Hellgate Global - On Steam Greenlight

The Redbana Corporation is trying to get Hellgate Global on Steam. So if any of you are interested check out the greenlight page, and vote.

Hellgate is an action RPG that allows you to play in a first-person or third-person perspective. Set 27 years into the future, an ancient prophecy made centuries ago has come true and the gates of hell have opened. Demons have overrun the world of man and roam our lands, destroying, pillaging and killing humans. With the world above ground abandoned, dark and burnt to hellfire, humans are forced into hiding to protect what remains of their race while making plans to take back a world that was once theirs. In the game, mankind escapes to the underground system under the sprawling metropolis of London. Prepare for a struggle for survival in a world that has become hell

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More information.

I had tons of fun playing Hellgate online and was thinking about it the other day. I could stand a play through again, sucked to watch this game fail. Definitely would be a good addition to my STEAM library.

Problem with Hellgate Global is that they're using an older build from before the real game went down - and they're using reduced quality textures. This makes the game look much worse than it has to - and I doubt they've done anything to fix it.

But, I'll check it out. Always loved Hellgate - and consider it one of the most unfortunate examples of the ignorant public perception coupled with a really bad launch state.

DArtagnan said:

Problem with Hellgate Global is that they're using an older build from before the real game went down - and they're using reduced quality textures. This makes the game look much worse than it has to - and I doubt they've done anything to fix it.

But, I'll check it out. Always loved Hellgate - and consider it one of the most unfortunate examples of the ignorant public perception coupled with a really bad launch state.

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Last I remember if you still have the original disc and install it first, then the best textures are preserved. Obviously this wouldn't be helpful for the majority of players though. Or if it would apply in this future iteration.

Embolus said:

Last I remember if you still have the original disc and install it first, then the best textures are preserved. Obviously this wouldn't be helpful for the majority of players though. Or if it would apply in this future iteration.

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I tried that and couldn't get it working. But you can make it work by transfering the textures - which are available online somewhere.

But that's only for the old areas - not the new ones. Also, they've failed to include the DX10 enhancements and what not.

It's a pretty sloppy job on their part - and I don't think they know anything about how to change the engine or assets in a technical way. AFAIK, they just acquired the rights to the game - and haven't made a single upgrade in a technical sense.

For instance, last time I played the game STILL had the infamous 1-FPS bug - which was actually fixed in one of the later builds from the real game. This means they're still using OLD code as a base.

DArtagnan said:

But, I'll check it out. Always loved Hellgate - and consider it one of the most unfortunate examples of the ignorant public perception coupled with a really bad launch state.

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They weren't exactly clear on what it was. As far as I knew it was an MMO. I didn't know it had singleplayer until after the servers shutdown. Singleplayer and multiplayer being patched separately was a pretty stupid decision though.

I'd cut off my arms if I ever voted for MMO on Steam Greeenlight. Especially MMO that is MMO but let's say it contains some crappy singleplayer so MMO haters still give it a try.

I loved the concept of Hellgate. In practice though I found single player (didn't have reliable internet connection at the time) so boring I would actually drift off while playing.

Hellgate is more or less pointless in singleplayer. Awful story and awful delivery.

It's very much a game about cooperatively killing things as you progress your characters, and you show off your kick-ass items to your friends.

It remains one of the most viscerally exciting action RPGs when you're in the middle of dozens of hellspawn and the music kicks in

That said, Diablo 3 might have taken the throne where moment-to-moment gameplay is concerned.

DArtagnan said:

Hellgate is more or less pointless in singleplayer. Awful story and awful delivery.

It's very much a game about cooperatively killing things as you progress your characters, and you show off your kick-ass items to your friends.

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Hmmm... I don't know, I never play games like Borderlands or Diablo 1-2 in co-op. Co-op is just not something I like to do, as I prefer to rely on myself and not on others in games.

I still had tons of fun with these games alone, including Hellgate: London. I was really sad when it went down. But that was not the fault of the public perception. They had a screwed up communication right from the start. You could ask 10 people what payment model they had and you'd get 10 different answers.

I really hope this gets greenlighted, as at least Hellgate: London was a lot of fun.

TheSHEEEP said:

Hmmm… I don't know, I never play games like Borderlands or Diablo 1-2 in co-op. Co-op is just not something I like to do, as I prefer to rely on myself and not on others in games.

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Borderlands and Diablo at least have stories that are fun to follow on your first playthrough

As for relying on my friends, that's something I've never had a problem with. But I see what you mean.

To me, these games are designed around the cooperative experience - much like an action-oriented PnP D&D session.

I can't stay interested playing something like that completely alone.

I still had tons of fun with these games alone, including Hellgate: London. I was really sad when it went down. But that was not the fault of the public perception. They had a screwed up communication right from the start. You could ask 10 people what payment model they had and you'd get 10 different answers.

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I don't agree. Their model was good and it made sense, because it could be played without subscription with minimal issues. Subscription was optional if you wanted to support development and get the expansion content without paying separately. It was just a choice.

EXACTLY like most F2P MMOs work today - with optional subscriptions.

People just weren't ready for it and they bitched endlessly because they thought it was some evil conspiracy.

I don't remember having a single doubt as to how it worked - it was plain as the nose on your face.

The real problem with Hellgate was the atrocious launch state - and it took them a few months to get it fully playable.

If people had given it more of a chance, it could have been quite something. But people chose to be stupid and that's par for the course.

DArtagnan said:

That said, Diablo 3 might have taken the throne where moment-to-moment gameplay is concerned.

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I just do not see that. In my view, even with all the recent changes D3 is a truly terrible game with no sould but with very good production values. Blizzard has clearly forgotten the balance that makes ARPGs fun. D2 is still a far superior game. Sacred, POE, TL2 and Grim Dawn (when feature complete) are all significantly better ARPGs than D3 is my view.

johnnysd said:

I just do not see that. In my view, even with all the recent changes D3 is a truly terrible game with no sould but with very good production values. Blizzard has clearly forgotten the balance that makes ARPGs fun. D2 is still a far superior game. Sacred, POE, TL2 and Grim Dawn (when feature complete) are all significantly better ARPGs than D3 is my view.

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To each his own

The real problem for me is that the game we got was not the game portrayed in the promotional videos. The promos promised a dark, post apocalyptic world. The game we got was nothing like that, with a number of silly, even zany quests. Only one of the stations actually looked besieged with guards and sand bags, everything else was bright and airy. And don't get me started about the vendor who made jokes about various sexual topics. The story was just nothing like they showed.

Grifman said:

The real problem for me is that the game we got was not the game portrayed in the promotional videos. The promos promised a dark, post apocalyptic world. The game we got was nothing like that, with a number of silly, even zany quests. Only one of the stations actually looked besieged with guards and sand bags, everything else was bright and airy. And don't get me started about the vendor who made jokes about various sexual topics. The story was just nothing like they showed.

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Anyone expecting the fancy CGI videos to reflect the actual game must have been quite naive

That said, it's true - the story and especially its delivery was crap.

But, in my opinion, the atmosphere was quite good and not far from the videos at all.

The NPCs were silly, yes, but the levels and the assets weren't "bright" in any way whatsoever.

It's playable right now you don't have to wait for greenlight. I re-downloaded it 2 weeks ago and my boys and I play it together. Three accounts. Three computers. Its still a blast but like Dart said you can still tell the difference between the online version and the modded patched version that I still run on my computer.Hellgate revival has a couple cool mods that import some features from the multiplayer version(the one that was going on before they went out of business.) Sadly, no one was able to make a version where you could have lan play.

DArtagnan said:

Anyone expecting the fancy CGI videos to reflect the actual game must have been quite naive

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Nope, if a game is portrayed as dark and gritty, then it's not unreasonable to assume that is what it will be. That's been my experience with games like Bioshock, Wasteland 2, Fallout (Beth version), Deus Ex, etc. Gameplay's different, I don't expect cutscenes to match gameplay but I do expect the atmosphere of a cutscene to reflect the atmosphere of the game. All of those games matched their preview atmosphere - Hellgate didn't.

But, in my opinion, the atmosphere was quite good and not far from the videos at all.

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Nope it was pretty bad. So bad in fact, that they actually went back and rewrote some of the NPC dialogue because people were complaining so much. I'd never seen that before in a game. It was a huge issue because it didn't fit what was supposed to be happening outside.

The NPCs were silly, yes, but the levels and the assets weren't "bright" in any way whatsoever.

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If the NPC's were silly (and they were) then how could the game reflect the atmosphere in the pre-release videos. You had the quest to kill stuff to help a guy court his girlfriend. There was a whole series of quests involving a nutty professor and his assistant. Then there was the vendor who's line was the old "is that something in your pocket or are you just happy to see me" spiel. It was just plain awful and a lot of people complained about it.

Most of the subway centers were fairly new, open looking. There was only one that was sandbagged, with lots of guards and even came under attack every so often. That was the only one like that, when the game should have been full of them. Yes the outside locations looked appropriately PA but not the main stations where you hung out a lot of the time re-equipping and taking new missions.

What most people aren't realizing is that Greenlighting will accomplish nothing for this game besides line the pockets of the current IP holder, Redbana. It is nothing more than a cash grab. It's a blatant attempt to market their bastardization of the original great Hellgate London game to the nearly 7 million registered Steam users, some of whom may not have been exposed to this game. Go to the current HGG site now and see for yourselves how they've posted nothing but server maintenance for over the past 2 years. They are using old code and have added nothing to the game since acquiring the IP rights in 2010 except horrible lag, old textures and a severely reduced XP gain. Basically turned it into your typical Asian style "grinder". I have proudly voted NO on Greenlight but would happily fund a well known American or European dev to jump into the fray and kick start a spiritual successor.

Grifman said:

Nope, if a game is portrayed as dark and gritty, then it's not unreasonable to assume that is what it will be. That's been my experience with games like Bioshock, Wasteland 2, Fallout (Beth version), Deus Ex, etc. Gameplay's different, I don't expect cutscenes to match gameplay but I do expect the atmosphere of a cutscene to reflect the atmosphere of the game. All of those games matched their preview atmosphere - Hellgate didn't.

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I don't agree about the atmosphere, as I said. I think the game looked and felt very much like the videos (albeit with reduced visuals, obviously) - just as long as you ignored the NPCs.

That said, if you really don't know how rare it is for expensive trailers to match the actual games - then I don't know what to say. There are examples to the contrary, though, as you mention.

I will admit, though, that times have changed - and these days, games look like trailers and trailers are largely superfluous.

But in the past, CGI trailers were famously much more impressive than the actual games. Hellgate had particularly beautiful and expensive trailers long before release - and I most certainly didn't expect the game to look like that.

But, as it turned out, in terms of atmosphere - the game did look like that, just not as good, visually.

Nope it was pretty bad. So bad in fact, that they actually went back and rewrote some of the NPC dialogue because people were complaining so much. I'd never seen that before in a game. It was a huge issue because it didn't fit what was supposed to be happening outside.

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Yeah, they got a bad response - and they tried to change the quirky humor a bit. Obviously, it didn't work.

This was my biggest issue with Hellgate, personally. They completely ignored the story aspect of Diablo when trying to make a better version in a different setting.

The same is true for Marvel Heroes - which I believe is made by some of the same people.

I guess some people really do believe that story is irrelevant in these games, and I couldn't disagree more.

If the NPC's were silly (and they were) then how could the game reflect the atmosphere in the pre-release videos. You had the quest to kill stuff to help a guy court his girlfriend. There was a whole series of quests involving a nutty professor and his assistant. Then there was the vendor who's line was the old "is that something in your pocket or are you just happy to see me" spiel. It was just plain awful and a lot of people complained about it.

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I believe I explained that already. The NPCs didn't reflect it - but the rest of the game reflected it.

Atmosphere, to me, isn't so much about NPC dialogue. It's about music, sound and visuals. About tone, if you will. IIRC, the developers meant for the NPCs to be sort of insane and "comic relief" because the world was supposed to be so dark.

Now, I don't think that worked at all - but I can see what they were trying to do.

The entire game ASIDE from the NPCs was rather bleak and had a million demons obviously wanting to destroy you and the world. The outside levels was all about a destroyed world and ruins everywhere - and nasty demons as far as the eyes could see.

That's how the videos accurately reflected the world and atmosphere to ME.

Since you had a completely different expectation, I don't know how you can expect me to explain how it reflected it for YOU. It didn't.

Most of the subway centers were fairly new, open looking. There was only one that was sandbagged, with lots of guards and even came under attack every so often. That was the only one like that, when the game should have been full of them. Yes the outside locations looked appropriately PA but not the main stations where you hung out a lot of the time re-equipping and taking new missions.

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As I said, I felt it reflected the atmosphere very well.

AFAIK, the game didn't suggest that all the subway centers were in disrepair. It was mostly the outside world - and the subway was supposed to be a refuge of sorts, no? I never paid attention to the story, to be honest.

It worked for me.

But is this really important? You don't think the game looked and felt like the videos - and I thought it did a decent job of it.

We both agree the NPCs were horrible, though.

jpnole said:

What most people aren't realizing is that Greenlighting will accomplish nothing for this game besides line the pockets of the current IP holder, Redbana. It is nothing more than a cash grab. It's a blatant attempt to market their bastardization of the original great Hellgate London game to the nearly 7 million registered Steam users, some of whom may not have been exposed to this game. Go to the current HGG site now and see for yourselves how they've posted nothing but server maintenance for over the past 2 years. They are using old code and have added nothing to the game since acquiring the IP rights in 2010 except horrible lag, old textures and a severely reduced XP gain. Basically turned it into your typical Asian style "grinder". I have proudly voted NO on Greenlight but would happily fund a well known American or European dev to jump into the fray and kick start a spiritual successor.

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First of all, I completely agree their handling of the game hasn't been impressive - to say the least.

That said:

The worst thing that could happen is that people have fun with a reduced version of Hellgate. Why would it be a problem that we're lining the pockets of people who bought the rights to the game?

If people don't want to play it - they won't pay for it. It's simple.

Now, if we DO line their pockets - they just might consider doing something more - and improving upon the game.

That's hardly an end-of-the-world scenario.

Then again, I don't wake up in the morning every day feeling like people owe me something because a game I once loved didn't make it.

That's just me.