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Default The Batman Arkham Asylum Debate or something like that

July 19th, 2013, 13:53
Hehe… Well ok

Anyway - I hope it's clear that I wasn't too impressed with Arkham Asylum - so I have no reason to defend it.

But one thing I think worked really well in the game was the UI. It's very attractive, it's very clean and efficient. It's NOT intrusive at all.

Yes, the game has pop-ups for certain combos at certain times - and they were VERY helpful, because it's a game that's very much about timing.

The game gets VERY frantic when you have 10-12 dudes attacking you - and I certainly needed those indicators to help me out.

Am I a console dumb kiddie?

Sure, whatever you say.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:02
I thought batman aa was a very good game. After a while of playing I didn't even notice the pop ups. I don't like controllers and thought the game was easily playable with m&k.

The end boss was pretty typical I thought with the "kill" him 3 time before you win formula. The most annoying part of the game IMO would be the scarecrow levels. They just felt out of place, like the were from a whole different game almost, gameplay wise.

Only a few hours in to batman ac. It does feel more open world with tons of stuff to find. Not a big fan of being forced to play different characters but at least there fun. I would like the option to choose though.

I think the best thing about both games is the production values. Everything is just very well done. The characters and voice acting are top notch, I really feel like I'm in a batman movie. I also thought the gameplay was excellent, I really like the melee combat system it has a certain amount of complexity but it easy to pick up and learn while taking some time to master.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:05
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I knew what to do because I wanted to play the game.

I never "preferred" looking in option menus for keys after having forgotten them.

I don't consider remembering whatever key to press for a specific function a "skill" of mine.

I don't like unnecessary icons cluttering the screen - just like you don't.

But I consider the grapple icon VITAL - and as such, is NOT unnecessary clutter.

The fact that the button to press is part of that icon is something I consider so trivially unimportant that I lack the words.
I'm actually impressed by how much you just wrote without really addressing my question.

Anyways, I could mention other icons in the game that aren't as defensible, but I think it's obvious where we both stand here.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:09
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I'm actually impressed by how much you just wrote without really addressing my question.
Here I was thinking I addressed everything you said.

But, as is common with our debates - they're about the most trivial of crap.

I think we can agree it's useless to go on about this.

Anyways, I could mention other icons in the game that aren't as defensible, but I think it's obvious where we both stand here.
Quite so.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:10
Aww man… I was hoping you'd take the extra bait.

Can a moderator please snip this discussion starting at #5528 to this post and move it to the non-RPG forum.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:10
By the way - I'm also playing a bit of Civilization 5 BNW at the moment.

Best Civ I've played since Civ 2 and Call to Power!
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July 19th, 2013, 14:11
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
Am I a console dumb kiddie?

Sure, whatever you say.
I think we have ALL (well, most) adapted in the last decade since 'consolitis' became a thing for real with Deus Ex: Invisible War in particular. We have lamented and thrashed .. and yet adapted. I still grumble at how much has been lost in shooters (um, lean, for example) … yet I find plenty of fun in 'ultra-streamlined' iPad gaming … so yeah, exactly.

— Mike
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July 19th, 2013, 14:12
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Aww man… I was hoping you'd take the extra bait.
I'm afraid you hit the low point with this critique - based on a short time with a demo.

I swear, sometimes I have to double-check and see if you're not actually Thrasher
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July 19th, 2013, 14:15
Originally Posted by txa1265 View Post
I think we have ALL (well, most) adapted in the last decade since 'consolitis' became a thing for real with Deus Ex: Invisible War in particular. We have lamented and thrashed .. and yet adapted. I still grumble at how much has been lost in shooters (um, lean, for example) … yet I find plenty of fun in 'ultra-streamlined' iPad gaming … so yeah, exactly.
I've adapted for sure.

But I think I'm quite aware of when I'm playing a game with a lot of compromise and when I'm not.

It's for sure that Arkham Asylum is a typical console game in many ways - but I like to focus on specifics. In terms of the icon in question - I just don't recognise the issue.

But - overall - the game is not very remarkable, so I can't get too worked up about the whole thing.

I went in not expecting much - and I went out not having gotten much.

It's ok.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:16
Originally Posted by DArtagnan View Post
I'm afraid you hit the low point with this critique - based on a short time with a demo.

I swear, sometimes I have to double-check and see if you're not actually Thrasher
Considering how many times I've see you try to argue about games you've barely played… I find that quite ironic.

Besides, I fail to see how that would matter unless we're talking about something that changes later in the game.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:20
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Considering how many times I've see you try to argue about games you've barely played… I find that quite ironic.
I guess that means you understand why I do that

Besides, I fail to see how that would matter unless we're talking about something that changes later in the game.
Well, it's a psychological thing.

Sometimes - as a human being - you adjust as you're exposed to something for a significant amount of time.

You might even come to appreciate something you started out not liking.

That said, I'm definitely a bit like you in how I'm too quick to judge games.

It's a combination of being headstrong and having a LOT of experience with games in general.

Not quite convinced you're capable of admitting you're wrong to the same extent as I - but to be fair, you're not nearly as bad as Thrasher.

I've actually seen you acknowledge a mistake or two - just not to me

Don't think Thrasher has ever done that around here.

It's all part of the fun, though, so no worries!
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July 19th, 2013, 14:26
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I realize that's nitpicking though, and I'd probably get used to it pretty quickly if I actually played the game. I'm not a huge Batman fan, but I've seen too many people rave about these games for me to not at least try them.
I wrote that back in the 2nd post of this discussion. Sometimes you don't see things when you don't want to.

Oh.. and don't get me started about the crosshairs in modern games.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:30
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
I wrote that back in the 2nd post of this discussion. Sometimes you don't see things when you don't want to.
Yes, I did notice that.

But that was before you explained what you meant by "too many icons" - which doesn't really seem to be what you really meant.

I also noticed how you completely forgot about it when your fickle views were challenged.

Suddenly, you knew exactly what was wrong - and suddenly it was a big deal about being retarded and not a UI with too many icons - as you acknowledged the icon IS necessary - as long as the button doesn't appear on top of it.

Inconsistent at best

But if you understand how trivial a complaint it is - REALLY - then I'm glad
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July 19th, 2013, 14:36
No, too many icons is exactly what I meant. I'm not sure why you would try to claim something changed when nothing did.

It still hasn't. The game definitely has far too many icons for some, and as you can see, I'm not the only person who thinks that.

But I can see it's trivial to you which is fine. You have your opinion and others disagree.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:37
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
No, too many icons is exactly what I meant. I'm not sure why you would try to claim anything changed when nothing did.

It still hasn't. The game definitely has far too many icons for some, and I'm evidently not the only person who thinks that.

But I can see it's trivial to you which is fine. You have your opinion and others disagree.
Sure, whatever you say. Nothing changed

FAR too many icons on the UI!!!!

WE'RE NOT RETARDED!
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July 19th, 2013, 14:40
Now who's acting like Thrasher?

Perhaps you could explain what changed then? Since you're so convinced that I wasn't being consistent, I'd be eager to hear why.

Let me guess.. Too many icons and "unnecessary" icons are completely different things, right?

Or you could just admit that's not really the case.

*Edit* Actually, you're not acting like Thrasher, you're just being yourself.
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July 19th, 2013, 14:51
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Now who's acting like Thrasher?

Perhaps you could explain what changed then? Since you're so convinced that I wasn't being consistent, I'd be eager to hear why.
Actually, I was acting like you

IIRC, you "whatevered" me not long ago.

I already explained what changed.

It seems to me it's not the AMOUNT of icons you have a problem with, but rather being told what button to press for grappling. You said the indicator is necessary, right?

If your entire complaint is not actually your real problem with the game - then perhaps you can enlighten me? Because I sure missed it.

What are all these icons you're talking about?

Menigal and I - who actually played the real game - both think the UI is pretty clean.

Txa seems to agree with you that button indication is too much - but I don't remember him saying it has too many icons.

So what icons are you talking about - and where do they appear?

Oh, and yes - I'm being myself. That's why it's called acting
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July 19th, 2013, 14:54
Ohh… Low even for you.

You're going to use the "the button indicator is a separate icon" bullshit, right?

Hehe, ok.

Fair enough.

Anyway, I'm off from work - and I'd just as soon not waste anymore time with this.

Have fun!
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July 19th, 2013, 14:54
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Let me guess.. Too many icons and "unnecessary" icons are completely different things, right?
Looks like I hit the nail on the head with that prediction.

It's kind of funny to see you get so frustrated though. Especially after you had recently commented on being able to admit when you're wrong. Wouldn't that have just been easier?

Oh well…
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July 19th, 2013, 16:15
I'm sure imagining frustration is the kind of thing you need to keep going

Can't you just pretend I'm here while you manipulate your own flawed words until they make sense for the weak arguments you're making? I doubt you really need anyone to actually participate - since you're obviously not worried about making sense to other people.

I can pop back in once in a while pointing out your mistakes - and you can manipulate that into being frustrated if you really need to.

It would save some time and energy - anyway.

"UI has too many icons" = "I don't like the button indicator on the grapple icon" = "Two separate icons"

Haha, that's Thrasher desperately trying to defend another illogical and inconsistent claim right there!
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