The Cesspool

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Censorship, to a degree, is required for safety. Yelling out "fire" in a crowded theater will get you arrested, and that is a form of censorship. Same for threatening to end someone's life, or harm them in some fashion. Both are censorship.

Basically, if you don't want your son or daughter either being seen in it or saying it, don't post it.
Your examples of censorship are indeed needed but are extremes and don't apply to an internet forum's rants and ramblings of which cause no harm nor threaten it. Discussing transexuals, making racist statements and generally shunning everything mainstream are well protected rights in America. There are many public places in which one can discuss such things, just as the Codex is on the internet. Would you choose to censor a KKK rally or even MTV's old show Love Line which discussed detailed sexual issues, both of the normal and more abnormal variety? One could walk outside to see one or flip on the TV to see the other.

Cable TV can air anything they want at risk to advertising revenue and almost any child has access to basic cable channels. If one chose to air questionable material, would you ask for it to be taken off or take steps to moderate your child's ability to view it? This is the difference in philosophy when it comes to moderation.

I've moderated many a forum and feel that sometimes letting the line blur allows deeper, more fulfilling discussion with the downside of adding more difficulty to the moderator's job to keep it civil. If one really cares about their community, they will go that extra step to keep all lines open, so to speak and learn to adapt to the community rather than having it conform to their personal viewpoints on different "touchy" subjects.

I would assume if one did not want their children reading a certain forum one would do better to monitor their children, especially their internet surfing. Logically, there has to be an environment for adults to let loose of the "child appropriate" discussion handcuffs and the Codex serves this purpose, admittedly almost too well. Codex's registration age is 13, while we can all agree it is not a PG-13 forum, so maybe by bumping the age requirement would minimize some issue people have with it? If you are forewarned of the mature nature one could hardly complain about what they find within.

I may be in the minority but I found the misdirecting tubgirl links hilarious, but then again I don't take myself or my internet experience too seriously. It's a laugh and then move on. For what it's worth, they, at least at one time, were really cutting down on false hotlinking making it a bannable offense.

While many view the Codex as a cesspool, you have to realize that many at the Codex view other forums, including this one, as "kiddie glove" forums. The Codex sees itself as extreme dodgeball and sees other forums as invisible jump-rope (or whatever nonsense our Public School System is pushing out this week..). I prefer knowing any discussion is exactly what the poster feels without feeling the need to tip-toe around the subject. Being in-your-face and honest has a strange feeling of.. purity.

It's a matter of taste, as all things.
 
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Yes, but don't forget that this is NOT an American site/forum, but an international one. What may be found/accepted in the US, is not necessarily what the rest of the world expects. Horses for courses!! :)
 
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Yes, but don't forget that this is NOT an American site/forum, but an international one. What may be found/accepted in the US, is not necessarily what the rest of the world expects. Horses for courses!! :)
Every culture has varying topics and lifestyles they find acceptable. Trying to please all of them would prove.. difficult. If a country of 300 million can hardly agree on things, how can a planet of 6.6+ billion? In the end it will still be up to the moderating team and admins to determine what is acceptable and it is there where I believe allowing more user freedom is a boon rather than the burden it is usually perceived as.

But as I said, each forum is different and fits the tastes of it's community.
 
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Your examples of censorship are indeed needed but are extremes and don't apply to an internet forum's rants and ramblings of which cause no harm nor threaten it. Discussing transexuals, making racist statements and generally shunning everything mainstream are well protected rights in America. There are many public places in which one can discuss such things, just as the Codex is on the internet. Would you choose to censor a KKK rally or even MTV's old show Love Line which discussed detailed sexual issues, both of the normal and more abnormal variety? One could walk outside to see one or flip on the TV to see the other.
I'd "censor" the KKK rally via driving a 1974 Dodge Monaco ex-Cop car at them. While on a mission from God, of course. ;)

Discussing transsexuals, being racist, and shunning mainstream isn't hardly the same as blocking porn, child porn, and shutting down arguments made for the sake of arguing. As long as the discussion is on topic, I've allowed that to happen before. Most I'll do is split a topic, and move into a more approriate forum (such as "off-topic", where everything else seems to go).

Cable TV can air anything they want at risk to advertising revenue and almost any child has access to basic cable channels. If one chose to air questionable material, would you ask for it to be taken off or take steps to moderate your child's ability to view it? This is the difference in philosophy when it comes to moderation.
Wrong. Ask the FCC. Basic Cable won't show nudity, excessive violence (though what is excessive and what isn't has changed over the years) or porn. If they did, they'd be liable to fines. You have to move up to premium packages, which often show at most softcore nudity, and then only during very late hours (when 99% of kids are in bed).

TV is also not the internet; where kids often know vastly more about the systems used to access it than their parents. On the internet, a hidden taskbar, a quick hotkey, and a extra browser open and little johnny can be right in front of mommy and daddy, looking at the porn you posted to the codex forums.

I've moderated many a forum and feel that sometimes letting the line blur allows deeper, more fulfilling discussion with the downside of adding more difficulty to the moderator's job to keep it civil. If one really cares about their community, they will go that extra step to keep all lines open, so to speak and learn to adapt to the community rather than having it conform to their personal viewpoints on different "touchy" subjects.

You've shown you really don't know what line is which.

I would assume if one did not want their children reading a certain forum one would do better to monitor their children, especially their internet surfing. Logically, there has to be an environment for adults to let loose of the "child appropriate" discussion handcuffs and the Codex serves this purpose, admittedly almost too well. Codex's registration age is 13, while we can all agree it is not a PG-13 forum, so maybe by bumping the age requirement would minimize some issue people have with it? If you are forewarned of the mature nature one could hardly complain about what they find within.

Minimum age reqs are worthless. All it takes is altering your birth year and not telling anyone on the forums about it. The best forum I've seen with dealing iwth it while allowing such stuff to be posted is a FPS community forum, where only the admin allows access to the sub-forum where that's allowed. We all know each other pretty well, so the kiddies never get in there.

See above for parental guidance. The kid likely can disable any "parental controls" more easily than they can be set, assuming they even work. It's absurdly easy to hide what you are doing on a computer; just ask anyone whose played Quake at work. A pair of headphones, a few tweaks. Heck, Ubuntu has multiple workspaces, so little Johnny could have his porn on one workspace, a game on another. And no one can be there every second.

I may be in the minority but I found the misdirecting tubgirl links hilarious, but then again I don't take myself or my internet experience too seriously. It's a laugh and then move on. For what it's worth, they, at least at one time, were really cutting down on false hotlinking making it a bannable offense.

Misdirecting links I view as a danger. Too many viruses and trojans, and no anti-virus or firewall can catch everyone. I catch anyone misdirecting links, for whatever reason, and their account is suspended for admin review, or if it's my forum, banned. Spambots use that tactic. It also means that any parent might look at the site, think it's ok, then Johnny clicks a link that claimed to be to some game site, and went to a porn site, or worse. I've had to go back and fix computers because of misdirecting links on forums, that little johnny clicked innocently.

While many view the Codex as a cesspool, you have to realize that many at the Codex view other forums, including this one, as "kiddie glove" forums. The Codex sees itself as extreme dodgeball and sees other forums as invisible jump-rope (or whatever nonsense our Public School System is pushing out this week..). I prefer knowing any discussion is exactly what the poster feels without feeling the need to tip-toe around the subject. Being in-your-face and honest has a strange feeling of.. purity.

It's a matter of taste, as all things.
The fact that your forum deliberately posts misdirecting links, often to porn (which also screws up the kid-safe part as well; fake links little Johnny thinks lead to a new game lead to some gangbang website instead), and even more often to malware and viruses (which again, no protective software can ever catch all of it). THAT is at issue. Not on-topic discussions, nor letting people air their opinions out freely. They can do that here, just as easily.

The codex is more a highly inferior forum, hiding beneath vain claims of "maturity" when it's little more than middle school toilet humor and mentally 12 year olds leeching porn and spam; with a few good discussions mixed in on occasion. It's not a matter of taste (unless it's a lack thereof). No competent forum disallows full discussion, but also no competent forum would tolerate such nonsense as porn links hidden behind fake tags. Nor threats, which are often taken very seriously. Hell, my uncle; a police officer, told me I should have reported when someone threatened to shoot me one time on a forum.

The codex has a feeling of idiocy mixed with incredible immaturity. Still, you'd be welcome on my forums or the ones I moderate, provided you followed the rules.
 
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If you want mature discussion, try our P&R forum. I allow most anything except personal attacks and overdone foul language. The idea is to permit full and frank discussion of issues and ideas. We have a very broad spectrum who mostly show some degree of respect for the other participants. Politeness, manners and respect are not signs of being 'kiddies', rather they are the signs of being an adult in a multi-cultural, multi-racial world!!
 
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The fact that your forum deliberately posts misdirecting links, often to porn (which also screws up the kid-safe part as well).

This almost never happens anymore. And anyway its sort of like natural selection. I guarantee once you see goatse looking you in the eye you learn not to blind click again.

It's not a matter of taste (unless it's a lack thereof). No competent forum disallows full discussion, but also no competent forum would tolerate such nonsense as porn links hidden behind fake tags. Nor threats, which are often taken very seriously. Hell, my uncle; a police officer, told me I should have reported when someone threatened to shoot me one time on a forum.

No one ever shows up for the fights arranged at the codex. It's very depressing. Sheek and Trash both took considerable crap for wimping out on the last one.

On the plus side the admin suspended the person who posted the pictures of the dead cats.

To sum up:

rpgcodex.png
 
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Your examples of censorship are indeed needed but are extremes and don't apply to an internet forum's rants and ramblings of which cause no harm nor threaten it. Discussing transexuals, making racist statements and generally shunning everything mainstream are well protected rights in America. There are many public places in which one can discuss such things, just as the Codex is on the internet. Would you choose to censor a KKK rally or even MTV's old show Love Line which discussed detailed sexual issues, both of the normal and more abnormal variety? One could walk outside to see one or flip on the TV to see the other.

I'd "censor" the KKK rally via driving a 1974 Dodge Monaco ex-Cop car at them. While on a mission from God, of course. ;)

Discussing transsexuals, being racist, and shunning mainstream isn't hardly the same as blocking porn, child porn, and shutting down arguments made for the sake of arguing. As long as the discussion is on topic, I've allowed that to happen before. Most I'll do is split a topic, and move into a more approriate forum (such as "off-topic", where everything else seems to go).
Firstly, I've never seen child porn on the Codex, so I have no idea why you bring this up.

How is nudity an issue while posting many screenshots of simulated gore (FO3 comes to mind) goes without a batted eyelash? This denouncing to anything sexual and the accepting of violence to me is rather a disgusting double-standard. We should allow screenshots from Mature rated videogame titles but mature rated nudity-driven movie or pictures is a bad thing? I don't see this as a healthy distinction, rather a sexual hang-up. They are both mature content, and as such should be treated the same. If one should be disallowed, then it should apply to both.

Wrong. Ask the FCC. Basic Cable won't show nudity, excessive violence (though what is excessive and what isn't has changed over the years) or porn. If they did, they'd be liable to fines. You have to move up to premium packages, which often show at most softcore nudity, and then only during very late hours (when 99% of kids are in bed).
As long as the cable channels properly label their broadcasts with the TV ratings system they can play whatever they like, but as I stated they do so based on advertising revenue and backlash. Look at Comedy Central's uncut comedy shows, complete with every f-bomb you can imagine.

TV is also not the internet; where kids often know vastly more about the systems used to access it than their parents. On the internet, a hidden taskbar, a quick hotkey, and a extra browser open and little johnny can be right in front of mommy and daddy, looking at the porn you posted to the codex forums.
Why would a parent allow their children to use a device they cannot monitor or have any knowledge of? This is an example of poor parenting, nothing more. There are a multitude of site blockers, loggers and cached history programs one could use to limit or monitor their children's PC usage. To blame the internet, or sites on the internet for what amounts to a child injuring themselves in a sandbox while unsupervised is ridiculous. It's a parents duty to protect their children, not the moderators of websites. American parents are far too quick to point the blame anywhere other than their own materialistic needs that force both parents into full-time jobs to afford their 46" HDTV's all while leaving their children free reign while they're out.

You've shown you really don't know what line is which.
And you've shown your incredible arrogance to think you can determine that line for other parties and websites. As previously stated, it is a matter of taste, yet you believe your taste should be universally applied. This is a puritan stance and is generally not highly regarded.

Minimum age reqs are worthless. All it takes is altering your birth year and not telling anyone on the forums about it. The best forum I've seen with dealing iwth it while allowing such stuff to be posted is a FPS community forum, where only the admin allows access to the sub-forum where that's allowed. We all know each other pretty well, so the kiddies never get in there.
What do you propose then? You seem to hate everything about it but have yet to provide any viable option other than strict censorship. Censorship is the easy way out.. the lazy route, so to speak. There are many ways to tackle issues other than pressing a quick "can't do this" button. It is a forum, different than your own, and as such shouldn't be held to your standards. If they don't find pornography (which are now almost always NSFW tagged) offensive, then why would they censor it for the sake of uninterested parents?

Age requirements give a good warning of what to expect. Kids can sneak (read: pay and walk in) into rated-R movies, does that mean we should simply censor the movies from here on out? No, that's ridiculous. Yet you expect the same from another outlet.

See above for parental guidance. The kid likely can disable any "parental controls" more easily than they can be set, assuming they even work. It's absurdly easy to hide what you are doing on a computer; just ask anyone whose played Quake at work. A pair of headphones, a few tweaks. Heck, Ubuntu has multiple workspaces, so little Johnny could have his porn on one workspace, a game on another. And no one can be there every second.
You're now moving the goal posts. Originally you were worried about children randomly stumbling on the Codex and being horrified by the posts. This is now gone from that to the kids covertly surfing the internet with IT-like efficiency. If they're doing that, they're already hiding something so Codex wouldn't be an issue, would it?

If your child is sophisticated enough to do all that, he likely isn't viewing the Codex. More likely on forums dedicated to such things, and as such you have more important things to worry about than tubgirl links on an internet forum, don't you? If your child is a male and over 14, he's already looking at internet porn anyway, so what's the issue with the Codex exactly? A quick google search would give better results and would be just as difficult for parents to monitor. Should google ban porn links too? I want to see such a firm stance applied to all public websites then.

Misdirecting links I view as a danger. Too many viruses and trojans, and no anti-virus or firewall can catch everyone. I catch anyone misdirecting links, for whatever reason, and their account is suspended for admin review, or if it's my forum, banned. Spambots use that tactic. It also means that any parent might look at the site, think it's ok, then Johnny clicks a link that claimed to be to some game site, and went to a porn site, or worse. I've had to go back and fix computers because of misdirecting links on forums, that little johnny clicked innocently.
I agree, though the ones on Codex were hotlinking a single image, not an embedded image on a website. Therefor, I found it hilarious because it caused no harm to my PC. Linking to malware sites would be punishable, not for the image or site, but for the malware itself. This is a distinction that must be made. If one hitlinked to a game preview site that had malware as well, this should be considered the same. They are not different scenarios.

Like I said, they cut out the false links, so the rest of your point on the issue doesn't pertain to the Codex's current state of affairs.

The codex is more a highly inferior forum, hiding beneath vain claims of "maturity" when it's little more than middle school toilet humor and mentally 12 year olds leeching porn and spam; with a few good discussions mixed in on occasion. It's not a matter of taste (unless it's a lack thereof). No competent forum disallows full discussion, but also no competent forum would tolerate such nonsense as porn links hidden behind fake tags. Nor threats, which are often taken very seriously. Hell, my uncle; a police officer, told me I should have reported when someone threatened to shoot me one time on a forum.
Wow. Talk about going to the extreme of high and mighty. I'll leave it at that..
 
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If you want mature discussion, try our P&R forum. I allow most anything except personal attacks and overdone foul language. The idea is to permit full and frank discussion of issues and ideas. We have a very broad spectrum who mostly show some degree of respect for the other participants. Politeness, manners and respect are not signs of being 'kiddies', rather they are the signs of being an adult in a multi-cultural, multi-racial world!!
Thank you but I try not to discuss P&R mostly due to it being either too polarizing or most participants already having concreted their stance making discussion worthless really.

I apologize for getting off-topic here.
 
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I have hundreds of posts there going back to 2003 or so. I don't really visit any more and haven't posted for a long time. In my opinion, the complete lack of moderation has reached its endpoint: the forums are a beacon to idiots who flock there to participate only in the anarchy and that overwhelms any useful discussion.

I'm sure old-timers like St Proverbius would disagree with me but it used to be a much better place when posters like that were still around.

Still, diversity is always a good thing, so each to their own. There are certainly advantages to no modeation, so I can understand a different point of view.
 
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As long as the cable channels properly label their broadcasts with the TV ratings system they can play whatever they like, but as I stated they do so based on advertising revenue and backlash. Look at Comedy Central's uncut comedy shows, complete with every f-bomb you can imagine.

Big difference, Comedy Central's "uncut" material only airs from Midnight till about 4am.

Anyways, I wouldn't go so far as to call the Codex a "cesspool", it's an unfair label that generalizes about a diverse crowd. I simply find many people there to be annoyingly immature.
 
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Censoring the corruption will not save the youth! Certainly laws exist to protect citizens, mostly from themselves and others, but on an internet forum, the concept of law is somewhat blurred, in terms of discussion. At any time, one can simply walk away and there is no fear of mortal injury, loss of possession, or any other factor from which a law need protect.

Moderation exists to remove spamming, mostly. Beyond that, it's probably just some self-righteous ploy to impose power onto those whom you control. It's the whole power corrupts sentiment, and moderation is just that. Eventually, the forum becomes a sample of bias straight from a few of the moderator's handbook. Gone is the hope of new ideals and insightful(even if it is offensive sometimes) inquiry into the bounds of internet debate.

Just saying… ;P

Edit:

In fact, the Codex offers something that cannot be found almost anywhere else. The ability to talk to someone in a way that you would never dare talk to them in real life. No subject, word, belief, style, etc is off limits. Nothing! Maybe there is a reason for keeping these things out of every day life, and maybe we're bound to learn a valuable lesson at some point, but ultimately it opens a door from which communication cannot happen in non-virtual means. You might even call it an experiment of communication without rules and without repercussions. This is the value!
 
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Censorship makes the youth less adapted to handle the real world. My experience with those who were over protected is that they were damaged by the protection rather than helped, which causes major problems in the adult years.

However, in a small community there are codes of conduct which makes the community keep on topic in a friendly manner. If there are people who makes a habit out of being rude or offensive, the community creates a different environment, one that might not be suited for it's original purpose.

In my initial visit to RPG Codex I was greeted with shock images, kinda like "welcome to the forum, here is a link that will help you out". I am not a rookie, I recognized the links without even clicking on them. After finding out that the behavior was common, I ceased to visit the site. I already had RPGWatch, which I consider to be an intellectual and mature forum, and Flashback, which is an "everything goes" deal.
 
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gives me a feeling of glowing pride that the priscillas who would run to mommy I mean the mods to make the bad man go away when they hear something they don't like keep away from the codex

emot-frogc00l.gif
 
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Yes, but don't forget that this is NOT an American site/forum, but an international one. What may be found/accepted in the US, is not necessarily what the rest of the world expects. Horses for courses!! :)

By your definition the Codex is an international site too. RPGWatch being hosted form Germany doesn't make it a site for Germans, so why should you assume that the Codex is built for Americans? You're from Australia, so you probably know a thing or two about censorship, and would probably find it interesting that a lot of Australian sites are hosted in the US. Would you call those sites American or Australian?
 
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I sort of agree about RPG Codex forums.

What i really dont like is the causal swearing at people for no obvious reasons other than fools blowing off steam anonymously.
 
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gives me a feeling of glowing pride that the priscillas who would run to mommy I mean the mods to make the bad man go away when they hear something they don't like keep away from the codex

Rhetoric of a schoolyard bully gives no points when it comes to making a point in front of mature adults.
 
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Well done elkston... now you have brought a bunch of the codexers over here.... :p

Anyway I think this discussion is kind of pointless, there are certainly a kind of people who loves forums with no censorship, or loves to act like idiots, and other people who are really smart but loves to make fun of the idiots, and a lot of things in between.

There are also people who like a more clean and mature forum such as RPGWatch where we can discuss in peace without having to deal with those kinds of things. To each his own! Of course some friendly "competition" never hurts, it is kind of fun after all.
 
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I can post pr0n links and talk the way i like in the codex ? this is awesome but why do it in a gaming forum ?

The best way to protect kids is to not make them in the first place, i don't see why they are more important from my amusement , "please think of the children" policies = 100% discrimination .
I hate censorship ... it is the internet , if you don't like it then don't click it.

A thing about racists , ok they are annoying and "politically wrong" but can you imagine a village without it's idiot ? I find all this "we don't tolerate racism" policies fun blocking .
Culture speaking : i am member of few forums , being posting here and there for like 11-12 years ; what i have learn is that each forum has it's own culture and nationalities have little importance.
 
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