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Default Richard Garriott - Most Game Designers Suck!

March 21st, 2013, 02:49
Originally Posted by Vindicator View Post
All hail Lord British, the court jester who would be king… a legend in his own mind.
Well, that’s not fair… after all, he is an astronaut. But at this point, it wouldn’t surprise me if Richard digs a moat around a patch of dirt and calls it Britannia, declares himself king and secedes from the United States.

Before we get too carried away with ripping Richard for his royal-sized ego, let’s remember, he’s not all that bad. Lord British used to open his castle to his fans during Halloween, spending a small fortune to turn it into a haunted house. If only he had that money now, he wouldn’t need this Kickstarter.
Which is strange huh, since you know he is funding a lot of the game himself. I guess it would be better if he founded it all on our money, I mean all the others are with the exception of a few.

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March 21st, 2013, 02:53
Originally Posted by Fantasm View Post
Before we all pile on, I think there is some truth in the underlying point that he expands upon:



In general, I really don't find a whole lot that I disagree with in this assessment…
I think his original post was harsh but I agree with what he expanded upon.
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March 21st, 2013, 03:01
He was a great game designer.
His games were some of the best of my youth.
Though I honestly feel he should just go away, this is getting way out of hand. It is a single person game, that you can play with your friends. It isn't a Multiplayer game unless, well now it is but if, well it is a single player game. Well it is a multiplayer, single player …well there is a story to it all…well here is some of the old team so it has to be good right…well now their is…but wait …
GIVE IT UP your 15 minutes was 30 years ago…you had a great run…
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March 21st, 2013, 03:06
Originally Posted by CelticFrost View Post
He was a great game designer.
His games were some of the best of my youth.
Though I honestly feel he should just go away, this is getting way out of hand. It is a single person game, that you can play with your friends. It isn't a Multiplayer game unless, well now it is but if, well it is a single player game. Well it is a multiplayer, single player …well there is a story to it all…well here is some of the old team so it has to be good right…well now their is…but wait …
GIVE IT UP your 15 minutes was 30 years ago…you had a great run…
Yeah you're right, he shouldn't try and make new game. We should keep getting clones of what is out there and hope something good comes a long….we don't need more rpgs. With what you have written you really haven't followed what has been said so far, and if you really want to you can go to their site or the kickstarter itself.

I have included the websites for the kickstarter as well as their own site so you can do the research if you would like:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/…aken-virtues-0

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/

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March 21st, 2013, 03:19
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
Yeah you're right, he shouldn't try and make new game. We should keep getting clones of what is out there and hope something good comes a long….we don't need more rpgs. With what you have written you really haven't followed what has been said so far, and if you really want to you can go to their site or the kickstarter itself.

I have included the websites for the kickstarter as well as their own site so you can do the research if you would like:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/…aken-virtues-0

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/
You can read it the way you want and I will see it for what it is. There is no direction to this project as there is to many directions to this project that seem to change daily.
I started playing Ultima games in 1984 and would have loved nothing more to see that LB could reclaim some of what he meant to the gaming world. But ….well that would be enough on that subject.
As for you not thinking there have been some great games since origin systems well I feel sorry for you if all your hopes are with this game.
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March 21st, 2013, 03:23
I never said there haven't been some great games. I also like to do research before making claims, which you don't seem too.

I will be quite happy if he manages to make a great game and things work out for him, I will also be disappointed if it doesn't succeed. I'm not sure I'm willing to call any game a failure at this early in it's life. I'm not sure why so many are.

EDIT: To be fair, I am fairly passionate about this one, so I may come across as a bit over the top at times, and I apologize for that.

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March 21st, 2013, 03:44
I agree with some of his points. It often takes a different mentality or perspective to design a game, rather than code or make assets such as graphics and music.

I still remember the Origin catchphrase "We create worlds" and there haven't been many since that actually can create living worlds and not just a backdrop for the game.
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March 21st, 2013, 03:46
Err… so what? It's not like he's a theoretical physicist. There's no Nobel prize for game design.
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March 21st, 2013, 06:04
Well, he told PC Gamer at the time that he exaggerated it in order to give them a 'zinger.' So he WAS going for the soundbite.

While most of his other points I more-or-less agree with, I thought he went overboard on this, and lost a bit of respect for the guy. I mean - there's a lot of people (including right here, obviously) who wonder if his best work is behind him. Quite a ways behind him.

I don't want to believe that, and I think he really is a very smart (and yes, hard-working) game designer who's willing to push the envelope, and I am cool with that. But… man, the guy's kinda setting himself up like George Lucas right before that "Episode 1" thing, isn't he?
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March 21st, 2013, 06:16
Hmm, well controversy is the best publicity eh?

His statements throughout the article have some truth to them and they are good points. A little more tact could have been called for. Though obviously PC Gamer wants a lot of hits so they focus on the zingers.
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March 21st, 2013, 07:37
Maybe I should be more controversial…
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March 21st, 2013, 08:13
How about: RC says NO to EA!!

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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March 21st, 2013, 08:18
Nothing good has ever come from being eaten by EA.

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March 21st, 2013, 08:31
Some high level trolling there.

"most game designers suck… except Peter Molyneux."

"In Grimwhoah, you can ride on turtles."
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March 21st, 2013, 08:46
Garriott just comes across as being extremely pompous.

Let's hope his game lives up to his ideals.
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March 21st, 2013, 09:19
Originally Posted by Xian View Post
I still remember the Origin catchphrase "We create worlds" and there haven't been many since that actually can create living worlds and not just a backdrop for the game.
In multiplayer games the world is defined much by the players themselves. At best it can be a backdrop and nothing more.

If garriot wants to create worlds he is wasting his time with multiplayer games. The players will just kill him like they did in ultima online if he tries that.

This new game seems confusing. Its seems like he doesnt know what he wants to do so he is offering something for everyone.

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March 21st, 2013, 10:09
He actually makes some good points if one just… you know bother reading the piece. But hey I guess its better to make sensationalistic headlines even here right?

(Which is probablh why he shouldnt have phrased it like this but whatever)

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March 21st, 2013, 10:19
I think reading the whole article that he does make some good points and didn't really intend to condemn the whole games industry other than himself. Certainly there are many uninspired designs out there.

With respect to SOTA, I think that RG is really trying to make a game where the multiplayer elements don't detract from the kind of gameplay that single player games offer (i.e. decisions, changing world, personalised story). I think in that respect they should perhaps have emphasized the single player elements first and then shown how some multiplayer elements might add to that experience. Now it's hard to get the point across. And I'm not yet convinced that the multiplayer ideas really are likely to add anything to a deep strategic/story based RPG.
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March 21st, 2013, 10:41
Much ado about nothing. He's right - most game designers shouldn't be game designers. Then again, I doubt they're there to be game designers as much as to follow the company line.

That's for the big companies, though.

As for Garriott himself, he USED to be a good game designer. Certainly a highly innovating guy back in the day. But today? He's going to have to prove that one - because ancient history only takes you so far.

I think there are some strong designers in the smaller spaces - especially in the middle-market area. The smaller the company, the more intimate the vision can be - and I've always believed that a strong vision is the key to a strong design. If you're not obligated to make huge returns - you're less restricted in how you bring your game about.

The middle-market and potentially the Kickstarter segment is the place to be for a designer with ambitions - because you can get enough funding to do something that's not tiny and exclusively personal. I think that's where the most hungry and talented people will be.

Being a designer for a major AAA project is more like being a puppet - and I suspect the best puppets are in place at the biggest companies for the most important projects.

Even for supposedly "arty" games like Bioshock - Levine chose to please the investors before the core players. He's fine with making all the artistic sacrifices for the business - and many would call him a great developer because of that. But in terms of actual game design and pure gameplay - Bioshock is not very impressive. I guess that kind of game can impress because of the premise and the production values - but I don't think much of Levine as a game designer.

The most impressive AAA titles in terms of game design - in recent times - have been games like Witcher 2 and Deus Ex: HR. Skyrim was a fantastic game - but I don't think the game design is very strong - even if it IS the best TES design.
Last edited by DArtagnan; March 21st, 2013 at 11:20.
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March 21st, 2013, 11:40
Well, he is certainly cocky… but none can deny he made the best games, so he has the rights to be just that.

On the other hand it appears like he is not nearly as good a game designer as he was before.
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