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Default Mass Effect 3 - No "meaningless stats"

May 7th, 2011, 02:08
OXM UK has a couple of small quotes from BioWare's Christina Norman on Mass Effect 3's combat. There won't be any background stats (or, at least, not "meaningless" ones) guiding combat - but since that was the direction already taken by ME2, it's no surprise:
"We want to enrich the role-playing aspects of the game, while making sure that they're always meaningful in combat," Norman told OXM when asked whether the threequel's fleet-footed tactical gunplay might clash with its RPG elements.

"We don't want to have any meaningless behind-the-scenes stat games, where the output is very minor in combat. Every single thing you do has a real impact in the battle."
More information.
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May 7th, 2011, 02:09
As long as there is an awesome button I'm good.
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May 7th, 2011, 03:03
There will be nothing but awesome button…
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May 7th, 2011, 03:48
Well I'm hoping that they remove controls, stats, inventory(already done!) and anything else that can get in my way of immersing myself in the game. I want to be able to play it while half sleeping/eating on my couch and just pressing an awesome button every once in a while.
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May 7th, 2011, 03:56
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May 7th, 2011, 04:20
Well this would worth more than just pointless private chit chat. Only that seems contradictory: "We want to enrich the role-playing aspects of the game, while making sure that they're always meaningful in combat".

That said I found ME1 quickly mildly fun then tedious, but ME2 was just a rather different game that surprised me and I found it very fun. Not sure it was anymore a RPG, perhaps more a new fusion of genres. But I'm very curious to see where they'll go with ME3, and in no way I would be tempted to make any advice on it.

Let see it come and see the result is more interesting, if it ends be a failure, no importance, better they tempt again do what they think even if it seems to me a little weird.
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May 7th, 2011, 08:09
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
Well this would worth more than just pointless private chit chat. Only that seems contradictory: "We want to enrich the role-playing aspects of the game, while making sure that they're always meaningful in combat".

That said I found ME1 quickly mildly fun then tedious, but ME2 was just a rather different game that surprised me and I found it very fun. Not sure it was anymore a RPG, perhaps more a new fusion of genres. But I'm very curious to see where they'll go with ME3, and in no way I would be tempted to make any advice on it.

Let see it come and see the result is more interesting, if it ends be a failure, no importance, better they tempt again do what they think even if it seems to me a little weird.
ME2 is, in my opinion a shooter with rpg elements and story focus. And thats far better than strange RPG/Shooter mix part one was. I always felt that they planned part one to be played like Kotor but then thought that a FPS style would be better and tacked that one.

Now of they would only get rid of that stupid cover system I'd be even more pleased but I highly doubt that. Cover is "DA THING" at the moment.
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May 7th, 2011, 08:16
I think they have a different idea of what's meaningless than I do.

Bioware meaningless = won't generate more money through larger audience.

DArt meaningless = Bioware game design philoshopy.
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May 7th, 2011, 08:48
This is incredible … just wow. I didn't think there was anything left in ME2 to dumb down. Take out anything else from there, and labelling the ME3 box "RPG" should go to court as misleading advertising.

Why the hell does BioWare screw with winning formulas? Are they mad? Would you rather have 4 million guaranteed sales, the majority of whom will be to delighted fans that will blindly pre-oreder your next release on brand name alone, or do you fiddle with it and risk losing half your sales, and half your avid fans, a-la DA2?

Honestly, I never thought I'd live to see the day when ME 2 (TWO) fans were worried about dumbing down. BioWare has lost the plot. Either hubris or unquestioning obedience to their EA masters has made them blind to the obvious. Hope this is their last obvious blunder and they now get liquidated by EA (all eyes on SWTOR now). Then maybe at last some other developer can take grow and take over that "niche". One that does not wish to wipe out RPGs for the sake of appealing to FPS console kids (and then even failing at that).
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May 7th, 2011, 09:49
I think you guys are jumping the gun with the Bioware bashing here. Removing anything meaningless is good, they did not say they are removing stats completely. Let's see how it all shakes out toward release, okay?
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May 7th, 2011, 10:05
Originally Posted by DoctorNarrative View Post
I think you guys are jumping the gun with the Bioware bashing here. Removing anything meaningless is good, they did not say they are removing stats completely. Let's see how it all shakes out toward release, okay?
Nah, I'm going to have to go by my experience with Bioware. At this point, they're WAY beyond the benefit of the doubt.

However, if they ever manage to go in the right direction again, I'll be happy to acknowledge it. In fact, I'll be plain happy - as they used to make fantastic stuff.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:06
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Nah, I'm going to have to go by my experience with Bioware. At this point, they're WAY beyond the benefit of the doubt.

However, if they ever manage to go in the right direction again, I'll be happy to acknowledge it. In fact, I'll be plain happy - as they used to make fantastic stuff.
ME2 was an amazing game. DA2 was made by a completely different team. The people who made Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2 have certainly earned the benefit of the doubt from me, several times over.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:11
Originally Posted by Gaxkang View Post
This is incredible just wow. I didn't think there was anything left in ME2 to dumb down. Take out anything else from there, and labelling the ME3 box "RPG" should go to court as misleading advertising.
Well, you could have gone to court with ME2 as well. It looks like another BioWare game I'm skipping, hmm, 2 in a row?! Still have some hope for SW:TOR, though.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:13
Originally Posted by DoctorNarrative View Post
ME2 was an amazing game. DA2 was made by a completely different team. The people who made Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2 have certainly earned the benefit of the doubt from me, several times over.
Are you aware that not everyone likes what they did with Mass Effect 2?

Also, while I enjoyed Mass Effect a lot for its cinematic appeal - I found it a HUGE step down from KotOR in terms of game mechanics.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:16
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Are you aware that not everyone likes what they did with Mass Effect 2?

Also, while I enjoyed Mass Effect a lot for its cinematic appeal - I found it a HUGE step down from KotOR in terms of game mechanics.
How can you even compare ME and KotOR? They're two incredibly different games.

As for not liking ME2 sure, some people don't. Some people dislike any game, no matter what. The fact remains though it was a critical and commercial blockbuster which satisfied the vast majority of players. More importantly I personally loved it, so I trust the team to make another game I will enjoy.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:29
I don't think it's possible to take a huge step down from KoTOR in terms of game mechanics.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:35
Originally Posted by DoctorNarrative View Post
How can you even compare ME and KotOR? They're two incredibly different games.
They're both science fiction cinematic small-party based CRPGs with real-time pausable combat, from Bioware "masters of formulaic development".

Yeah, COMPLETELY different

As for not liking ME2 sure, some people don't. Some people dislike any game, no matter what. The fact remains though it was a critical and commercial blockbuster which satisfied the vast majority of players. More importantly I personally loved it, so I trust the team to make another game I will enjoy.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

If you think I dislike any game, no matter what, then why don't you state it plainly.

I think you know that I don't, so this must be an irrational position - given how you've previously accepted that such things are always completely subjective.

We both know that commercial and critical success means very little in terms of what the individual wants and likes. It can't be hard for you to come up with an example for yourself.

Mass Effect 2 was a cinematic and linear corridor/cover shooter with minimal CRPG mechanics. If you're into sci-fi movies with middling plots and characters, more than you're into intricate mechanics - then I can certainly see why you'd love it. A lot of people obviously agree.

That's MY opinion.

Glad you enjoyed it, though - and let's hope their next step in the Mass Effect progression is one that will suit you.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:35
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I don't think it's possible to take a huge step down from KoTOR in terms of game mechanics.
I certainly didn't expect Bioware to do it for Mass Effect. Suffice to say that I was quite disappointed.
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May 7th, 2011, 10:53
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
They're both science fiction cinematic small-party based CRPGs with real-time pausable combat, from Bioware "masters of formulaic development".

Yeah, COMPLETELY different
One is a shooter and the other is hidden dice rolls and turns with no direct action. Pretty freaking different.

Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

If you think I dislike any game, no matter what, then why don't you state it plainly.

I think you know that I don't, so this must be an irrational position - given how you've previously accepted that such things are always completely subjective.

We both know that commercial and critical success means very little in terms of what the individual wants and likes. It can't be hard for you to come up with an example for yourself.

Mass Effect 2 was a cinematic and linear corridor/cover shooter with minimal CRPG mechanics. If you're into sci-fi movies with middling plots and characters, more than you're into intricate mechanics - then I can certainly see why you'd love it. A lot of people obviously agree.

That's MY opinion.

Glad you enjoyed it, though - and let's hope their next step in the Mass Effect progression is one that will suit you.
I think you're reading much too far into my comment. My point was ME2 was generally a very highly thought of game, therefore most people are probably going to trust them a bit with ME3, myself included. Obviously some people disagree and of course there is nothing wrong with that.

I like more than one genre. I like deep tactical and turn-based RPG combat and I also like simple and purely skill-based shooter games. For me ME2 was a great combination of different genres.
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May 7th, 2011, 11:03
Originally Posted by DoctorNarrative View Post
One is a shooter and the other is hidden dice rolls and turns with no direct action. Pretty freaking different.
You're talking about differences in the combat system - and I'm talking about the games overall.

In any case, we'll have to agree to disagree about this. Of all the things likely to be debated, this has to be one of the most surprising - especially from someone like you.

I think you're reading much too far into my comment. My point was ME2 was generally a very highly thought of game, therefore most people are probably going to trust them a bit with ME3, myself included. Obviously some people disagree and of course there is nothing wrong with that.

I like more than one genre. I like deep tactical and turn-based RPG combat and I also like simple and purely skill-based shooter games. For me ME2 was a great combination of different genres.
I like more than one genre as well. But I prefer some genres over others. In this case, I'm talking about CRPGs - and how I like them. If they want to be making shooters, then fine, but don't go talking about stats in CRPGs as meaningless - unless you're willing to be called on it.

There's a reason you have stats, even if there's no immediately visible result from all of them.

I'm not particularly fond of shooters - and I can take them or leave them.

A good story-driven sci-fi shooter is fine, and Mass Effect 2 would quality as decent. Personally, I'd probably rate it 7 or something like that - that low mostly because they let monkeys design their combat cover setups, and because I wasn't expecting THAT much of a shooter.

Mass Effect 2 done like a proper CRPG, though, would most likely rate 9 or more. Except I didn't care for the story and characters, but then again - I was always a gameplay guy.
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