Darkest Dungeon - New Preview Roundup

Couchpotato

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Here is new roundup of previews for Darkest Dungeon I found this week.

Cliqist
The unpredictability of Darkest Dungeon creates emotional turmoil for characters, and upon returning to town they have several de-stressing options. Some heroes prefer the pub, always a commendable choice, while others opt for the cathedral. It’s another setting in which the player must adapt to their heroes, and accordingly to Darkest Dungeon.
PC Gamer
I’m just a dozen hours into Darkest Dungeon, but I’m already in love with it. Even at this stage of Steam Early Access, it’s kicking ass on just about every level. Darkest Dungeon is a great example of what modern roguelikes, and community-funded PC gaming, can be.
Continue-Play
If you’re one of those people who abhors the idea of buying an Early Access title for fear of wasting your money, throw that notion in the dirt right now. Even at this stage, Darkest Dungeon is one of the best games I’ve played in a very long time, and only $20 in Early Access will net you plenty of content, with plenty more to come added in the way of free updates.
Over Mental
You die. More specifically your party members die. In Darkest Dungeon you’re the heir to a damned estate, and it’s your job to lead expeditions of 4 people down into the depths of the darkest dungeon and rid your family’s land from an evil curse. The end goal seems to be fighting the final boss who appears to be some sort of Cthulu like presence, but it seems like the main enemy isn’t a boss but rather the darkness and madness that overtakes your adventurers.
GameSpot
I'm drawn to games that trade in this kind of desolation and desperation. Of course, art and audio are part of a greater whole that includes the actual adventure, about which I'll have more to say when Darkest Dungeon is released next month. Even now, however, it's clear that the game's art style and soundtrack have an important message to convey: you were right all along to be afraid of the dark.
RPGFan
Darkest Dungeon, even with an estimated six months left in development, feels remarkably polished, deep and, most of all, incredibly fun. It's just the right amount of stress, failure and triumph to demand your attention and keep you focused on the quest at hand.
More information.
 
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They have an overall setting that implies low healing availability, with special camping skills assigned for that, yet there is a simple free healing skill that works during combat, but disabled out of combat. This leads to players artificially extending combat in order to heal up for the next encounter. This is not the first time i see game designers do exactly this kind of mistake, so I try to come up with a witty name for this specific kind of design fail. Any suggestions?
 
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Agreed domein. That's the biggest design flaw with the game. I have no suggestion for the witty name but I can think of some ways to address the exploit:
1) Make each combat turn pass time (increase hunger, expend torchlight) so artificially extending combat will have costs
2) Make heals available out of combat but likewise pass time. It makes little sense to not have the healer remove bleeds/blight from traps triggered out of combat and instead wait for combat to do it.
 
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COnquistador expeditions had a good grasp on these things.
or you can go Heroes style, and heal everything out of combat
 
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The solution is replacing combat healing skill with temporary "shield" of equal magnitude.
 
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The unpredictability of Darkest Dungeon creates emotional turmoil for characters,
Always a big question on how people achieve this kind of conclusions.
DD gives an extended control over the events. It is highly predictable.

Quick example:
The crusader might start with smite (ACCuracy 80), Zealous accusation(ACC 80) and Stunning blow (ACC 85), level one skills.
Upgrading often gives a 5 ACC extra and upgrading comes fast (at week 3)

The percentage to hit is given by ACC - (enemy) DOD(ge)
Monsters at apprentice level are often DOD 0.
That means that at apprentice level, the basic chances to hit range from 80 to 90.

Adding various trinkets and buffs, increasing them is straightforward. Leading them to the 95.

Unpredictable? Highly predictable. The most unpredictable and damaging thing is the loot that might come with drawbacks (like quirks)
Other than that, it is highly predictable (you know the type of monsters you are going to face in the dungeons but not when)
They have an overall setting that implies low healing availability, with special camping skills assigned for that, yet there is a simple free healing skill that works during combat, but disabled out of combat. This leads to players artificially extending combat in order to heal up for the next encounter. This is not the first time i see game designers do exactly this kind of mistake, so I try to come up with a witty name for this specific kind of design fail. Any suggestions?

It is not about health only. It also works for mental sanity.
Buying a turn is not an artificial move in this kind of the game. It is one goal.
The basic "ugoigo" metagame includes making decisions to keep all your options during one turn while depriving the enemy of all their options.

In DD, buying a turn, whether completely or partially, is straightforward. During a turn, when the only left enemy is stunned, it is not artificial to go to the end of your turn, buffing up the rest of the party. That is what the metagame demands.
Some players could choose to abort their turn by killing outright the stunned enemy, even before their healer or stress remover gets its own turn. That is poor play relatively to the metagame.

The metagame demands to make the most of your turn while managing to deprive the enemy of most of its turn.

The suggestions are hard to come as in their original design, they provided a solution to put a lid on that aspect. They also drifted from their original design so suggestions might involve redoing a completely different game.

The current issue is that players keep an extended control on their party while they were supposed to lose control over their party, breaking points that happen when the resolve is tested.
Once the control is lost over members of the party, who, additionnally, can poison other people's mind, quickening the loss of control over the other heroes, the slack that currently exists and that makes buying turns so straightforward disappears, trying to heal a masochist or a hopeless might end in a refusal. Noticeably, once heroes' resolve is tested, the buff to decrease their stress do not remove their mental status.
Uncontrolled heroes was the original lid over optimization of a turn.

It is not so much a design flaw, much more a refusal to stick to their original design, pressured by players who do not like the feature.

Indeed, in the current state, the control over the party is such that a basic application of the metagame leads to strolls in the park. Without the lid, players are able to make the most of their turns while depriving the enemy of its turns very straightforwardly. It is a no brainer.

A correction based on the original design would mean accepting to lose control over the party members, a solution that is not accepted and rejected.

So now, they might have to revise their entire design as their original solution is rejected.

And the rest of DD was also a topical context to make the expression of a certain type of gameplay natural, it also means scrapping a lot of things, rendering them meaningless.
 
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This no-magic-healing-outside-combat is a mechanic shared by Pixel Heroes, but extending combat to heal up your party already comes with a risk: that the enemy unit might get a critical hit or do something else unpredictable. It doesn't bother me if some risk like this is present.
 
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personally I would change the mechanic. First, it makes no sense that healers can't heal outside of combat, other than for gameplay mechanics. I would prefer a different approach... unrecoverable mana, full health after fight. Another solution would be to add reinforcements after X combat turns. Yet another would be for increased stress hits for party members each round after X combat rounds.
 
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Mental sanity was supposed to introduce the required risk. Mental sanity and its extension: uncontrolled party members. It was all about pushing the party near the breaking point and making the most of a bad situation.
The extended control over the party was supposed to be balanced by the risk of losing control over the party.

The focus on health, as if the regeneration of health was the issue, hints at the uncontrolled party as the feature players want to get rid of.

Either this studio manage to rejoin their original design, that would lead to a high number of casualties, retreats from battles, aborted quests, or they go on something different, implying deep changes in the current version.

As it goes, as they are drifting from their original idea, the environment they created to dress the idea is getting off topic. DD has a strong lovecraftian influence, which is turning more and more irrelevant as they move to prevent heroes from snapping.
 
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Kill things, gather treasure, level up, repeat.
Was not supposed to be like that but that is the way it is.
 
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personally I would change the mechanic. First, it makes no sense that healers can't heal outside of combat, other than for gameplay mechanics. I would prefer a different approach… unrecoverable mana, full health after fight. Another solution would be to add reinforcements after X combat turns. Yet another would be for increased stress hits for party members each round after X combat rounds.
You're trying to swat a fly (mechanic is unrealistic) with a sledgehammer (full health after fight). I'm more concerned with gameplay being enjoyable and flowing than that it makes sense, as much as that's a thing in this context.
 
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Is there a story or a theme in this game? Or is it completely rogue like, as in, gather treasure, kill things, level up, repeat?

There is, supposedly you're some dude getting back to your estate and it got haunted/invaded by Lovecraftian things. The end of the game is killing the big bad thing that will be in the "Darkest Dungeon". The game is in early release so the last dungeons haven't been added yet.
 
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Radical solutions will be required as DD is drifting from the original design and its consistency.

Heroes getting out of control were supposed to balance out the extended control on the party. As it is given up, new solutions are requested.

It goes beyond combat.
Caches were not supposed to be plundered in a linear fashion (enter a dungeon, clear it out, get outside)
Caches were supposed to be a danger themselves and once the way to plunder them safely gone, plundering could turn into an annoyance.
DD was heading for a no plunder direction. As players want to plunder everything though, it changes the deal.

All the quirks that lead heroes to get out of control punctually are getting more and more irrelevant. A plutomaniac, a hagiomaniac hero could turn into an annoyance when following the no plunder direction. Once it is made so that players can plunder everything, heroes getting out of control to plunder by themselves is at best a little annoyance.

In order to be turned into a game, DD requires an overhaul. After investigation, the original solution, heroes getting out of control, is not popular. Players do not suggest to go that way, they want something else, another direction.
At this point, they must change their direction completely: management of the stress put on the heroes can no longer be the primary factor in the decision making process as it was originally meant to be.
As they cant take the stress feature out of the picture due to marketing priority, which would be the most direct and honest way to proceed, they must find ways to disguise the whole of it and find new determining factors to carry out the decision process.

If they do not take radical solutions, it wont get out of the stamping documents chore like thing DD currently is. Bot product for bot players.
 
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