The case of Amanda Todd

Originally Posted by Firestorm
This may sound very cold but I really couldn't care less, people kill them self all the time and cyber bullying is just one of many many reasons the do it.

Sure its a tragic case, the parents/school should have been there and people wasting there time bullying other are generally human garbage, but the internet is huge and it just one of many things you can spend your time on, if your are having bad time on one internet page try visiting new ones, play a single player game or just go outside and do something else.

I know there are probably some people that feel strongly about this and this isn't meant to troll anyone, I just can't feel bad for anyone living in today's western world with all the freedoms that entail and then commit suicide.

Are you suggesting that everyone in the western world should feel wonderful and can't be vulnerable to bullying or a large variety of emotional problems?

As for sounding cold, I guess you do. That said, I suspect we're talking ignorance about the human condition above all. Very common - and often more pronounced online than when talking face to face.

Among the HS community I'm in we are discussing her fate as well - and of course people are more sensitive there (naturally).

Some pointed out that now, after her death, people are indeed interested in her problem - but when she was alive, no-one was.

Which reminded me of the old argument always to hear from older German citizens, that within the 30s and the 40s of the last century, "no-one know anything".

Of course they did ! - But they had chosen to ignore the signals, they had chosen to look away. Not to be bothered. To remain and live without any troubles.

People rather look away, it seems, when other members of the same society are in troubles. "But it could hit me as well !" - They say. They rather decide to duck and cover, not to be seen. Not becoming the target of the troublemaker, not becoming a victim themselves.

It's like a scapegoat : They sacrifice ONE for the benefit of ALL (as can be read in the Drama "The visit of the old woman" by Max Frisch) - and in this case they probably unconsciously decided to sacrifice Amanda Todd because they didn't want to be the target themselves.

And the other thing that bothers me is the "for the lulz" thing. They probably even made fun out of her, just "for the lulz". Because, they probably said, she was a fool. And fools … re an easy prey for the hunters. For those who like to bully the weaker ones themselves.

Bully the weaker ones as a means to elevate your own position in society - into that of a bully. Harass the weaker one to become feared. It is ALWAYS easier to bully the weaker one. It's like vultures feeding themselves from an injured, but not yet dead animal.

Well put, Alrik.

pibbur who is not angry anymore

An imho not unrelated Gamasutra article : http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1…p#.UIaQ2GJXxI4

Originally Posted by Firestorm
This may sound very cold but I really couldn't care less, people kill them self all the time and cyber bullying is just one of many many reasons the do it.

….

I know there are probably some people that feel strongly about this and this isn't meant to troll anyone, I just can't feel bad for anyone living in today's western world with all the freedoms that entail and then commit suicide.

Were we discussing an adult, I might agree with you. But we aren't. We are talking about a child who was manipulated by an adult. That is a VERY different matter.

Somewhat to the subject in Finland two immigrant boys raped underage girl in woods. Later they bragged about it to their friends. Their friends created a support group for the rapists in the facebook. The facebook support page was filled with immigrants calling the raped girl "whore lier" and asking her facebook name so they could get some sex too.



The two 15yo immigrant boys didnt get any jailtime but were fined for 10000 euros. The facebook support group was removed by officials and the raped girl is going through therapy. She must have a hard time going back to school after all this.

I lol'd hard when I read "cyber-harassment". Dafuq? This is the internet, how can someone be harassed here? Don't like it? Just turn off the PC or visit some other site or play another game. This news is bs.

Originally Posted by Alrik Fassbauer
Among the HS community I'm in we are discussing her fate as well - and of course people are more sensitive there (naturally).

Some pointed out that now, after her death, people are indeed interested in her problem - but when she was alive, no-one was.

Which reminded me of the old argument always to hear from older German citizens, that within the 30s and the 40s of the last century, "no-one know anything".

Of course they did ! - But they had chosen to ignore the signals, they had chosen to look away. Not to be bothered. To remain and live without any troubles.

People rather look away, it seems, when other members of the same society are in troubles. "But it could hit me as well !" - They say. They rather decide to duck and cover, not to be seen. Not becoming the target of the troublemaker, not becoming a victim themselves.

It's like a scapegoat : They sacrifice ONE for the benefit of ALL (as can be read in the Drama "The visit of the old woman" by Max Frisch) - and in this case they probably unconsciously decided to sacrifice Amanda Todd because they didn't want to be the target themselves.

And the other thing that bothers me is the "for the lulz" thing. They probably even made fun out of her, just "for the lulz". Because, they probably said, she was a fool. And fools … re an easy prey for the hunters. For those who like to bully the weaker ones themselves.

Bully the weaker ones as a means to elevate your own position in society - into that of a bully. Harass the weaker one to become feared. It is ALWAYS easier to bully the weaker one. It's like vultures feeding themselves from an injured, but not yet dead animal.

reminds me of this:

First they came for the socialists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me,
and there was no one left to speak for me.

Being ignorant and callous of the plight of others, no matter the privilege you may think they enjoy, is the road to ruin.

Originally Posted by zakhal
Somewhat to the subject in Finland two immigrant boys raped underage girl in woods. Later they bragged about it to their friends. Their friends created a support group for the rapists in the facebook. The facebook support page was filled with immigrants calling the raped girl "whore lier" and asking her facebook name so they could get some sex too.



The two 15yo immigrant boys didnt get any jailtime but were fined for 10000 euros. The facebook support group was removed by officials and the raped girl is going through therapy. She must have a hard time going back to school after all this.

Wow, no jail time? That's seriously wrong.

Wrong? Yeah, but it's enlightened so it must be a superior solution.

Originally Posted by bloodlover
I lol'd hard when I read "cyber-harassment". Dafuq? This is the internet, how can someone be harassed here? Don't like it? Just turn off the PC or visit some other site or play another game. This news is bs.

The internet is no excuse for misbehaving.

pibbur

The laws in the Nordic countries for these kind of things is a joke. They need to be changed ASAP.

Originally Posted by bloodlover
I lol'd hard when I read "cyber-harassment". Dafuq? This is the internet, how can someone be harassed here? Don't like it? Just turn off the PC or visit some other site or play another game. This news is bs.

You did actually read the article right? This girl was verbally & physically assaulted. Also, kids and the methods they use to interface with one another (including social media) is very different than it once was. When I was that age only dorks played around on the internet. Now you are a complete weirdo if you don't. I've heard a woman say that they wouldn't date a guy because he didn't have facebook. She was afraid of what he might be hiding….

Originally Posted by GothicGothicness
The laws in the Nordic countries for these kind of things is a joke. They need to be changed ASAP.

Careful challenging the nordic model. Some take is as a sure sign of your ignorant nationalistic ways.

GG is a Swede, if I am not mistaken?

Seriously, tho—with all the fuzzy foo-foo feel good nonsense we feed kids these days, they never really develop the mechanisms to deal with bullies. Kids get so used to having their self-worth spooned to them that they never get a chance to build it internally. This ivory tower psychologist "everybody's a winner" bullshit has made the kids overly reliant on empty outside approval, which makes bullying more of a problem than it ever was back in the day.

Originally Posted by Thrasher
GG is a Swede, if I am not mistaken?

Indeed. Must be a subversive element.

Originally Posted by CrazyIrish
You did actually read the article right? This girl was verbally & physically assaulted. Also, kids and the methods they use to interface with one another (including social media) is very different than it once was. When I was that age only dorks played around on the internet. Now you are a complete weirdo if you don't. I've heard a woman say that they wouldn't date a guy because he didn't have facebook. She was afraid of what he might be hiding….

I think if I were in the hunt these days I'd be more wary of someone that DOES have a facebook account, lol.


-Carn

Originally Posted by dteowner
Seriously, tho—with all the fuzzy foo-foo feel good nonsense we feed kids these days, they never really develop the mechanisms to deal with bullies. Kids get so used to having their self-worth spooned to them that they never get a chance to build it internally. This ivory tower psychologist "everybody's a winner" bullshit has made the kids overly reliant on empty outside approval, which makes bullying more of a problem than it ever was back in the day.

Yeah, I agree with that, but have zero experience as a parent, and only as an observer with friends and family, very little active participation in rearing.

To be honest, that observation might be easier for non-parents to make since they can be detached about it. Iz a little tougher to stick with the "who cares what that punk thinks" mantra (or the "well, you pretty well sucked rocks on that test/competition/whatever, so what can you change to be better next time" honest appraisal) when it's your kid crying.