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Default I love a story with a happy ending.

July 18th, 2013, 13:01
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
If we can prove without a shred of doubt that the intention to bring harm was there - then MAYBE it makes sense to assign blame and punish. If we can't establish that - then this isn't about the people involved, but about our own inability to accept that shit happened and there's no reaction that will make it all better.
I also think part of it is the desire to see if we can learn something about why this confluence of events might have happened so we can mitigate them in the future.

— Mike
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July 18th, 2013, 13:05
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
I also think part of it is the desire to see if we can learn something about why this confluence of events might have happened so we can mitigate them in the future.
One would hope so, but it seems to me that most people are busy condemning someone before they get busy establishing what actually happened with any amount of certainty.

If you start out establishing something that's not actually real - and rather some fantasy scenario that your brain can get a hold of - then you're not learning. You're actually doing worse than not learning, as you're creating a perception that's not based in reality.

That's something I consider extremely harmful - and it will only serve to perpetuate a fantasy until such time as unreality becomes your world.
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July 18th, 2013, 14:28
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
What I was saying was:
- The initial 'profiling' marked Martin as suspicious based on a racist presumption.
You state this as fact when the reality is that you're making assumptions based on your own personal bias. You have absolutely no clue why Martin was "marked". Please stop.
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
It is also interesting that gun deaths have increased significantly in states with 'stand your ground' laws (even if that law wasn't part of the circumstances) even as the rates drop in every other state. More guns, more 'gun friendly laws' = more death.
Indeed, when law-abiding citizens are given the tools and legal standing to fight back, more criminals get shot. More death, indeed. Are we supposed to be surprised by that stat?

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July 18th, 2013, 14:41
Originally Posted by Omega View Post
But with the 'Stand your ground' law it does not always come to that. Now people (can) get away with murder. I would not be surprised if some people would carefully study the demands of the 'Stand your ground' in advance before deciding how to kill a certain person.
You can put your tinfoil hat back in the closet. That advanced planning has been possible for decades- the saying about making sure you drag the body into your house has been around for years and years.

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July 18th, 2013, 14:46
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
As someone who doesn't believe in the reality and omnipresence of racism you have the 'wrongness' market sewn up.

But such is the way of the white privilege, talk radio fed modern tea party racist probably also go around saying you should be able to use the N word, that reverse racism is a thing, and wondering when it will be WHITE history month.

Oh well.
Boy, Mike, that was uncharacteristically asshole-ish, and rather ignorant to boot. What's up?

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July 18th, 2013, 14:50
Originally Posted by ManWhoJaped View Post
Everyone reasonable gave up on evil nazis when they saw the pics of the bloody head, big surprise though that didn't slow down some people in the least. Also didn't stop the prosecutors from trying to railroad someone they knew damn well was innocent, for their own political gain. Even all the prominent jewish civil rights lawyers are with zimmerman on this one but then they might be biased.
Actually, the real prosecutors declined to press charges. They freighted in a special prosecutor to force the issue shortly after Obama pulled his "Trayvon Martin could be my son" racial baiting.

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July 18th, 2013, 14:54
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
One would hope so, but it seems to me that most people are busy condemning someone before they get busy establishing what actually happened with any amount of certainty.

If you start out establishing something that's not actually real - and rather some fantasy scenario that your brain can get a hold of - then you're not learning. You're actually doing worse than not learning, as you're creating a perception that's not based in reality.

That's something I consider extremely harmful - and it will only serve to perpetuate a fantasy until such time as unreality becomes your world.
For once, your foo-foo utopian hooey is right on the mark.

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July 18th, 2013, 15:43
What a sad state of affairs - Dart talking reason. See what you guys have done?!
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July 18th, 2013, 18:34
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
I also think part of it is the desire to see if we can learn something about why this confluence of events might have happened so we can mitigate them in the future.
Or prevent them entirely. If Zimmerman didn't have a gun, it's doubtful anyone would have been killed.
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July 18th, 2013, 20:20
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Or prevent them entirely. If Zimmerman didn't have a gun, it's doubtful anyone would have been killed.
Yep. Zimmerman would be a vegetable from having his skull smashed in, but nobody would have been killed and sweet little 12-year-old Trayvon would still be wearing his little league shirt. Huzzah for us!

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July 18th, 2013, 20:37
Doubtful, as the usual strawmans you emit like a great flatulating gasbag.
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July 18th, 2013, 20:58
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Actually, the real prosecutors declined to press charges. They freighted in a special prosecutor to force the issue shortly after Obama pulled his "Trayvon Martin could be my son" racial baiting.
Wow, that's horrific. But good to see someone had some integrity.

I hate it when people like txa just go into the territory of making crap up, especially when they don't even know anything about the subject. Zimmerman is a real person, someone who's been through a lot and who I very strongly doubt wanted any of this to happen, or thought it would.
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July 18th, 2013, 21:11
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Doubtful, as the usual strawmans you emit like a great flatulating gasbag.
I don't think you understand the meaning of the word, but let's play anyway. So, you're saying that a largely baseless prediction of "altered events" is so much sulfur dioxide. Fair enough. How exactly is that different from your largely baseless prediction of "altered events"?

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July 18th, 2013, 21:23
Zimmerman had a fly on his nose and Martin was trying to get it off. He would have dusted him off and they'd have eaten some skittles together and laughed over their misunderstanding.
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July 18th, 2013, 21:24
Mine are based on realistic models on how the universe operates. I don't know the basis of your brain farts.
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July 18th, 2013, 21:46
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Mine are based on realistic models on how the universe operates, and has lots of unicorns
Fixed that for you.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:24
I am enjoying the information coming out about the trial and how both TM and GZ were really like. I really don't understand how people can continue to think GZ killed him for the hell of it with all the evidence out there. Unicorns indeed.
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July 19th, 2013, 18:01
Here's an article that quotes some interesting statistics. I'm sure it will probably piss some people off.

Black America's Real Problem Isn't White Racism
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July 19th, 2013, 18:34
People need to stop defending criminals. The vast majority of people of any race aren't criminals, but if you are sticking up for someone merely due to race then that makes you a racist. If you assume the guy of one race is innocent and the other guilty based on race, again you are a racist. And if you genuinely believe zimmerman is a racist murderer and martin an innocent schoolboy after looking at the pictures in this thread etc. then you live in a land of faeries and no one can help you.
Last edited by ManWhoJaped; July 19th, 2013 at 18:46.
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July 19th, 2013, 21:24
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Or prevent them entirely. If Martin hadn't attacked Zimmerman, it's doubtful anyone would have been killed.
Fixed for ya
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