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November 21st, 2012, 15:07
I think this game has a lot of potential players, people who like the ES games/ES universe. So depending on the quality (in the eyes of said group of players), I think it can take a very long time before it goes F2P.

OTOH, other presumed Wow killers like for instance SWTOR turned out to be failures and -> F2P.

pibbur who looks forward to ESO.

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November 21st, 2012, 15:43
Originally Posted by pibbur who View Post
I think this game has a lot of potential players, people who like the ES games/ES universe. So depending on the quality (in the eyes of said group of players), I think it can take a very long time before it goes F2P.
pibbur who make me laugh. Ahahahaha.

All Elder Scrolls games were buy once (+DLCs/expac) and play forever. People coming from those games will not like having to pay a monthly fee to do what they have been doing for 10+ years already and see the rest of Tamriel. This would vastly reduce the potential group of players for the game I think.

Anyhow, the way the marketing have been acting, it's like they used to work for BioWare Austin. I don't see this as a good sign…

I don't expect much from ESO in term of being a "good game". I just want to go back to Daggerfall.
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November 21st, 2012, 16:05
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post

All Elder Scrolls games were buy once (+DLCs/expac) and play forever. People coming from those games will not like having to pay a monthly fee to do what they have been doing for 10+ years already and see the rest of Tamriel. This would vastly reduce the potential group of players for the game I think.
….
I'm not so sure about that. Playing with others adds something, and one of the major repeating questions on ES forums have been: "Why no multiplayer?". I don't have problem with paying a monthly fee, and I suspect there are one or two others like me.

But we'll see.

pibbur who has played several MMO's with or without monthly fees. And who has been wrong on a few occasions. He remembers once in 1974.

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November 21st, 2012, 16:30
Originally Posted by pibbur who View Post
I'm not so sure about that. Playing with others adds something, and one of the major repeating questions on ES forums have been: "Why no multiplayer?".
And once they learned about ESO they all said "We only wanted a co-op mode".

I've seen that everywhere since searching in-existing information about ESO.
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November 21st, 2012, 17:34
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
All Elder Scrolls games were buy once (+DLCs/expac) and play forever. People coming from those games will not like having to pay a monthly fee to do what they have been doing for 10+ years already and see the rest of Tamriel.
That tells that this game is not expected to add interactions, compared to SP games.

Maybe, maybe, this game will add interactions and players might be able to do some things they have been dreaming of doing for 10 + years more.
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November 21st, 2012, 17:50
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "no expected to add interactions" ChienAboyeur?

Some single players of the Elder Scrolls wanted a co-op mode for their $60 games, they didn't ask to for a multiplayer mode that will cost $15/month.
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November 21st, 2012, 18:38
You're not paying $15/month for multiplayer. You're paying for a service that includes ongoing development and content upgrades.

Whether that's worth it or not is entirely up to the individual.

Personally, I think there's a huge difference between the average MMO and a cooperative "singleplayer" game. But if I'm having fun playing and getting content updates - I think 15$ pr. month is extremely cheap entertainment.

However, if I'm not playing more than a few hours every now and again - it's much less of a good deal.

There's no way to objectively claim that it's a good or a bad deal.
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November 21st, 2012, 18:47
@dart: I agree completely.

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November 21st, 2012, 19:17
One day pib must get tired of agreeing with me
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November 21st, 2012, 19:22
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
You're not paying $15/month for multiplayer. You're paying for a service that includes ongoing development and content upgrades.

Whether that's worth it or not is entirely up to the individual.

Personally, I think there's a huge difference between the average MMO and a cooperative "singleplayer" game. But if I'm having fun playing and getting content updates - I think 15$ pr. month is extremely cheap entertainment.

However, if I'm not playing more than a few hours every now and again - it's much less of a good deal.

There's no way to objectively claim that it's a good or a bad deal.
It might be something of a psychological aversion for many of us who have never in our lives considered paying a monthly fee for any game.

On the other hand, if it was a game I really enjoyed, let's say the next TES single player title, I wouldn't have too much trouble buying a $60 game and five $20 expansions, which is almost as much as $15/month if those were all purchased over the course of one year. In the case of Skyrim, however, one $60 purchase has already provided over 2,000 hours of entertainment, including all the time I've racked up making mods in the Creation Kit (which is a lot of fun and more than the time I've spent playing the actual game).

I just can't imagine ever paying any kind of subscription fee for a game, spending money whether I play it or not. I might be persuaded to pay a monthly subscription fee for some sort of cloud gaming service like Netflix, where you have access to hundreds of games rendered by a remote server, but not for a single game.
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November 21st, 2012, 19:28
Yeah, I usually don't play games that long so why subscribe? I've got too many SP games in my backlog. Of course elder scroll games would be the exception.
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November 21st, 2012, 19:38
Originally Posted by CountChocula View Post
It might be something of a psychological aversion for many of us who have never in our lives considered paying a monthly fee for any game.
Yes, and I understand. It's an uncomfortable commitment in some ways.

On the other hand, if it was a game I really enjoyed, let's say the next TES single player title, I wouldn't have too much trouble buying a $60 game and five $20 expansions, which is almost as much as $15/month if those were all purchased over the course of one year. In the case of Skyrim, however, one $60 purchase has already provided over 2,000 hours of entertainment, including all the time I've racked up making mods in the Creation Kit (which is a lot of fun and more than the time I've spent playing the actual game).
Yes - and let's not forget that in terms of hours of entertainment pr. dollar - TES games are in the EXTREME minority for being so generous. Most people around here pay 60$ for much, much less.

I just can't imagine ever paying any kind of subscription fee for a game, spending money whether I play it or not. I might be persuaded to pay a monthly subscription fee for some sort of cloud gaming service like Netflix, where you have access to hundreds of games rendered by a remote server, but not for a single game.
To me, it's not about the amount of games or the amount of movies. It's about the quality of the time I spend doing something. I'd rather pay 15$ each month for a game I loved playing - than I'd spend 5$ each month for average movies I watched because I really didn't have anything better to do.

That said, I have no principled aversions. I look at things separately and according to very pragmatic circumstances.
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November 21st, 2012, 20:39
Since it's TES, I'll probably give it a one month shot, to see if it captures my interest. I'm not sure if a non-Bethesda Softworks TES is going to be as fun. I sure enjoyed the non-Bethesda Fallout, but that was single player.
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November 21st, 2012, 20:48
Originally Posted by crpgnut View Post
I'm not sure if a non-Bethesda Softworks TES is going to be as fun.
It might be better? Although, I expect it to feel different.
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November 21st, 2012, 22:01
I have no doubts that the game is going to be great, simply because it's an Elder Scrolls game. How can they mess up an Elder Scrolls game? I assume that they know what makes Elder Scrolls games great, and they took some of those ideas mixed in with some new, innovative ideas and voila, Elder Scrolls Online.

I mean so far it looks amazing. Just hoping it eventually sees a console release.
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November 21st, 2012, 23:30
Originally Posted by Fluent View Post
How can they mess up an Elder Scrolls game?
What about XP to level up?
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November 22nd, 2012, 00:21
I wouldn't consider using XP to level up a bad thing in an Elder Scrolls game. Experience points or no experience points, either way would be fine with me.

So far they are saying the right things about the game. It's going to be heavy on the exploration, you're going to be able to go where you want, do what you want, get sidetracked by a million and one different things, customize your character like you would expect in an Elder Scrolls game, etc.

From what I've seen so far about the game, it's sounding extremely promising. And I'm speaking as an Elder Scrolls fan, not so much a fan of MMOs (although I've played them in the past).
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November 22nd, 2012, 04:45
The problem with saying the right things is it requires nothing more than knowing your audience. Actually doing the right things is much more difficult.
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November 22nd, 2012, 09:18
Originally Posted by azarhal View Post
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "no expected to add interactions" ChienAboyeur?

Some single players of the Elder Scrolls wanted a co-op mode for their $60 games, they didn't ask to for a multiplayer mode that will cost $15/month.
Maybe I am wrong on this but I dont see this game breaking one major limitation of MMO (the fact that players invest time on such a different basis it is hard to get them play together)

It follows that a big dimension of this game shall be about being played as a SP game.

Now the question is to know whether this game will use the opportunity of having human players to fill some gaps that have proven hard to fill in the classical SP TES series due to AI limitations (actions of the game world on the player, required space to allow such effects as hunger, thirst…)

It might be in the end that this game will be an extended version of the TES SP classical series, adding features that could not be added due to limitations hard to bypass in a entirely SP environment.

If so, that will drag a lot of players of the classical series to this game as the latter offers what could be expected of the SP series but was never delivered.
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November 22nd, 2012, 13:42
Don't expect hunger or thirst in ESO, it's a Theme Park game. Actually there will be no housing when the game launch or Thieves or Assassin guilds content either. Funny enough ESO is supposed to have AI for their NPCs. I'll believe it when I see it…

The game will be heavily instanced as well. Well, more like phasing + instances. So yeah, an(other) online Single Player game. They also said that the game started at level 50, which should be a BIG indication that it's just another WoW clone with another skin where max content is where the fun is at…

If the MMORPG of the 90s started only at max level when it took you between 6 and 1 years to reach it, they never would have been a success.
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