

txa1265 said:
Crap … my earlier reply got eaten somewhere …

My basic point is that I really like Risen, but ignoring or pooh-poohing its shortcomings is no better than amplifying them. So …

Um, no it was an ATROCIOUS finale. 'Not great' doesn't cover it - it is like saying Dungeon Lords needed a bit more polish before release. Everything you worked for throughout the game was thrown away. Every system abandoned … it was an affront to the rest of the game and an insult to the entire history of PB as developers.

SOME of the game was excellent. OK, rather than keep going, here are a few quotes from my 2009 review:

And here I clarify that a bit:

As for the finale:

So yeah it is a very good game, and remains a game I very much like … but let us not pretend it is all butterflies and unicorns.

Wow, I didn't read this review back then, but holy crap it hits it spot on! Like I said, chapters 1 and 2 were great. I did experience two nasty bugs (one I could console-fix, one I couldn't) but since they weren't part of the main quest, no major harm done. Chapter 3 was a bore-fest and looooong. Final battle was a joke. So yes, my 55/100 remains (ok, maaaybe 60), not only because of the boss fight, but also because of the bugs, the weak magic system, the boring chapter 3 (1/3rd of the game) and the ending (or lack thereof).

txa1265 · November 5, 2013

I know we are focusing on Risen too much ... but I would still give it a 8/10. I put a heavy tilt in for the first half being right up my gaming alley

Donkerman · November 5, 2013

I think Risen was one the most bug free rpgs produced in recent times, especially coming from the over ambitous PB. If you compare it to Gothic 3 the word perfection comes to mind. Anyway compared to rpgs produced in the last decade its probably in the top 10 or 5 so theres no reason to diss it.

DArtagnan · November 5, 2013

I'm sort of in the middle - though I'm fully capable of appreciating why people would rate it much lower than myself.

Overall, Risen is probably 7/10 to me - and the last chapter was a HUGE letdown. The last boss is a joke - but I guess I'm used to end bosses being jokes, so it didn't completely ruin my experience - it just left a bad taste that might have been sweetened over time, as nostalgia set in. So, I think the worst thing about that boss fight is that it stands as a beacon in my memory of why I shouldn't replay it - because it represents and illuminates the quality of the entire last act

That said, if act 3 had kept the quality of the first two acts - Risen might actually have exceeded Gothic (the first one) and become my favorite PB game.

txa1265 · November 5, 2013

DArtagnan said:
That said, if act 3 had kept the quality of the first two acts - Risen might actually have exceeded Gothic (the first one) and become my favorite PB game.

Totally agree with this (even though I slightly prefer G2 to G1, but hey). The degree (for me) to which a bad ending impacts overall impression of the game depends upon (a) how bad the ending is (b) the game as a whole and (c) the sections leading right up to it.

wolfing · November 5, 2013

First date: The woman is beautiful and funny, great prospect!
Second date: She's also smart and likes dogs, a keeper!
Third date: She says if we get married she'll bring her mother to the house, so I said "ok, not marrying material but at least we'll have fun tonight!"
We go to my house, I get in bed, she takes off her clothes, and she's actually a man!

That's more or less my experience with Risen.

DArtagnan · November 5, 2013

But you failed to mention whether or not that last discovery was a bad thing?

wolfing · November 6, 2013

DArtagnan said:
But you failed to mention whether or not that last discovery was a bad thing?

that's why my review of the 'woman' went from 80-85 to 55

What games are you playing now?

Dalek SasqWatch

Wheeee!

Watchbear

Wheeee!

Dalek SasqWatch

The Smoker

Wheeee!

SasqWatch

SasqWatch

SasqWatch

SasqWatch

Wheeee!

Dalek SasqWatch

SasqWatch

Watchdog

DArtagnan

Guest

SasqWatch

Dalek SasqWatch

DArtagnan

Guest

Dalek SasqWatch