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Default Grimoire - Crowdfunding campaign at indiegogo

October 16th, 2012, 00:01
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
Dhruin you made it pretty clear in your original post how you felt by what you bolded in the newspost. I'm not sure what cleve did to you, must have been something personal. I have played the game, Corwin let me see it. I think if it ever gets finished it will be quite good.
The bolded text in the newspost was bolded by Cleve. The formatting was coppied as is from the indiegogo post - bolded text included. If you think the bolding implies sarcasm then take it up with Cleve.
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October 16th, 2012, 00:16
Giving money to Cleve = big shame job.

I'm guessing his plan is to package it with DOSBox?
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October 16th, 2012, 00:44
Originally Posted by Dhruin View Post
Admittedly, I'm not the greatest fan of 1st-person "blob" games.
what's a "blob" game? I haven't heard this term before.

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October 16th, 2012, 01:08
Blob means that all party members move together as "blob". They can't be moved separately. A blob game can distinguish between front and back and left and right positioning within the party when it comes to combat, though. Wizardry, Might Magic, Eye of the Beholder, and Undercroft are all examples of blob party RPGs.
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October 16th, 2012, 03:03
Originally Posted by RampantCoyote View Post
Man. If I made $250,000 on Frayed Knights: The Skull of S'makh-Daon, I'd be ecstatic.

Obviously I'm doing it wrong. Selling games doesn't work. Promising games to get crowdfunding - that's where the action's at…
I couldn't help but make that same… analysis. there's a very weird psychological phenomenon at play here.

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October 16th, 2012, 03:25
It's all about the pitch. If you are great at selling and crappy at delivering then crowdfunding is where it's at.
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October 16th, 2012, 03:45
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
It's all about the pitch. If you are great at selling and crappy at delivering then crowdfunding is where it's at.
Hopefully it is also used by group of people that can do both…
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October 16th, 2012, 09:19
I'm weirded out when functioning game companies like Obsidian start making kickstarts. I can perfectly understand the need for crowd funding for projects like Double Fine and Shadowrun, because those games could not happen in any other way. But using Kickstarter for basically overpriced pre-orders and "incentive" to finish a game that's practically done is just IMO taking advantage of people. If a game can be finished without the gaming community to pitch in and help out, it should. Kickstarter should be the last resort to fund a game, not a pre-order store.
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October 16th, 2012, 09:34
I much rather have the devs themselves + game community make the gameplay / design descisions rather than a publisher like EA..

Um, overpriced? How many games cost $20 these days?

I'm not saying there won't be Kickstarter games that will fail and be complete shit, but again, there's no one holding a gun to my head forcing me to buy.

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October 16th, 2012, 09:47
Originally Posted by vurt View Post

Um, overpriced? How many games cost $20 these days?
I mean the higher tiers where you pay 100+ bucks for junk that's not worth it. If you'd buy a similar collector's edition from stores, you'd pay around 70$ for similar "perks" that usually go for over a hundred dollars in kickstarts.

Not to mention even paying the lowest sums for the digital downloads is not the same as a pre-order. If a Kickstarter project fails and there's no game, you lose the money. If you pre-oder a game, you usually pay when the game is ready to ship or at the very least get your money back if they can't deliver. Kickstarters are a good deal for the publisher, not the customer. I've been willing to take my chances to help out with projects that need helping, but some Kickstarter projects don't need outside funding at all.
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October 16th, 2012, 09:59
People paying 100+ bucks are people really wanting to help out, and that's their choice. It's hardly about the T-shirt or whatever.

Kickstarter projects doesnt have a publisher, the "publisher" is the community. That's the whole point.

They dont need outside funding? Who do you think is going to fund a game similar to Torment or BG these days? EA? lol..

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October 16th, 2012, 10:09
Originally Posted by vurt View Post
People paying 100+ bucks are people really wanting to help out, and that's their choice. It's hardly about the T-shirt or whatever.
Exactly. People are basically sold the idea that they are "helping", doing something good, instead of just buying stuff. Some projects need that help. Some probably don't.

Originally Posted by vurt View Post
Kickstarter projects doesnt have a publisher, the "publisher" is the community. That's the whole point.
The publisher is the person/group that makes the game. Funders are just the source for money.

Originally Posted by vurt View Post
They dont need outside funding? Who do you think is going to fund a game similar to Torment or BG these days? EA? lol..
It's impossible to say how much Obsidian needs money for Project Eternity. It is, however, pretty safe to say that Grimoire doesn't need funding, much less $250,000.
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October 16th, 2012, 10:16
Originally Posted by gozioso View Post
Wizardry 8 represents such a massive step up from this type of gameplay (in pretty much every conceivable way), that it is quite painful to regress. I would love to see a Kickstarter which is a spiritual successor to Wizardry 8.
Well, actually there is. But nobody cares about it in this forum:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/…te-and-tom-hal

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October 16th, 2012, 10:35
Originally Posted by Raggie View Post
Exactly. People are basically sold the idea that they are "helping", doing something good, instead of just buying stuff. Some projects need that help. Some probably don't.
People can't work for free, everyone needs money, it's really that simple.

The publisher is the person/group that makes the game. Funders are just the source for money.
A publisher is someone who helps a project get done by funding it. The group that makes the game are usually refered to as the developers.

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October 16th, 2012, 10:39
Originally Posted by vurt View Post
Um, overpriced? How many games cost $20 these days?
All of them at some point. I don't think I've payed more than $20 for a game in years!

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October 16th, 2012, 11:05
Originally Posted by vurt View Post
People can't work for free, everyone needs money, it's really that simple.
Obviously, but there are more ways to fund a game besides a kickstarter or EA.

Originally Posted by vurt View Post
A publisher is someone who helps a project get done by funding it. The group that makes the game are usually refered to as the developers.
A publisher is someone who publishes the game. Some developers publish by themselves. Some have outside publishers. A funder is a funder, not a publisher.
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October 16th, 2012, 11:18
Originally Posted by Raggie View Post
It's impossible to say how much Obsidian needs money for Project Eternity. It is, however, pretty safe to say that Grimoire doesn't need funding, much less $250,000.
I think the point of the confusion is that you originally separated Obsidian (a "functioning company") from Double Fine (who…aren't? Confused.)

If we are talking about Grimoire, I'm sure a lot of people agree they don't need the money. If we are talking about Obsidian, I'm sure most disagree.

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October 16th, 2012, 11:21
Originally Posted by Raggie View Post
Obviously, but there are more ways to fund a game besides a kickstarter or EA.
It's not as easy as you seem to believe. Have you ever been involved in game development? The great thing about Kickstarter is that they don't need to listen to the publisher and what they demand, instead they'll listen to the customers and do the game they want. I fail to see how this is something bad.

Will some Kickstarter projects fail? Sure, but the same thing happens over and over with games made with traditional publishers, i'm really happy that we now have something else.

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October 16th, 2012, 11:29
I really don't know if Obsidian needs money, but as an established company one could think they have some from their previous games. I admit I don't know anything about Double Fine, I just assumed it's a startup (I didn't even hear about their kickstart until it was over) like Jane Jensen's Pinkerton Road Studios.
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October 16th, 2012, 11:33
Originally Posted by vurt View Post
It's not as easy as you seem to believe. Have you ever been involved in game development?
Have you? Publishers and outside funding are not a requirement. Traditionally games have been funded with the profits from previous projects, just like companies in general have funded their R&D and future investments.

Hey, I'm not saying Kickstarter can't be a good thing. I just suspect we have come to a point where game devs, who could have funded the game by themselves, are simply (mis)using Kickstarter, like Grimoire. I'm sorry I brought up Obsidian, I don't know what their financial situation is. I just find it iffy and suspicious that devs you could have assumed would have been able to publish a project without any kickstart, are now asking for the gaming community to pay $140 for something that would cost $70 in a store. In exchange of "feeling good".
Last edited by Raggie; October 16th, 2012 at 11:44.
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