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February 6th, 2012, 17:54
Originally Posted by grackle View Post
Silversword is an Indie homage to Bard's Tale designed for iPad but playable
for those with high dexterity on iPhone. http://silversword-rpg.com/
I have happily lost many hours to it.
grack
Thanks for that - I hadn't seen that one. I grabbed it and started playing. Great style and am enjoying it thus far (iPad).

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February 7th, 2012, 09:24
Quest and Undercroft are the best I have played on ipad. Silversword looks interesting.

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February 7th, 2012, 11:47
Why is it that an homage is the new way of saying rip-off?
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February 7th, 2012, 12:24
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Why is it that an homage is the new way of saying rip-off?
Because it sounds better?

And hey, as I was playing Silversword while waiting for my son at a Dr. appt last night I wasn't worried about that … if there were other games in the same style that would be one thing, but there aren't.

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February 7th, 2012, 12:42
Originally Posted by Machiavelli View Post
Maybe you know other games like Spiderweb's Avadon for the iPad. I love how long and intricate it is, reminds me of UltimaIV on the Commodore 64
I got Avadon for the iPad. Problem is, like most games, I hardly ever played it. I think the thing is that there are so many cool little things that I can play on my iPhone and iPad, that I never commit to just one title, much like on PC/console, I might add. Just worse on mobile devices, since things are cheaper there and I spend less time on them.
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February 7th, 2012, 12:44
Originally Posted by Thaurin View Post
I got Avadon for the iPad. Problem is, like most games, I hardly ever played it. I think the thing is that there are so many cool little things that I can play on my iPhone and iPad, that I never commit to just one title, much like on PC/console, I might add. Just worse on mobile devices, since things are cheaper there and I spend less time on them.
I don't have that issue with games, but definitely *do* have it with books … so I have a Nook Touch exclusively for reading and find I read a ton these days as a result.

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February 7th, 2012, 12:49
I wish I could control my interests like that. I mean, if I could play a CRPG for 15 minutes and get the same level of enjoyment out of it as when I'm playing because I enjoy it (not because I need time to pass quickly) - I'd love these rip-offs.

But I can't.

I guess you could say I'm greedy in that way. My GF, on the other hand, can spend hours and hours playing Mahjong - and she loves it. She's probably spent more time playing iterations of Mahjong over the years than I did playing WoW - and that's QUITE a bit.

I wonder why I'm cursed with this idea of having to do something worthwhile with my time - because I don't actually manage to do anything worthwhile when worrying about it having to be worthwhile

When I sit down to play one of these cute little rip-offs, my mind immediately explains to me that there are games a million times better on my PC - so why the hell am I wasting time like this?

It's not like when I was a kid - because interesting games were few and far between. At least, it seemed that way. Also, nothing appeared like a rip-off - because I hadn't experienced very much. I could entertain myself for what seemed like weeks or months with a single game, back then. This, despite most of them being incredibly buggy and unpolished.

I think EXTREME oversaturation is my problem - and I find it impossible to enjoy games that don't represent "the best available" at any given moment.

Also, the nature of these handheld platforms ensure that the vast majority of rip-offs don't control ideally.

I find that as long as I have a single interesting/deep game available on my PC - there's nothing to be gained from owning another platform - especially if it's technically inferior. I can "justify" my consoles because of the occasional exclusive and the "living room" experience - but I almost never play a console game.

I remember when I was younger, I could spend weeks planning to buy a new platform and experiencing whatever games available on it. It was like entering a new world every time. I've owned almost all consoles of the past for this reason But I never actually completed any game on them until I got my Xbox 360 - because it wasn't until then that the games appealed to me sufficiently (and they were available months before their PC counterparts).

These days, there's a new iteration of a platform every week - and a significant new platform every 3-6 months. I guess I could budget for one a month, if I wanted to. It would have been a dream as a kid to have so much entertainment within my grasp.

Yet, we only have 24 hours in a day - and we're lucky to have more than a few hours available to play games.

I've found that the more I have access to, the less it appeals to me - because no matter how many games I can play - there's a rather strict limit to what my "entertainment threshold" can deal with.

It's rather ironic, I'd say
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February 7th, 2012, 13:38
Wow, what a condescending shit attitude you have! Too bad you are so blinded with your self importance that you can't see how much of a wanker you are.

We get it, everyone else and their opinions are inferior … as usual. Do us a favor - we are hhere as gamers sharing iPad games, something you don't have a clue about … so go the fuck away and post in threads ralated to something that warrants your interest.

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February 7th, 2012, 13:55
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
Wow, what a condescending shit attitude you have! Too bad you are so blinded with your self importance that you can't see how much of a wanker you are.

We get it, everyone else and their opinions are inferior … as usual. Do us a favor - we are hhere as gamers sharing iPad games, something you don't have a clue about … so go the fuck away and post in threads ralated to something that warrants your interest.
Ehm, what?

I went in-depth about how I feel about these games - and it's nothing new from me.

You go on a serious tirade, because?

Point out where I say your opinions are inferior - or where I'm acting superior, please. I even pointed out that I never manage to do anything worthwhile when I don't play these games.

After you take a deep breath, that is.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:09
Originally Posted by DArtagnan
I can "justify" my consoles because of the occasional exclusive and the "living room" experience - but I almost never play a console game.
I think that you maybe need to accept that there is such a thing as a "mobile" experience, too, in order to see the value of these "technically inferior" games. If you can see the value of exclusives and the "living room" experience, maybe it's possible to treat these small screens the same way, because to me, a lot of the wonder of it is having it always with me on the go. I can tolerate less modern graphics more on my iPhone, but I certainly do not need a gamepad or physical keyboard to enjoy all my mobile games. In fact, that would largely defeat the purpose and ruin the experience.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:12
Also, I can still enjoy a good PS2 game and I even finished Final Fantasy 7 and 9 a few years ago, even though there are technically *much* more advanced games on the market now. The historic value, story, interesting setting, relaxed living room gameplay and emulation coolness factor were enough to get me to play them.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:15
Originally Posted by Thaurin View Post
I think that you maybe need to accept that there is such a thing as a "mobile" experience, too, in order to see the value of these "technically inferior" games. If you can see the value of exclusives and the "living room" experience, maybe it's possible to treat these small screens the same way, because to me, a lot of the wonder of it is having it always with me on the go. I can tolerate less modern graphics more on my iPhone, but I certainly do not need a gamepad or physical keyboard to enjoy all my mobile games. In fact, that would largely defeat the purpose and ruin the experience.
Oh, I do appreciate that some people are "on the go" much more than myself. I'm much more of a homebody, and I generally only travel by train for 10 minutes at a time.

The thing is, however, that I've never been a fan of games that didn't provoke some level of immersion. Well, not entirely true - but I've never seen games as "timewasters".

Before TXA calls that a superior attitude, I'm in no way claiming to be "worthwhile" with my time. Quite the contrary. It's just that I'm "hung up" about time - and as such, I can't just willfully waste it. I waste time against my will, so to speak. A LOT.

Games, for me, are "art" and they are meaningful (as far as anything entertaining is meaningful) - and my time spent with any game is about ANYTHING but wasting time. It's about filling a need that my brain seems to have - and for that to be accomplished - I need "peace and quiet" and complexity/immersion/exploration - stuff like that.

I wish (yes, I TRULY WISH) I could enjoy "timewasters" on the go - but I just can't. I get bored.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:18
Also, I can still enjoy a good PS2 game and I even finished Final Fantasy 7 and 9 a few years ago, even though there are technically *much* more advanced games on the market now. The historic value, story, interesting setting, relaxed living room gameplay and emulation coolness factor were enough to get me to play them.
It's not so much about technical quality for me. I can play Baldur's Gate and games like that easily. Aesthetic quality, however, is relatively important.

Problem with Final Fantasy is that I despise japanese RPG paradigms

I've almost never encountered a console exclusive that truly caught my interest. It does happen. I loved Red Dead Redemption, for instance.

But it's very rare, and it used to be even rarer.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:25
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Oh, I do appreciate that some people are "on the go" much more than myself. I'm much more of a homebody, and I generally only sit in the train for 10 minutes at a time.

The thing is, however, that I've never been a fan of games that didn't provoke some level of immersion. Well, not entirely true - but I've never seen games as "timewasters".
They don't have to be timewasters. I mean to say that, I think, to me, it sometimes appears that a game is *better* on my iPhone. That is to say, I wouldn't enjoy it as much on the PC. Much of that has to do with the feeling of wonder that I'm playing this on a mobile device. That translates to enjoyment.

Games, for me, are "art" and they are meaningful (as far as anything entertaining is meaningful) - and my time spent with any game is about ANYTHING but wasting time. It's about filling a need that my brain seems to have - and for that to be accomplished - I need "peace and quiet" and complexity.
Well, there you go. You get stuck up into having "peace and quiet" for your gaming. While certainly possible with mobile devices, I can understand how you'd sooner reach for the PC or console when they are available at home. However, you could perhaps see some of these mobile titles as "bite-sized art" because some of them pretty damn well are. They're just not typically 20 million budget pieces of art.

I gather from this that you're not the type of person to fall for a low-budget indie game. I don't typically do, either, but I can still enjoy a game of The Binding of Isaac on the PC, and for some reason, I think a game like this would fit even better on a mobile device. I think that's part of the issue here: even on the PC and console, you're only looking for the best and latest that is available, while so much more is available. You are not able to settle for a smaller, Xbox Live Arcade kind of title—because there is Skyrim which has tons of more content, better graphics and full voice acting.

Well, that's a preference that is independent of mobile platforms.
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February 7th, 2012, 14:28
I never played Bard's Tale trilogy and ipad with its new user interface is the perfect way to try it.

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February 7th, 2012, 14:50
Originally Posted by Thaurin View Post
They don't have to be timewasters. I mean to say that, I think, to me, it sometimes appears that a game is *better* on my iPhone. That is to say, I wouldn't enjoy it as much on the PC. Much of that has to do with the feeling of wonder that I'm playing this on a mobile device. That translates to enjoyment.
I won't argue that better games can't exist on the iPhone (or whatever mobile platform) - just that I've yet to see one. But that's my own subjective opinion, naturally.

Of all the "best" CRPGs I've seen (around 20-30 by now) - they've all been inferior in terms of modern games with similar gameplay.

Well, there you go. You get stuck up into having "peace and quiet" for your gaming. While certainly possible with mobile devices, I can understand how you'd sooner reach for the PC or console when they are available at home. However, you could perhaps see some of these mobile titles as "bite-sized art" because some of them pretty damn well are. They're just not typically 20 million budget pieces of art.
Yeah, I'm not comfortable trying to concentrate with a lot of background noise. I can do it, on occasion, but it's very rare.

I don't mean to say there isn't quality work on mobile platforms - but then again, it's not enough that it's quality work. It's more about the natural limitations of the small devices - and especially the market expectations. The pricing, for instance, is a problem - because it's the "norm" to have 5-hour games.

I can't enjoy 5-hour games, for some reason. Well, I can if they're particularly impressive or brings something profound to the table. I've yet to experience that on a mobile platform.

I've seen some "neat" games that do really amazing stuff considering the platform. Space Miner is a good example. It's FANTASTIC for the platform. But why would I play that over Privateer/EvE/Frontier? I mean, it's not enough that it's a work of art. It needs to offer me something MORE and something NEW.

I gather from this that you're not the type of person to fall for a low-budget indie game. I don't typically do, either, but I can still enjoy a game of The Binding of Isaac on the PC, and for some reason, I think a game like this would fit even better on a mobile device. I think that's part of the issue here: even on the PC and console, you're only looking for the best and latest that is available, while so much more is available. You are not able to settle for a smaller, Xbox Live Arcade kind of title—because there is Skyrim which has tons of more content, better graphics and full voice acting.
Generally, no I don't fall for them. But it's possible. I liked Eschalon - for example. Not an amazing game, but I really liked it.

Most low-budget indie games are not for me, because the people behind them simply don't want to achieve the kind of thing I'd require to have fun.

I don't really want throwbacks to ancient gameplay. I want evolution.

Again, I'm really greedy - and I mean that sincerely.

Well, that's a preference that is independent of mobile platforms.
What do you mean, exactly?
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February 7th, 2012, 15:05
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
What do you mean, exactly?
Well, I mean that there are "technically inferior" games that get released on the PC, too, even if the PC hardware is not the thing limiting these games. Some of them go on to do very well. People seem to like them. You apparently, don't in most cases. So it's not that you don't like mobile games—it's that you want the best of breed, the best that can be had right now. Best here means technically to a large extent, as I feel that gameplay can be as good on any platform as it can be.

For example, Ghost Trick: Phantom Detective is a nicely done game utilizing touch controls very well. It's NDS port, I think, but works great on the iPhone as well.

So CRPGs do a bad job for the most part compared to PC, agreed. But pick-up strategy games are particularly good for small screens, especially asynchronous multiplayer. I'd like to see you start a PC game 6 times a day to make a move.
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February 7th, 2012, 15:16
Originally Posted by Thaurin View Post
Well, I mean that there are "technically inferior" games that get released on the PC, too, even if the PC hardware is not the thing limiting these games. Some of them go on to do very well. People seem to like them. You apparently, don't in most cases. So it's not that you don't like mobile games—it's that you want the best of breed, the best that can be had right now. Best here means technically to a large extent, as I feel that gameplay can be as good on any platform as it can be.
I'm not sure why you insist on me wanting "technical excellence" - when I haven't said that. I said I want the "best available" and that's mostly about depth, breadth, and complexity.

The reason I "don't like" mobile games isn't that such games can't exist on such a platform - but that they DON'T exist on such a platform. Naturally, we'd have to agree about what such things mean.

But even if they did exist, I'd still be facing tiny screens and a clumsy interface.

The Tablet platform is one notable potential exception, and it's one platform I haven't personally owned.

There are games that would be feasible on a Tablet that I'd be able to enjoy, and I don't see any reason why some iteration of a "Baldur's Gate" couldn't exist. It's just that there's no financial incentive to create a game of that scope - when people are willing to settle for 5-10 hour RPGs.

Avadon is an example of something similar, but it's not my kind of game. I find it profoundly stale and lacking in terms of soul and general gameplay. Then again, such is my opinion of most indie games on the PC as well.

For example, Ghost Trick: Phantom Detective is a nicely done game utilizing touch controls very well. It's NDS port, I think, but works great on the iPhone as well.
Haven't played it.

So CRPGs do a bad job for the most part compared to PC, agreed. But pick-up strategy games are particularly good for small screens, especially asynchronous multiplayer. I'd like to see you start a PC game 6 times a day to make a move.
To me, "pick-up" strategy is almost a contradiction in terms - when I think about what I like about strategy games

That said, I almost never encounter a PC strategy game that truly appeals to me these days. One reason is that I can't really enjoy a strategy game unless there's a feasible and fully functional multiplayer mode - as a player horizon. Even something high-profile like Civ 5 has a shitty multiplayer implementation, because of the nature of their unit movement/combat system.
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February 7th, 2012, 15:24
Okay, so then let's just agree that you're a really difficult person to please and you need to STFU and GTFO.
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February 7th, 2012, 15:26
I'll GTFO if we compromise and you admit that you're way too easy to please, and that you're an easily exploitable consumer
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