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Default Torchlight II - "Size Matters"

July 24th, 2012, 20:21
It seems the vast majority of enemies are killed with one blow, is that right?

This is quite different from the type of combat gameplay I usually prefer, where almost every enemy presents a significant challenge, and you die and reload frequently to get through most battles.


Originally Posted by kalniel View Post
It's the same kind of thing that had people playing arcade games before personal computers became obtainable. You're in control of something and you have to act and think to overcome the challenge and survive to carry on playing. As you get further you come across new and harder challenges that require you have have improved your characters ability to face them (level, skills, runes, items etc.) along with new player techniques and skill. The successful overcoming of a challenge that you realistically thought you couldn't before increases dopamine levels and you feel more elated, just the same way crossing that gorge or climbing that ridge etc. makes you feel.

Games that fail to make you think you've actually overcome the challenge are not as fun, while well polished games of the likes Blizzard are known for, nail it.
Thanks, this is a great explanation, kalniel.
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July 24th, 2012, 20:35
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
These kinds of action-RPGs are very repetitive though. You have to REALLY like clicking furiously and killing things and picking up what drops from the loot pinatas. Rather mindless, but a good stress relief.
A bad one would be mindless throughout (though appealing to those who play games to recharge rather than discharge - see Chris Talyors thoughts on casual vs other games), a good one might deliberately use mindless sections to provide contrast for the high intensity/tough bits. Game design is not a million miles away from other forms of artist expression - films that are of the same intensity throughout are not as impactful as those who provide changes of pace so you feel the intense bits more acutely. Same in music and the invention of the concerto.

A cycle in Diablo might go something like:
"hey a wimpy baddy. I'm a wimp but it's no problem"
"hey a group of wimpy baddies. It's probably no problem, but I've gotta watch my movement so as not to get surrounded"
"oo I leveled, I can take on groups no problem! Look how powerful I am now."
"OK now this is a bit mindless"
"hello new bad guy. Ah, I'm dead"
"OK, my group tactics don't work against this new bad guy. Try new skills/runes/approach"
"Hmm I can do this now, yay. I'm brilliant."
"Oh now he's got a friend…

and so on. What Diablo 3 gets slightly wrong is that the whole first difficulty setting is a bit easy for people used to these kinds of games, so it's slightly more mindless/gives you time to enjoy the show/story/scenery. Later difficulties provide a better challenge. But it could be argued they've done that to try and get new players in - there hasn't been a Diablo for some time after all!

Originally Posted by CountChocula View Post
It seems the vast majority of enemies are killed with one blow, is that right?

This is quite different from the type of combat gameplay I usually prefer, where almost every enemy presents a significant challenge, and you die and reload frequently to get through most battles.
The one hit kill stuff is there to make you feel powerful - when you kill 50 mobs in one hit and the screen explodes with bits of monster you do kinda. But it's a contrast again, there's lots of bad guys that take many more hits, exemplified by the boss characters which take several minutes and have battles lasting over several stages.
Last edited by kalniel; July 24th, 2012 at 20:49.
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July 24th, 2012, 20:59
Certainly their are difficulty spikes in these games, and when you get to hell is where it is really gets interesting and challenging in D2, and so you had better have been optimizing your build and loot loadout/customization. But before this, most of the game, assuming you start at easy difficulty, is rather mindless clicking.
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