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April 11th, 2007, 00:42
How silly. I don't like Imus but holy Jesus, who cares? I'm sure the cult members will continue calling for his head until he is a broken man and too weak to appologize any more. The big sissy should've stuck to his guns, because now he is out of ammo and all the cult members are digging deeper for new ammo for the killing blow.
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April 11th, 2007, 01:56
I must be missing something, as this this post makes absolutely no sense to me at all!!

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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April 11th, 2007, 02:09
Don't know? Ask Wikipedia.

Never knew who the guy was before his comment landed him in the news headlines recently. So, I don't really feel qualified in commenting on his behavior.
Last edited by Drive By Commentator; April 11th, 2007 at 02:10. Reason: Fixed the link. I'm forums impaired apparently.
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April 11th, 2007, 02:16
As another non-American, I don't know anything about this guy but on the surface, he sounds like an idiot.

Why is it silly, Roqua?

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April 11th, 2007, 03:11
He had a quest on he called a "boner-nosed jew boy." He is taking heat from that now even though the person called that is defending Imus. He's a shock jock and the news articles are twisting it all around to make this into a big deal. It isn't and wasn't. It was an innocent off-hand comment. Yeah it's racist. But its a joke. If a black shock jock with a national audience said it they wouldn't be castrated. Either everyone can make fun of everyone or no one can make fun of anything.

Jesse James and that other bottom-sucker are leading the crusification, both known to make racial comments when not joking.

Personally, i find the term Zionist much more offensive, and I am half Cape Verdean and never even been close to jewish. Why can't the free market take care of this? If his audience is outraged they will stop listening and he will get fired for not bringing in the ratings. As it is now, his audience isn't outraged. Special interest groups and cults are, and they are telling people how to feel.

The only right and freedom worth defending is the right of other people to do what you disagree with. This just speaks on the global narrative that is in place now to turn everyone into a cult of overly sensitive robots that get mad at what the papers tell them to be mad at and listen to their betters like good little monkeys. And the monkeys are losing the ability to think for themselves or even see hypocrasy when it is starring them in the face.

Even McCain and Obama isued statements on the issue, furthering the nonsense. Silly is the only word to discribe this.

And sorry for not linking to an article, I figured non-us residents wouldn't care enough.

But I guess I can add the Aussies in by saying The Protector had the worst plot of any movie ver made, but that fight scene with the brazilian was great. But the next time a Thai wants to make a movie in Australia your goverment should have veto rights on the plot just to save face.
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April 11th, 2007, 03:12
There seems to be a media feeding frenzy on this guy for just being the egregious ass he always was and making a politically incorrect comment which he probably meant in his own silly way as a complement—he spoke completely in jest, IMO, and the self-appointed conscience of the Rev. Al Sharpton is hogging the spotlight showing no sense of humor whatsoever. It's an ugly spectacle, but then, it has to compete with the release of the DNA results for Anna Nicole's baby.

I agree with Roqua 100%. Who cares? There's got to be something better to put on the news than this.

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April 11th, 2007, 03:25
The only worse thing is the anna nicole thing. I wish news and entertainment new s had to be seperated by law. I hate watching a political analysis show and them spotlighting anna or michael jackson, or whatever the current stupid celebrity case is.

But I guess the Imus news would fall under that, but I like it. But everyone has to agree one has some sort of social relevence and can be seen as being a politicl issue and the other is just plain retarded.
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April 11th, 2007, 04:31
I've never heard of the guy, but we have 'shock jocks' too who are frequently getting in trouble. The question is, where should the line, if any, be drawn? I deliberately go out of my way to be politically INCORRECT wherever possible, BUT I have NO tolerance for intollerance!! I hold racists in contempt, because as far as I'm concerned, people are people no matter where they come from, no matter what language they speak, and no matter what colour their skin!!

Should we then be allowed to make 'racist' jokes? VERY difficult!! I remember growing up in Canada making Newfie jokes, which I later heard as Irish jokes, and no-one (even the Newfies) seemed to mind, but now we live in different times!! What do others think?

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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April 11th, 2007, 07:10
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April 11th, 2007, 14:06
Originally Posted by curious View Post
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Yes, but this stuff directly impacts the entire culture - the same people who are coming out decrying Bush's supporters and fundamental Christians as having stifled debate through a culture of fear are turning around now and doing the *exact same thing*. Freedom of speech is primarily meant to protect *minority* speech, by which it means stuff that is difficult and unpopular. non-Politically Correct speech is by definition in that realm - what happened to the old maxim 'I strongly disagree with what you say but I would fight to the death to protect your right to say it'?

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April 11th, 2007, 16:26
I've gone ape over the hypocrisy angle before so I'll just skip over that part of the discussion to save time.

I'd probably be more sympathetic to the whole PC thing if it wasn't abused for personal gain. Let's face it-Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are just looking for a soapbox to stand on. They're standing on the backs of "their own people" for their own personal gain. When the Rutgers team had their chance to respond, that was good. They were the butt of the joke, so they deserve the opportunity to tell Imus it wasn't funny if that's their feelings on it. Anyone else is just using the situation as a vehicle.

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April 11th, 2007, 16:44
"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words can never hurt me"

All else is just hypocrisy.

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April 11th, 2007, 18:40
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post

I'd probably be more sympathetic to the whole PC thing if it wasn't abused for personal gain. Let's face it-Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are just looking for a soapbox to stand on. They're standing on the backs of "their own people" for their own personal gain. When the Rutgers team had their chance to respond, that was good. They were the butt of the joke, so they deserve the opportunity to tell Imus it wasn't funny if that's their feelings on it. Anyone else is just using the situation as a vehicle.
Exactly. the women on the Rutgers team had every right to be ticked off, and to resent thier athletic ability being attributed to and denigrated by their race. The guy's an idiot. But the rest of the foaming stone-casters are out for their own dolla, and the end result of all this righteous indignation is to make the relationships between "diverse" groups of human beings harder.

Where there's smoke, there's mirrors.
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April 11th, 2007, 20:43
Ahhh… but aren't all of you criticizing Al and Jesse's use of free speech while simultaneously defending Imus'? Hmmm…? Smells like real hypocrisy there. You may not like how Al and Jesse conduct their business, but you shouldn't condemn them unless you're ready to condemn Imus.

More importantly, I do believe there are limits. Free Speech was never intended to defend anything and everything said. It was intended to prevent the government from selectively silencing or intimidating dissenters. Of course, it's been used in a variety of other ways, protecting artists for instance, but that doesn't mean it's a free-for-all. Racism is obviously an important and very emotionally-charged subject. I would rather it were talked about than not. Believe it or not, idiots like Imus, Krammer and Mel do have an influence on people. If we as a society are to never come down on public figures that spout racist nonsense, we will surely be complicit in sending a message that being a racist is OK. Of course, most (hopefully) would be able to differentiate between an idiot's abhorrent behavior and what is the "right thing to do". But do not kid yourselves, many will not. History is strewn with examples of societies that became corrupt at least in part through the complacency of the masses in the face of behavior and ideas that were evil and allowed to flourish unchecked.
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April 11th, 2007, 21:02
Originally Posted by chamr View Post
Ahhh… but aren't all of you criticizing Al and Jesse's use of free speech while simultaneously defending Imus'? Hmmm…? Smells like real hypocrisy there. You may not like how Al and Jesse conduct their business, but you shouldn't condemn them unless you're ready to condemn Imus.
As private figures they can spout their racist idiocy all they want, but when what they say begins to limit the possibility of national debate and even begins to impact what is allowable within schools and institutions - which it has - then they become unelected state officials acting in an authoritarian 'mind police' manner. If you listen to the Sharpton radio show, he has a congresswoman as a guest and cohort, and they react in more or less unison to everything that is said.

Look Imus is an idiot, Sharpton is an idiot, Jackson (pick one) is an idiot, Stern is an idiot, and so on - but they should be able to spout their idiocy freely.

And I don't buy that limited freedom of speech view "The principle of freedom of speech promotes dialogues on public issues, but it is most relevant to speech which is unpopular at the time it is made. As Pennsylvania state legislator Rep. Mark B. Cohen of Philadelphia once argued in a legislative debate, "Freedom of speech which is limited to freedom to say whatever a majority of the Pennsylvania legislature agrees with is not real freedom of speech." (wiki)

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April 11th, 2007, 21:17
….You may not like how Al and Jesse conduct their business, but you shouldn't condemn them unless you're ready to condemn Imus.
I don't condemn anyone's right to talk about whatever they want—I just resent the dumbing down of society that permits this kind of circus to flourish.
I would be equally turned off to see Imus being lauded as in the right. I most of all dislike the media forcing their flavoring of issues down my throat, their predigestign of fact, and their propaganda slant.

I think it's a sad state of affairs when people like [any of the above ] can make a living by shooting their mouths off at the expense of others. I don't have to respect them for it as if they were talking sense.

Where there's smoke, there's mirrors.
Last edited by magerette; April 11th, 2007 at 21:24.
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April 11th, 2007, 21:23
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
As private figures they can spout their racist idiocy all they want, but when what they say begins to limit the possibility of national debate and even begins to impact what is allowable within schools and institutions - which it has - then they become unelected state officials acting in an authoritarian 'mind police' manner.
You're falsely attributing to them a power they do not have. Al and Jesse do not make, enact or enforce legislation. What they do is exactly what the first amendment was intended to protect: they speak their mind in public forums in an attempt to influence policy and law. However, it's up to the duly elected officials of this country to decide whether that influence is legitimate and worth changing laws/policies/rules/whatever for. If you don't like the affect Al and Jesse's opinions have had on legislation, blame the lawmakers, not them. Vote for the people you think will not be influenced by Al and Jesse, but don't make the mistake of saying Al and Jesse are doing anything wrong, because they aren't.

As for the "mind police" limiting "national debate": hogwash. Al and Jesse can't force anyone out of the "national debate". If no one counters their viewpoints, it's for one of only two reasons: 1)after you strip away the bluster and bombast from what Al and Jesse have said, it's true OR 2)those with views counter to Al and Jesse are either too ineffective or too weak and therefore have no one to blame but themselves.


Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
And I don't buy that limited freedom of speech view "The principle of freedom of speech promotes dialogues on public issues, but it is most relevant to speech which is unpopular at the time it is made. As Pennsylvania state legislator Rep. Mark B. Cohen of Philadelphia once argued in a legislative debate, "Freedom of speech which is limited to freedom to say whatever a majority of the Pennsylvania legislature agrees with is not real freedom of speech." (wiki)
By quoting Cohen, you're making a terribly false analogy: there's a big difference between limiting speech that does not agree with the majority of a legislature and limiting speech that recklessly incites evil behavior counterproductive to the society at large.

I'm reminded of our own little free speech experiment right here in the RPGWatch forums: good ole' VB. We, as a community, supported the authority’s decision to ban him for his virulently misogynistic posts. Do you believe, in the name of free speech, we should have let him continue to post?
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April 11th, 2007, 21:45
I think the difference here is motivation. Jesse and Al are taking a stance because that gets Jesse and Al on television. I would bet you Jesse and Al couldn't name a single player off the Rutgers team. They are using the situation to benefit themselves and only themselves. It truly does more damage to "the cause" because a person subjected to Al's constant blather is far less likely to consider the issue rationally and give weight to the response of the Rutgers team, which would be the most powerful and legitimate statement that could come from the minority community.

For all the rhetoric, Jesse and Al do more to divide races than bring them together.

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April 12th, 2007, 01:03
I'm black and I definitely think Imus' comment was out of line. However, Sharpton and Jackson are wasting their time getting riled up over this issue. Having Imus fired and making him apologize ad-naseum won't do a damn thing to improve the plight of blacks in this country.

They need to wise up and look at the real problems: education, self discipline, poor self-image, questionable role-models.
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April 12th, 2007, 01:16
Elkston, forgive my ignorance, but I thought education, at least, was equal in America. Self discipline, is not a 'black' issue, it's a problem everywhere because 'liberals' have propagated the belief that we have a 'right' to 'express' ourselves as we wish. Poor self image, is also universal; just ask everyone on a diet. Role models? There aren't many around for anyone. In some ways, I think american blacks have some of the best: A good example would be the many NFL players who have risen above horrendous childhoods to make a success out of their lives. I'm not denying that their aren't 'race' problems in america, but I'm not sure the root causes are what you listed. Again, I'm looking 'in' from afar, but perception is important!!

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