Should I upgrage my EVGA 770 GTX?

JDR13 said:

There isn't much of a difference performance-wise. I'd say it depends what's available in your area and the price. Go with the 6700K if you want DDR4, but there isn't a huge difference in performance there either.

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From what I understand, the performance increase wrt to the i7-4790K in current games is small but my aim is to build a future-proof PC with a life span of at least 4-5 years so I don't mind the extra cost if future games may benefit from the newer CPU model.

I have a colleague who is very knowledgeable in PC H/W perfomances and I already told him that I would make "use of his services" …but he is on Holidays now so I just ask here for some pre-advice.

Kordanor said:

I just go with https://www.cpubenchmark.net/high_end_cpus.html

But if you are getting a GTX 980Ti and already have an i7-4790k, I don't see why you should essentially downgrade to an i5.

That said, I wouldn't upgrade at all, at that point as there is basically no benefit in doing so. Especially the argument to be future proof makes no sense. Because your PC is already absolutely high end. There is no use in paying hundreds of $ for almost zero benefit, just to be able to upgrade something in the future.
It would make more sense to just save the money and upgrade it when needed.

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I don't have a i7-4790K.

My PC is nearly 5 years old and I have an old AMD Phenom II X6 1090t X6 with a GTX 580.

My question is basically whether it is worth it to go for the i7-6700K instead of the i7-4790K.

Ah, misunderstood.

Yeah, would definitely go for the new stuff then. That's maybe 100-200€ of additional money to make your PC future proof which I would (and will) invest.

Kordanor said:

Ah, misunderstood.

Yeah, would definitely go for the new stuff then. That's maybe 100-200€ of additional money to make your PC future proof which I would (and will) invest.

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OK, that is good to know, thanks.

Rather than upgrading individual components over time (which I used to do), I now prefer to build one "solid" configuration and then "forget" about everything until the next 4-5 years .

My current PC turned out to be excellent and is still doing very well but the existence of The Witcher 3 is forcing me to upgrade . But more importantly, I need to get a system that will guarantee that I can play Star Citizen / Squadron 42 with max settings.

I am doubting whether to get 16GB or go for 32GB, or will that be overkill for gaming?

Since you won't listen to me and go for i5, I say go for 32Gb of RAM hoping you'll refuse my suggestion on that too.

It probably is overkill. Furthermore the problem is right now that you will want to have fast memory. 3000 MHz maybe. These however can only be found as 4Gb per sold, totalling up to 16GB.
If you want to go up to 32Gb you will need to buy 2400Mhz RAM.
Now the difference it probably not huge between 2400 and 3000. But so is the additional amount of RAM. I'd probably go with 16Gb 3000Mhz (or 3200) at the moment and if you should really need 32GB in 2 or 3 years, then replace them via newer models. RAM isn't really that expensive anyways.


What I am personally asking myself is, if upgrading the PC right now still makes sense. I mean the new slots and architecture is there and that is great and "step 1". But the big hits are probably still coming, but only in 2016. Then we will get new Graphics card with 16nm designs instead of current 28nm (e.g. GTX 980) in addition to HMB2, and (according to NVIDIA) achieves up to 10 times the speed of Maxwell (current gen) GPUs. Now of course we have no idea what that really means. Will the first card of the next generation be 10 times as fast as a gtx 980? Or will you need an equivalent of a titan card to achieve that?

And the same goes for CPUs actually. I mean the 6700k has the new boards and all, yeah. But it has no significant speed benefit over the 4790k which was released one year ago.
Now the question if the refresh version of Skylake called Kabylake which will be released in 2016 will add significant speed. On the intel front the next boost is probably Canonlake which shrinks it down to 10nm instead of 14nm. But these aren't released before 2017.

However there is also AMD which is going to release Zen (probably End of 2016) which brings AMD in line with intel again and down to 14nm. But for now we have no idea about how strong they will be performance wise.

I think if I could reverse time, I would probably buy a 4790k a year ago, as we are currently in a long, long phase of nothingness regarding significant hardware releases.
But now I already waited a year for essentially nothing...when will the next bump come? And will I think in a year "I should have bought the 4790k 2 years ago"?

joxer said:

Since you won't listen to me and go for i5, I say go for 32Gb of RAM hoping you'll refuse my suggestion on that too.

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The humour is appreciated .

Don't forget, I want a bit of overkill now so that it doesn't become roadkill too soon .

Kordanor said:

It probably is overkill. Furthermore the problem is right now that you will want to have fast memory. 3000 MHz maybe. These however can only be found as 4Gb per sold, totalling up to 16GB.
If you want to go up to 32Gb you will need to buy 2400Mhz RAM.
Now the difference it probably not huge between 2400 and 3000. But so is the additional amount of RAM. I'd probably go with 16Gb 3000Mhz (or 3200) at the moment and if you should really need 32GB in 2 or 3 years, then replace them via newer models. RAM isn't really that expensive anyways.

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From what I have read and concluded, 16GB ought to be enough and both you and Joxer, the reverse psychologist, indeed confirm this.

So for now I'll go for 16GB DDR4.

As for waiting for the right time to buy an upgrade. I guess that with PCs, there is *never* a right time. In any case, The Witcher 3 is basically imposing the right time so I do not have much of a say in the matter .

Although I still need to play Pillars of Eternity, which I will do when the updated version is released next week, so I can still hold out for several weeks.

joxer said:

Now what game needs that singlethreaded power? None whatsoever!

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But may that change in the next few years?

I think it's going to change more and more. Now whether or not in future you will really "need" an i7 over i5 is questionable. But more and more programs start to split on different cores.
Galciv 3 for example makes use of this. From what I understand it's a feature only possible with 64 bit systems. And now the consoles are on 64 bit and have lots of cores as well. So it also makes sense for Companies to build games which profit from the architecture on all systems.

I think 16GB of quality RAM should easily last you a couple of years at least. There won't be any need for more than that in the near future, at least not for gaming. Also, you won't see any significant performance difference between 2400Mhz and 3000Mgz.

For VRAM, you want at least 6GB if you want your graphics card to be future proof for a few years. You'll be fine if you end up getting a 980 Ti.

But that only makes sense if you are planning on going 4k in the next 2 years.

It depends on what games he plans on playing and the settings. Some of the newer AAA games already need 4GB if you want to play at the highest settings at 1080p.

The question is always how futureproof you want to make it and how much it's worth to you.

But just a hypothetical example:
If you are not using 4k right now, you will probably not be able to tell the difference between a GTX 970 (~350€) or a GTX 980Ti (~800€)

Now what is the better choice? To buy a GTX 970 now and next year update for another 400€ for a similar graphics cards of the next generation which then dwarfs the GTX 980Ti as well?
Or would you prefer to buy the 980Ti, which brings you no bonus right now, and is not the fastest horse anymore next year, while costing you even more but keeping you stuck with it if you don't want to waste your investment.

For me personally the 980ti as well as the Titan are in no healthy performance/price ratio. Even if I had money to waste I wouldn't do it that way.

@JDR13 yeah, but even the 970 has 4GB (well, 3,5GB...)

He doesn't want to buy another card in a year though. He wants a card that's going to last him several years.

And you're wrong about the 980 Ti not having a benefit now. It's a LOT faster than a 970, and it will allow him to play most games at 60fps with everything maxed now and for several years to come.

JDR13 said:

It depends on what games he plans on playing and the settings. Some of the newer AAA games already need 4GB if you want to play at the highest settings at 1080p.

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Currently, the main "drivers" are:
1. The Witcher 3
2. Cyperpunk 2077 (I assume that it will be more demanding than The Witcher 3)
3. Star Citizen (It is known that CIG intends to push the PC to the limit)

Kordanor said:

The question is always how futureproof you want to make it and how much it's worth to you.

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I no longer have the mental energy to continuously upgrade individual components while trying to find the optimal balance of "bang per buck".

The level of "peace of mind" that comes with "buying and forget" is worth it to me, even if it costs me some more. (Luckily, I am in a healthy financial situation so I can afford it).

Kordanor said:

Now what is the better choice? To buy a GTX 970 now and next year update for another 400€ for a similar graphics cards of the next generation which then dwarfs the GTX 980Ti as well?
Or would you prefer to buy the 980Ti, which brings you no bonus right now, and is not the fastest horse anymore next year, while costing you even more but keeping you stuck with it if you don't want to waste your investment.

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But this is a persistent problem that will always exist.

I just assume by default that any gear will become obsolete after one year. Acceptance of a worst case scenario is the easiest way to cope with this .

In any case I would make sure you buy a board which supports SLI.
So instead of replacing your 980ti when it becomes too slow, you can just add a second one.
Or you go with 2 X 970 right away, which is cheaper and stronger than a 980ti...but then you won't be able to upgrade it to 2 X 980ti of course.

Just keep in mind that SLI also means twice as much power consumption and heat, and it doesn't work correctly with some games.

Kordanor said:

But that only makes sense if you are planning on going 4k in the next 2 years.

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Well you could render in 4k now with DSR. It's not an earth shattering difference but it is improved over regular 1080p.

Since I played Witcher 3 fine, even with hairworks, I decided not to move from my 770 GTX at all until something shiny comes out in the RPG World. Fallout 4 is gamebryo and my card should be fine on it. I'll probably buy a couple of Titans once TNBT comes out.

Witcher 3 with hairworks on 770. Were you playing at 640x480?