RPGWatch Feature: A Long And Disappointing Summer

Alrik Fassbauer said:

Yes, I've seen that on the Gamestar site comments regarding Arcania. Some people just don't seem to be interested in role-playing value or story; a good-looking game seems to be all they want (and need).

And the "big ones" in the gaming industry are just supporting them …

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And I don't have a problem with that - for many folks, a nice realistic looking diversion is all they want for their game time ... we are the odd and shrinking minority for being willing to put up with bugs and other problems to get a deeper, more demanding and conflicted experience.

The problem most of us have is when the games & franchises we love are transformed into experiences that could be played with an 'easy button' (i.e. Staples store ad for non-N.A. folks)

Well, a good game is for me everything about balance, so to say.
Balance between look and content, for example.
And about "optionality" for those who want a thing turned on and others off.

Probably the best copy protection that actually stopped online pirating for over a year on many top rated games was pushed out the of the EU/NA industry through lies and propaganda that started by pirating community and snowballed through others who just added their own lies. The company that made this copy protection even had a deal where you would go to their offices with your computer to reproduce the problem, and they would give you $1000 plus expenses paid for the trip to their office. No one ever took them on their offer, not even the hundred of thousand people who live near the office would take them up on their offer.

Anyways, we probably wouldn't have these online DRMs if it wasn't for lies and propaganda against software offline based copy protection like this one.

Some people even claim that DRM = Virus.

I guess they've never been victims of REAL viruses performing damaging of data and identity theft.

Alrik Fassbauer said:

Some people even claim that DRM = Virus

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Some DRM forms have been very close to being viruses (Sony's rootkit IIRC) and have caused a lot of issues.

The only time I can truly recall having DRM issues was DarkStar One. It didn't recognise the disc despite the disc being in the drive, and I'd literally just installed it.

Eisberg said:

Anyways, we probably wouldn't have these online DRMs if it wasn't for lies and propaganda against software offline based copy protection like this one.

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Ah StarForce ... while I think the reality was much more tame than the drama would have you believe, they DID grant ring 0 access, reboot without warning / permission, and could potentially have provided the security hole many claimed. StarForce was not innocent. It was heinous and aggressive DRM. But as you say ... which is worse, that or what we have now?

I've yet to encounter a single issue with StarForce on any of the systems I've had over the years. Not saying other people haven't, maybe I've just been lucky...

Egosoft removed starforce from X2 shortly after release because it was malware, they know better.

txa1265 said:

My point - and why I said I was putting them on 'Troika Watch' is that the general public - particularly console gamers - would rather have a polished generic game (e.g. Halo franchise) than the 'flawed brilliance' of Obsidian or Troika.

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I really hope that the MoTB / New Vegas / Dungeon Siege approach is their new model. Take an existing engine, don't try and do anything clever with it and focus on great writing.

Well, assuming that new vegas and dungeon siege are actually any good.

JDR13 said:

I've yet to encounter a single issue with StarForce on any of the systems I've had over the years. Not saying other people haven't, maybe I've just been lucky…

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I have never had an issue with ANY DRM, fortunately ... but aside from the Mac version of Settlers VII I reviewed (review copy), I haven't let any of the UbiSoft stuff on my system ...

Dwagginz said:

Some DRM forms have been very close to being viruses (Sony's rootkit IIRC) and have caused a lot of issues.

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A rootkit in itself is just a rootkit, nothing else.

It an't even a virus.

Because virii are defined by malicious functions, like stealing and/or corrupting data.
Rootkits in themselves are only there for hiding, a totally different task.

You don't call camouflage nets as bombs, either.

Of course both can be combined, but I believe it is better to stick to clear definitions.

Defining a rootkit as a virus just creates an unhealthy form of mish-mash.

Tragos said:

Egosoft removed starforce from X2 shortly after release because it was malware, they know better.

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Statements like this onl distract from the REAL malware.
It nothing but downplays the aggressiveness of REAL virii.

Because calling copy protections as virii, ALTHOUGH they DON'T harm most systems in fact is like calling a Cheeseburger poison.

Calling something that doesn't harm most systems as a virus is the same as I would say that a virus actually doesn't harm most systems - because you put both into the same pot.

If a copy protection system is a virus - how do you call a virus, then ? A copy-protection ?

If ANYTHING is a virus at last, which thing can we trust, then ?

ANY GAME could THEN be a VIRUS - because it uses a virus as a copy protection, so to speak.

Alrik Fassbauer said:

A rootkit in itself is just a rootkit, nothing else.

It an't even a virus.

Because virii are defined by malicious functions, like stealing and/or corrupting data.

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If you reread my post, you'll see I never called them a virus, only that they can come close to acting like them.

In my view, rootkits are only tools.

Used by people.

Some of them with not very good intentions.


But I really don't like this mixing with definitions.

Alrik Fassbauer said:

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So a program that collects info of your rack and send it over the internet isn't stealing data? ( securom)
A program that stops your computer running legit owned programs like DVD copy ones is not a virus ? (securom)
A program that fatigues your physical DVD player so much that it gets out of order long before it's day is what? (securom)
A program that installs itself silent and you can not remove it without seriously screwing your O/S does not corrupt data? (starforce)
A program that does not get removed after you uninstall the game it came with is what? (starforce, securom)
How you will call a program that insta gets access to the highest factions of your O/S & sets itself to bypass firewall ? (securom)
DRM that forces you to play only when connected to to internet , on Dev's fucked up servers and you have to replay 1 hour when connection is lost is what? ( Silent Hunter)
DRM that makes you LOAN something you have pay full price for because half of the game isn't in the dvd is what? ( Silent Hunter )

There is a big load of horseshit there , DRM = FAIL and this is why i am always , always using cracks on games i buy .

Interesting : This is post number 666 from you by now.

So far, I had no problems with DRMs- only that older Securom versions appear to be incompatible with newer ones.

Plus : Here we have a law (as far as I know) that the box must describe correctly the "contents" (I don't know how far this ggoes, since I'm not a lawyer), so a game like Silent Hunter should be advertised as you describe it - otherwise it would be a money-back thing, because they didn't explain *everything* to the customer on the box.
This is at least how I understood it.

By the way, you write :

How you will call a program that insta gets access to the highest factions of your O/S & sets itself to bypass firewall ? (securom)

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Then programs like Skype are virii, too, because they actually do "install" their own exception rules into the Microsoft Firewall.

There ARE programs and games which do this. Unwanted, unasked.

Let me take a look into my Microsoft Firewall.

It lists among the exceptions which I guess come from the system the following exception rules :

- EA Battle Of Middlearth (or how it is called in English language)
- Easyshare 8belongs to my digital camers)
- SiSoftware Deployment Agend (I think SiSoft's benchmarking & information program called "Sandra" is relatively well known)
- SiSoft Sandra Agent Service
- Kaspersky AV Scanner (I had it ONCE … but that's long ago. Why is this exception rule still there ?)

Skype is reported by my trusted computing magazine to do its own exception rules as well, as the Windows Media Player (UPNP Network).

So, this shouldn't be, but these pograms are still no virii.

Besides: horseshit is known to be an excellent fertilizer for plants. I know that some people even collect it and place it under their plants, REAL gardeners !

Alrik Fassbauer said:

snip!

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Thank you for cherry picking one of my questions , but i am not at all thankful for answering only half of it.

If you meant the last part of your post as an insult i 'd advise you to learn how to insult like a man.

I don't want to insult like a man, because I find no fun in it.

And I'm an alien anyway, remember ?