Polygon - Games are better without damsels to save

aries100 · November 23, 2014

Claire Hosking has written an opinion piece for Polygon. It it, she argues that game
don't need to have damsels in distress to save. And that they are better this way.
The starting point for Claire Hosking is this:

Anita Sarkeesian's Feminist Frequency series has amazing influence for someone who's simply doing what so many have done before - making videos about about their opinions on books, TV, film and video games.... Anthony Burch, Joss Whedon and Tim Schafer - have listened and encouraged their followers to take note, while Saints Row creative Director Steve Jaros has said, "I actually think [Tropes vs. Women creator Anita Sarkeesian's] right in this case" when a video was critical of an aspect of the game.

Claire Hoskings argues that when a female character has to e.g. rescued by the player she becomes just a thing to fetch. She does so with a quote from Anita Sarkeesian's Tropes in Video Games, part 1:

...[damseling is] a plot device in which a female character is placed in a perilous situation from which she cannot escape on her own and must be rescued by a male character, usually providing a core incentive or motivation for the protagonist’s quest. In video games this is most often accomplished via kidnapping but it can also take the form of petrification or demon possession for example."

Claire Hosking uses two examples from current videogames on how to avoid this:

Games like Bioshock or Gone Home use audio logs and environmental narrative to flesh out characters you’re searching for; they’re games about entering their world and understanding their life. It’s an interesting game design question — there are many, many reasons why a character might be interesting to find or deliberately trying to keep something from you. Every one of them says more about the character than just someone being taken away and locked up.

And finally, she writes that:

While they are damsels, they exist for others and no longer have their own initiative or interactions......It also frequently portrays love as transactional — save girl, get kiss — rather than something that springs from spending time with a person and getting to know them. None of this makes for good writing. The fact damseling happens overwhelmingly to female characters has a particular meaning in a society that has historically restricted women’s freedoms and denied them equal autonomy with men.

More information.

borcanu · November 23, 2014

its not necessary the damseling. I just hate seeing romance added to everything. Movies are like this mostly. they just want to pack in everything.
And when you pack in more elements, of course the others lose focus
well I'm also INTP, so anything remotely *ethical* for motivation turns me off )

Kyrer · November 23, 2014

It's not just about damsels in distress, though they are certainly part of it. I think it's that the general quality of writing in most video games is absolutely dreadful; even amongst RPGs which traditionally have far more story to them. The game-play and visuals have really advanced in gaming over the years, but not the narrative side. I think this is partly because games are a new form of story telling that people haven't quite figured out yet, but I also think it's due to a certain amount of laziness. People just don't seem to notice poor writing as easily as they do poor graphics. This is nothing new, however, and is the same in most Hollywood films; so much money goes into making things look good and feel slick, but it's quite rare to notice something for it's quality of writing.

Farflame · November 23, 2014

when a female character has to e.g. rescued by the player she becomes just a thing to fetch.

I wonder if man is also just "a thing to fetch" (= sign of evil) if he needs to be rescued in a quest? Are these people able to have fun in games or is it just a PR medium for them? The problem is that some people forces their opinion on whole community.

Just leave it to screenwriters and creative leads. Stories and writing can be really bad and shallow when there is damsel in distress. But it can be equally bad when there isnt any damsel.

Humanity has risen! · November 23, 2014

Another leftist thinker who thinks they can tell gamers what games they have a right to play and what games they don't and to police content, and who tries to shame those who don't submit to this ideology into feeling like bad people or reactionaries. I don't think playing Mario or Dragon Quest where I happen to save a princess makes me a patriarchal tyrant, this is crazy. I'm not listening to this. Not now, or ever. This is a clique of San Francisco fringe of academics catering to a fringe of people who already all think like them and who don't even like videogames that much. I'm going to let them one up one another in self-righteousness ad nauseam while I enjoy the games I want to play like I always did.

rjshae · November 23, 2014

Yup, more leftist social control through peer group conformity. It worked in the film industry, so it looks like video gaming is next in line. The difference is that in films your experience is entirely controlled by the producers, while in games the players have more control over their individual experience. If I want to go rescue the fair maiden from the tower of the evil doers, then there's every reason I should be allowed to do so. (Likewise, female gamers should be allowed to rescue the handsome bloke, if they prefer.) Games that try to steer my behavior according to some political beliefs are less appealing, and so I'm less likely to buy them.

Archangel · November 23, 2014

I don't have anything vs damsels in distress if it fits the world where it happens. Like middle ages. But if a group of people are going to try to rewrite history with this, I got a bit problem with that.
Use them where it fits within lore.

Sacred_Path · November 23, 2014

rjshae said:
Yup, more leftist social control through peer group conformity. It worked in the film industry, so it looks like video gaming is next in line. The difference is that in films your experience is entirely controlled by the producers, while in games the players have more control over their individual experience. If I want to go rescue the fair maiden from the tower of the evil doers, then there's every reason I should be allowed to do so. (Likewise, female gamers should be allowed to rescue the handsome bloke, if they prefer.) Games that try to steer my behavior according to some political beliefs are less appealing, and so I'm less likely to buy them.

Yes, it's an extreme overreaction. It's like saying "games don't need good looking protagonists, and they're better without them".

Brumbek · November 23, 2014

LOL at Polygon. Women are literally beaten and abused worldwide by various religions and governments, and yet these "liberals" choose to rail on fake scenarios invented for video games where you rescue women from evil. Maybe if these "enlightened" people ever experienced the true injustice of the world, they'd be VERY glad we live in a society that values rescuing women from evil.

Capt. Huggy Face · November 23, 2014

I think she hurt Donkey Kong's feelings. He's taking his princess and going home...

Dez · November 23, 2014

Ah its one of those articles.

I'll just leave this one here. :biggrin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZImdDrYCkM

Dajjer · November 24, 2014

And my response is No, they're not.

As a liberal, I reject the notion that this person is a real liberal. I also wonder just how many games this author played. She's not a liberal but a games basher. Just another side of the same coin of Jack Thompson.

Besides, the typical gaming trope isn't rescuing a damsel in distress, it's saving the world. Additionally, as far as side quests go, I am just as likely to save a damsel as I am little Jimmy in the cave, the lost husband that didn't come home for dinner, the missing lover who missed the appointment. In some games I am likely to do all those quests.

As I read the article is just sounds like a lot of word soup to me. There is no question a game story would be enhanced with more rounded characters and that is what the gist of the opinion piece should have been honest about. Not some fake sound bite piece about ridding the gaming world of rescuing damsels.

NOTE: Curiously, none of the games on my desktop have anything to do with rescuing damsels.

Humanity has risen! · November 24, 2014

Brumbek said:
LOL at Polygon. Women are literally beaten and abused worldwide by various religions and governments, and yet these "liberals" choose to rail on fake scenarios invented for video games where you rescue women from evil. Maybe if these "enlightened" people ever experienced the true injustice of the world, they'd be VERY glad we live in a society that values rescuing women from evil.

Exactly, they pretend they are for social good, but all they do is critiques of men and shaming of men over and over again. There's a reason no one takes them seriously. It's not like they're missionaries taking care of poor children.

This is the site where the reviewer for Tropico 5 said he was queasy because he had roleplayed a tyrant. These people are insane. And I'm sorry but this is supposed to be a videogame site, not a women's studies course.

I'm very glad though that most people here are waking up to the absurdity of such shaming and politicizing. The good thing is that they do a very good job of destroying any credibility they have on their own. In RPG terms, they keep rolling one critical failure after another.

Archangel · November 24, 2014

Brumbek said:
LOL at Polygon. Women are literally beaten and abused worldwide by various religions and governments, and yet these "liberals" choose to rail on fake scenarios invented for video games where you rescue women from evil. Maybe if these "enlightened" people ever experienced the true injustice of the world, they'd be VERY glad we live in a society that values rescuing women from evil.

Don't go there. I pulled this argument on another topic that is also about how men are evil vs women in western world and got bashed by half the forum members

poos · November 24, 2014

as soon as i read that the sarkessian claws of righteous indignation were involved i immediately turned off

goodbye polygon and your staff of shit eating lesbians

xSamhainx · November 24, 2014

Wow, you guys really got worked up about this one. The whole "Gamergate" thing rubbed you raw?

Damsel in Distress really hasnt been the end-game for a while, I actually kind of miss it. Makes me feel all chivalrous and knightly

Deleted User · November 24, 2014

Welcome to my ignore list, poos! And I will continue to ignore future trolls from the Codex or wherever these people came from. Everyone else will, too, so why waste your time here? Do something productive.

Ripper · November 24, 2014

poos said:
as soon as i read that the sarkessian claws of righteous indignation were involved i immediately turned off

goodbye polygon and your staff of shit eating lesbians

I'm hoping that whoever got the notification when I clicked 'report' will agree that members, and staff, shouldn't have to put up with this standard of post.

poos · November 24, 2014

take some harden up pills and move on with your life

Adverant · November 24, 2014

The average "damsel in distress" in modern video games has much more personality and story-impact than in your average Liam Neeson movie.

I think video games are singled out because they are niche, so it's much easier for an agenda critic to assume the role of an explainer-in-chief, to a base that doesn't play them.

While Bioshock was singled out for using "damseling" well, I can't help but think it's due to the hero being tasked to save a little sister type character. If the protagonist is saving a romantic interest, like in witcher 2, are we back to criticizing the male protagonist for "objectifying" the female?

Polygon - Games are better without damsels to save

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