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March 4th, 2011, 01:44
Jeff Vogel writes about his nervousness as he releases Avadon in his latest blog post. He nominates late April for the PC release and then the iPad version an undetermined time after that. The intro:
I'm writing this on Wednesday, after a week spent in a pretty continuous state of total freaking out. I am always nervous when releasing a new game. But a new game in a new world with a new system? After spending an unusual amount of time on it? I've been going kind of insane.

For those who are interested, early sales are quite strong. I'm starting to suspect that we aren't about to go out of business. And yet, most of the early sales are to die-heard fans. The question is how many new people will play it and like it. I think that it's solid, the world is cool, and the game itself is a lot of fun to play. But I might be wrong. It happens all the time.
More information.

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March 4th, 2011, 01:44
If his other games did good why does he suddenly think this one will not?

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March 4th, 2011, 05:27
Being a departure from his established series for the first time in many years, classic things changed that may irk those that dug the old formula, current game market being wildly unpredictable, etc. All that can be done is a case of best foot forward and getting it out there as much as possible.
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March 4th, 2011, 05:32
Originally Posted by getter77 View Post
Being a departure from his established series for the first time in many years, classic things changed that may irk those that dug the old formula, current game market being wildly unpredictable, etc. All that can be done is a case of best foot forward and getting it out there as much as possible.
I'm not sure it is that much a departure from the other games, I admit that I am not that informed on just how much has changed….it looks visually to be very similar.

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March 4th, 2011, 09:20
Anybody playing this already? Some first impressions would be welcome.
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March 4th, 2011, 11:08
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
If his other games did good why does he suddenly think this one will not?
I'm perplexed why you don't understand. I'd be certainly be nervous launching a new game - I'd be surprised if Gabe Newell or the Biodocs didn't get a little nervous.

More specifically, people react unpredictably. I'm not sure if it's deliberate or not but you've posted in both Avadon threads essentially saying the game is the same (this thread, elsewhere you dispute the difference in the new class system). So, on one hand, it's apparently the same game, which will turn off some people who want big changes.

On the other hand, some people are reacting like this - from Qt3:

This one has been dumbed down a lot: regenerating health and MP, auto-revival after fights, no stats or skills unlocking special dialogue options, quests markers, less classes, less difficult (Vogel stating that no one should die on normal difficulty)…

Jeff has decided to ignore the hardcore fans who made him successful in order to reach a more mainstream audience.
And there are far more radical sites than Qt3.

Is is the same or is it dumbed down and pandering to the masses? No wonder the guy is nervous.

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March 4th, 2011, 11:13
If that is true… what do hardcore role-playing fans have left?
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March 4th, 2011, 11:42
I wouldn't jump to conclusions yet. Yes, he has streamlined a couple of things but have a look through the impressions on his forums - people who started by saying "it's so easy" are soon saying "how do you kill xxx"?

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March 4th, 2011, 11:45
Hmm, so indies are streamlining now?

If true, I'll pass.

But I'll wait until I hear more.
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March 4th, 2011, 11:50
Originally Posted by Dhruin View Post
This one has been dumbed down a lot: regenerating health and MP, auto-revival after fights, no stats or skills unlocking special dialogue options, quests markers, less classes, less difficult (Vogel stating that no one should die on normal difficulty)

Jeff has decided to ignore the hardcore fans who made him successful in order to reach a more mainstream audience.
I certainly hope that it aint true.
If so, aye yai yai…
Quest markers and less classes are ok but the rest..
Make it atleast an option at the start of the game.
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March 4th, 2011, 12:56
There you go - if even a neutral comment by someone as benevolent towards spiderweb as Dhruin and citing Qt3 can make three poster worried, how would Jeff not be worried?
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March 4th, 2011, 13:01
Originally Posted by GhanBuriGhan View Post
There you go - if even a neutral comment by someone as benevolent towards spiderweb as Dhruin and citing Qt3 can make three poster worried, how would Jeff not be worried?
It's not about who commented citing from where, but about the content of the quote.

If that's the kind of gameplay I can look forward to in a relatively expensive indie game - then it's of zero interest to me.

I go for indie games for depth, challenge, and complexity - not to get a visually inferior version of modern AAA games - without any of the benefits.

So, the quote would have to be a lie for me to not worry - and I see no reason to lie about something so concrete.
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March 4th, 2011, 13:23
He's technically correct that the game includes regenerating health, for example, but he hasn't played it. Vogel explained all these changes in his blogs, so noone needs to lie about it — but that doesn't mean he's right about the result. txa1265 implied he loved it - and he has played it.

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March 4th, 2011, 13:26
Originally Posted by Dhruin View Post
He's technically correct that the game includes regenerating health, for example, but he hasn't played it. Vogel explained all these changes in his blogs, so noone needs to lie about it but that doesn't mean he's right about the result. txa1265 implied he loved it - and he has played it.
I'm sure lots of people love games with such features, but I generally don't.

I'm not saying the game is bad or anything like that.

I'm saying from what it sounds like, it's most definitely not for me.

Still, I'll take a look at it eventually and see for myself.
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March 4th, 2011, 13:46
Yeah, thats the nice thing about his large demos after all. No need to buy the cat in the bag.
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March 4th, 2011, 13:49
Originally Posted by GhanBuriGhan View Post
Yeah, thats the nice thing about his large demos after all. No need to buy the cat in the bag.
Yes, that's definitely a good thing.
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March 4th, 2011, 15:27
And now, i cannot wait any longer for a review…
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March 4th, 2011, 21:42
It's funny where people draw lines in the sand on "streamlining." There are people out there who pine for the days when an adventure game would be completely unwinnable if you missed a small item at the start of the game, never telling you you're playing a pointless game. When Lucasarts released adventure games where you could never make the game unwinnable people were like "OMG dumbed down trash!"

20 years later Lucasarts is the holy grail nostalgia pimp of adventure gaming.

I guess my point is that everything is relative. Vogel's changes might anger some and please others, the percentages being unknown really (hence his nervousness I would guess). I'm certainly looking forward to the PC demo so I can see for myself.
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March 4th, 2011, 21:57
Originally Posted by GhanBuriGhan View Post
Yeah, thats the nice thing about his large demos after all. No need to buy the cat in the bag.
Apparently, the demo of Avadon isn't that large. I haven't tried it (no Mac), but the posters at Spiderweb's forum say so. Two quotes from there: "The Demo is tiny! I mean it has to be the smallest one is Spidweb history." and "the demo was noticably not "big and huge" this time".

I'm looking forward to trying Avadon out once the PC demo gets released, but what I've read about it so far, makes me a bit worried too. DArtagnan said it well above:

Originally Posted by DArtagnan
I go for indie games for depth, challenge, and complexity - not to get a visually inferior version of modern AAA games - without any of the benefits.
My thoughts exactly.

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March 4th, 2011, 22:03
We'll see. TBH i thought his demos were too long for his own good. I hope its enough to evaluate the gameplay and the story, thats the purpose after all.
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