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June 23rd, 2010, 21:04
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
But why we haven't then seen Baldur's Gate III? It feel odd not to use such a powerful brand, that the most of the new RPG games are compared to. Is Atari afraid, that gamers have to high expections for it?

Or is Atari saving BG3 for the rainy days?
Probably they fear the Fallout 3 effect.
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June 23rd, 2010, 21:34
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
But back in late 90s/early 2000 there were lots of new franchise born; Baldur's Gate, Diablo, Fallout, Icewind Dale, Neverwinter Nights, Planescape Torment and more. Why is the situtation changed so much now? I'm so glad that I lived that era playing games.
Some of these games piggyback on the well known D&D setting and wont really have to start from scratch, players had an idea of what they'd get and there was a fanbase

I dont think the situation is that bad. In the last few years we've seen about one or two new franchises per year. The Witcher, Risen, Drakensang, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Alpha Protocol, Two Worlds… The successful ones then go on to generate sequels At any point you'll see a large chunk of sequels on the market, and I'd say it's a sign of a healthy genre. One reason for the seeming glut of new franchises around 2000 was that the RPG genre was pretty darn barren in the years before Baldurs Gate. There were only a few franchises alive and kicking (M&M, Ultima, and Wizardry spring to mind).

Originally Posted by bkrueger View Post
Probably they fear the Fallout 3 effect.
A justified fear after this long a wait. No matter how good the new game would be it would have to be different, and that would in itself be enough to disappoint some people.
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June 23rd, 2010, 21:42
As much as I love the Baldur's Gate series, I hope that nobody ever attempts to make another sequel. I seriously doubt it would live up to the earlier games.

I wouldn't mind another D&D crpg set in the Sword Coast region though, or perhaps to the East.
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June 23rd, 2010, 21:59
I'd vote for Aglarond or Unther.
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June 23rd, 2010, 23:44
Come on seriously, are you saying that you don't want to see BG3 happen? Fallout 3 was a success. Disappointment too, but luckily the mods helps a lot with it. If Minsc with Jim Cummings (who btw have a remarkable resemy) in voice-over can't fail.

I still wonder, if they resurrect series like Dungeon siege, then why not Baldur's Gate? Or Icewind Dale? Obsidian would most likely be able to bring Icewind Dale 3, but I hope BioWare never does BG3. They would only "Mass Effectialize" into action-adventure.

Another D&D game wouldn't hurt either. Maybe they'll make CRPG based on Dragonlance setting one day.
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June 24th, 2010, 00:30
Baldur's Gate 3 was NWN 1. Because of huge change in the aproach they had the honesty to change the name enough. But it was BG3.

How BG3 could position now? That would be a franchise usage but Still delicate.

When you look at series most disapeared because of a failure to follow a technological step and keep the serie mood and quality. For the Baldur's Gate series this have been made through a series shift with NWN series.

For Icewind Dale that would be another matter, but exactly the same problem than with Baldur's Gate series when it became NWN series. It's too late to morph them into shooters as for Fallout 3 and because of NWN series. Well that's possible but just fake because unlike Fallout 3 the Baldur's Gate series story background isn't original it's NWN one. And for Icewind Dale I don't think that its story context is singular enough to justify a totally new approach with the link being only the background story. Also Icewind Dale wasn't good because of this but only because of the design quality of plenty fights.
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June 24th, 2010, 00:41
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
I still wonder, if they resurrect series like Dungeon siege, then why not Baldur's Gate? Or Icewind Dale?

Dungeon Siege was just a simple hack&slash dungeon romp. Baldur's Gate is an all time classic.

An attempt to resurrect BG at this point would most likely just diminish its legacy.



Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
Baldur's Gate 3 was NWN 1. Because of huge change in the aproach they had the honesty to change the name enough. But it was BG3..
Um…. no.
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June 24th, 2010, 01:24
I kind of agree with NWN because it continued after infinity engine games, but making a sequel to BG or IWD would be possible still. Like Drakensang is modern and yet it feels like BG. It doesn't have to be 1st person to be modern really. Dragon Age's engine would be also good enough, if they could use similiar graphics desihn than BG and not simplify it that much. I think the console-dumbing-down is the reason why they've dropped D&D out…

What I meant with Dungeon Siege was the sequels. If they resurrect crap like that, then why left BG and IWD perish?
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June 24th, 2010, 02:13
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
What I meant with Dungeon Siege was the sequels. If they resurrect crap like that, then why left BG and IWD perish?
Several reasons.
  • BG's story arc was done. You will only get unrelated games like BG Dark Alliance at this point.
  • The D&D computer game license was relatively expensive. I think Atari might still have it. You cannot buy the BG or IWD trademarks.
  • D&D goes through too many iterations. When a putative game based on D&D4E might release, we probably look at D&D5E from WotC.
As far as Dungeon Siege and Deus Ex are concerned, I think I answered that further above. Square Enix wants into the western RPG market and realized that they themselves cannot come up with anything that appeals to that audience (did you ever read the subtitle of "The Last Remnant"? It's funny…). So they outright bought two old, but proven trademarks. That's about it, I guess.
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June 24th, 2010, 12:00
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
As much as I love the Baldur's Gate series, I hope that nobody ever attempts to make another sequel. I seriously doubt it would live up to the earlier games.

I wouldn't mind another D&D crpg set in the Sword Coast region though, or perhaps to the East.
Exactly what I wanted say! I NEVER want to see another BG series. Making a sequel would just ruin the whole series. The story/game ended very nicely and it should stay that way. Would love to see another D&D setting game but I doubt it (I think they have to pay wizard of coasts or something, don't they?)

Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
What I meant with Dungeon Siege was the sequels. If they resurrect crap like that, then why left BG and IWD perish?
They can probably work on IWD series again if they are prepared to pay for license. It's more combat driven than story so they can probably do something similar to FF series. Come up with completely new characters etc.

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IWD: Orhlanna & Korin
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June 24th, 2010, 15:52
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
I hope BioWare never does BG3. They would only "Mass Effectialize" into action-adventure.
It would probably be something along the lines of Dragon Age. That's a franchise they'll milk for a long time, so don't expect any BG sequels from BioWare any time soon.

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June 24th, 2010, 18:01
Easy to blame the devs/publishers/creativity etc, but the truth is that sequels to popular games generally sell well. So it's the consumer, all of us, voting with their wallets.

Here's hoping DX3 and Thief4 are good.

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June 24th, 2010, 19:49
Originally Posted by Malk View Post
It would probably be something along the lines of Dragon Age. That's a franchise they'll milk for a long time, so don't expect any BG sequels from BioWare any time soon.
Yeah, that's my feeling about Dragon Age. It's only developed to make money.
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June 24th, 2010, 21:21
Originally Posted by Ergonpandilus View Post
Yeah, that's my feeling about Dragon Age. It's only developed to make money.
So was Avernum 6.

For a AAA mainstream game, Dragon Age is a relatively "oldschool" game, shortcomings aside. Marketing campaign made it look like an ultranextgendumbeddown crap, but imo the game itself is surprisingly conservative when it comes to nextgenitis.
The Awakenings expansion had its own issues, but if anything its shown certain effort at elevating some of OCs most glaring flaws, namely filler combat, unbalanced skills, level design … which makes me quite hopeful in regards to Dragon Age 2.
"Only developed for money" is a very complex issue in itself, so Ill just simplify my position and say that I felt a lot of honest creativity went into the game.
Whether Bioware has character and quest designers as talented as Troika, or writers as talented as Obsidian is entirely different question though .
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June 25th, 2010, 10:13
How many of us didn't bought FO3 because the sequel of Morrowind was crap ?

Ascaron got destroyed after the release of Sacred 2 although it had very little in common with the very successful Sacred / Gold / Underworld

Sequels isn't always the safe path to go .
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June 25th, 2010, 10:30
How many bought FO3 because they loved Oblivion? No doubt far more than those who didn't due to Morrowind -> Oblivion.

FO3 sold more than the rest of the series combined.
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June 25th, 2010, 11:20
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
FO3 sold more than the rest of the series combined.

Easily understandable considering it was on 3 different platforms, as opposed to just 1.
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June 25th, 2010, 16:06
Certainly, but you know as well as I do that the marketing "Oblivion with guns" is a winner, and was bound to sell loads of copies. My point is that FO3 sold more due to Oblivion, not less.
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June 25th, 2010, 16:15
Originally Posted by Damian Mahadevan View Post
It is simple really. No fresh new ideas.
Originally Posted by GothicGothicness View Post
The easy answer is: money…….
Originally Posted by Naked Ninja View Post
So it's the consumer, all of us, voting with their wallets.
Personally, I believe it is a mixture of several reasos, with money and the lack of "fresh ideas" being the prominent ones.

Another buzz-word : "Cash Cow". Product life cycle.

An interesting thing is, by the way, why really very innovative game concepts become what we call here "abgestraft" - it's kind of "punished away" - by customers. It always baffles me totally to see such great games / concepts like Paraworld fail - and that even despite huge marketing, buzz, and magazines writing LOT about it !

And then absolutely stupid games like the infamout "Moorhuhn" actually sell in thousands …

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction. (E.F.Schumacher, Economist, Source)
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June 25th, 2010, 22:28
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
Certainly, but you know as well as I do that the marketing "Oblivion with guns" is a winner, and was bound to sell loads of copies. My point is that FO3 sold more due to Oblivion, not less.
It wasn't marketed as ""Oblivion with guns" though, that was a phrase used by people who *didn't* like the game. There may have been some people who indeed bought it because they liked Oblivion, and recognized the fact that it was the same developer, but I don't think that was the main selling point.
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