|
Your continuous donations keep RPGWatch running!
RPGWatch Forums » General Forums » Politics & Religion » L.A. Times Bans Climate Deniers - When Will the Rest of the Media Follow Suit?

Default L.A. Times Bans Climate Deniers - When Will the Rest of the Media Follow Suit?

October 22nd, 2013, 14:45
Originally Posted by Hastar View Post
The planet will right itself in a few thousand years after humankind is gone. The Earth is not endangered humankind is and I am not sure that is a bad thing.
Well it's a bad thing for humankind and I'm not sure there is anything much else in the universe that is capable of making value judgements. Maybe the Rabbits in Australia will develop an intelligence equivalent to our own and judge humanity to have been a waste of space?
Roq is offline

Roq

Seeker
RPGWatch Donor

#21

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Somerset/London UK
Posts: 975

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 14:58
Climate change! The global religion people of all religious backgrounds can get behind! Everyone is being taught to get used to making sacrifices for the environment, same as they used to be taught to make for various Gods. 10% carbon tax, 10% tithe, same as it ever was.

Ban me for refuting climate change, kill me for saying God doesn't exist, jail me for saying the world isn't flat, same as it ever was.

Heck, I'm feeling playful tonight. Time to roll out some controversy!

You are a den of vipers! I intent to rout you out and by the eternal god i WILL rout you out. If the people only understood the rank injustice of our money and banking system there would be a revolution before the morning… It is to be regretted that the rich and powerful too often bend the acts of government to their selfish purposes. - andrew jackson

…Germany had no choice but to succumb to debt slavery to international lenders. Or so it seemed. Hitler and the National Socialists, who came to power in 1933, thwarted the international banking cartel by issuing their own money. In this they took their cue from Abraham Lincoln, who funded the American Civil War with government-issued paper money called "Greenbacks." Hitler began his national credit program by devising a plan of public works. Projects earmarked for funding included flood control, repair of public buildings and private residences, and construction of new buildings, roads, bridges, canals, and port facilities. The projected cost of the various programs was fixed at one billion units of the national currency. One billion non-inflationary bills of exchange, called Labor Treasury Certificates, were then issued against this cost. Millions of people were put to work on these projects, and the workers were paid with the Treasury Certificates. This government-issued money wasn't backed by gold, but it was backed by something of real value. It was essentially a receipt for labor and materials delivered to the government. Hitler said, "for every mark that was issued we required the equivalent of a mark's worth of work done or goods produced." The workers then spent the Certificates on other goods and services, creating more jobs for more people.

USA debt just hit $17,279,607,091,427

End Turn.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
Sentinel

#22

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 521

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:19
SirJames didn't join the crusade - he just went on a tirade
DArtagnan is offline

DArtagnan

DArtagnan's Avatar
Waste of potential

#23

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Denmark
Posts: 14,192

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:23
Those who cannot attack the thought instead attack the thinker

end turn.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
Sentinel

#24

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 521

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:24
Those who invent an attack for every response will create a war in a time of potential peace.
DArtagnan is offline

DArtagnan

DArtagnan's Avatar
Waste of potential

#25

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Denmark
Posts: 14,192

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:26
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
All scientific results ARE peer reviewed. If you knew anything about the process, then you would know that claims that are not supported by enough evidence are disputed.
Such confidence in a system that embraced a study that the author admitted was fraudulent crap…

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
Dallas Cowboys: *sigh* / / Detroit Red Wings: Took injuries to see them, but how about them youngsters!
dteowner is offline

dteowner

dteowner's Avatar
Shoegazer

#26

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 11,272

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:29
Those like these? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6yYiWqmeCM

You know why they're ready to attack Iran without USA? Because in Islam the application of interest on loans is illegal and that interest is an integral part of the control scheme they've employed since before you or I were born.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
Sentinel

#27

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 521

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 15:50
There's this saying about how history is written by the winners. It goes something like… "Those who control the present control the past and those who control the past control the future"

I think you'll find every country without a giant national debt is a rogue "terrorist" state…

lol such fun playing "devils advocate"…. It's funny how in the Garden of Eden it was the devil who wanted to give mankind knowledge and god wanted them to stay naive and oblivious.

edit: Gee, that sure was entertaining seeing you retreat like that, DArtagnan. Was kind of expecting a little more though. For someone with so many posts you sure got lost for words.
Last edited by SirJames; October 22nd, 2013 at 16:06.
SirJames is offline

SirJames

SirJames's Avatar
Sentinel

#28

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 521

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 18:59
Yeah, you got me really good
DArtagnan is offline

DArtagnan

DArtagnan's Avatar
Waste of potential

#29

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Denmark
Posts: 14,192

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 19:43
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Such confidence in a system that embraced a study that the author admitted was fraudulent crap…
Embraced, really DTE? It's fraudulent nature was finally revealed. It doesn't make the conclusion incorrect when only one of many datapoints that corroborates it is fraudulent. You're just speaking as a typical rightwing paranoid. A few bad eggs doesn't ruin a huge (and I mean huge) body of otherwise valid work.
Last edited by Thrasher; October 22nd, 2013 at 20:23.
Thrasher is online now

Thrasher

Thrasher's Avatar
Wheeee!
RPGWatch Donor

#30

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 9,939

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 20:17
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Embraced, really DTE? It's fraudulent nature was finally revealed. It doesn't make the conclusion incorrect when only one of many datapoints that corroborates it is fraudulent. You're just speaking as a typical rightwing paranoid. A few bad eggs doesn't ruin a huge (and I mean huge) of otherwise valid work.
Several years later, after repeatedly being used as a sledgehammer to silence and slander anyone that might express a dissenting view. Not exactly encouraging, nor as philosophically "pure" as you'd like to advertise.

The whole "deniers" slop is a strawman anyway. I don't think you'll find too many rational people saying that man isn't influencing the system negatively, but as I've said for years here now, I've yet to see properly reviewed studies that prove that we're really running the show. Mother Nature carries a pretty damn big stick as demonstrated by putting half the globe under a sheet of ice while man was still dragging his knuckles, and we don't understand half of what she does nor how she does it. We're can't reliably predict tomorrow's weather, but we think we understand global temperature dynamics over millennia (lacking reliable global data older than a handful of decades) sufficiently to prioritize the inputs? We don't even know the all inputs! State with any certainty which ones are dominant? You must be joking. That…is bad science. That is a desired conclusion driving the science—the sort of situation that might lead to, say, some researcher shamming up half his data to make sure he gets the answer he wants. But that would never happen, right?

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
Dallas Cowboys: *sigh* / / Detroit Red Wings: Took injuries to see them, but how about them youngsters!
dteowner is offline

dteowner

dteowner's Avatar
Shoegazer

#31

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 11,272

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 20:30
Well I think we DO have a good handle on all the inputs. How they all interact in a chaotic system, is the tricky part. For example, a huge melt in the Greenland ice cap, could shut off the gulf stream and surprisingly put Europe into a deep freeze, while the rest of the planet on average warmed up.

I think a little prudence is in order. Try not to fuck with a system we are just beginning to understand. Climate change ramifications are already starting to take effect, like the coral reefs dying off. One of the most beautiful communities of life poised to disappear in a matter of only decades. How tragic is that?

And for what? Corporations that have politicians and pseudo-scientists in their pocket, all motivated by selfish greed… Egawds, a little prudence and a lot less greed would make the world a much better place.
Thrasher is online now

Thrasher

Thrasher's Avatar
Wheeee!
RPGWatch Donor

#32

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 9,939

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 21:11
Until someone can explain why we had an ice age, why it ended, and when the next one might be, we simply don't know the inputs of the system. Then, as you state, we're trying to predict a ridiculously complex system. We've got what's basically a black box and half the stuff going into that black box are coming out of another black box we can't even see.

I'm on board for a little prudence, but Jetboy Gore (I do love irony) and the enviro-nuts are ranting for some rather drastic changes. If it turns out we're the flea to Mother Nature's dog, that's a lot of misplaced effort. If we're bailing the Titanic with a teaspoon, then all that effort would be better applied to dealing with what's coming rather than futilely trying to change it.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
Dallas Cowboys: *sigh* / / Detroit Red Wings: Took injuries to see them, but how about them youngsters!
dteowner is offline

dteowner

dteowner's Avatar
Shoegazer

#33

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 11,272

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 21:22
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Interesting. A return to true journalism instead of sensationalism? Amazing.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/1…ia-Follow-Suit
While I am no 'climate denier', this is pretty much against all journalistic principles. Their job is to report the news, not to decide which news is 'right' (factually correct is a different matter). In the opinions page, the letters get more latitude, as they should. Its one thing to make sure both sides of a debate (regardless of the merits of either side) are presented, its another to decide which sides are presented.

Fuck the LA Time.

————————————————-

"Ya'll can go to HELL! I'm-a-goin' to TEXAS!"

- Davy Crockett
blatantninja is offline

blatantninja

blatantninja's Avatar
Resident Redneck Facist

#34

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NYC
Posts: 4,046

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 21:27
I'd rather the idiots who write in lies to the paper be fucked. But to each their own.
Thrasher is online now

Thrasher

Thrasher's Avatar
Wheeee!
RPGWatch Donor

#35

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 9,939

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 21:30
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Until someone can explain why we had an ice age, why it ended, and when the next one might be, we simply don't know the inputs of the system.
Actually we do. There is an orbital variation that corresponds fairly well with periodic ice ages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_age…itch_cycles.29
Thrasher is online now

Thrasher

Thrasher's Avatar
Wheeee!
RPGWatch Donor

#36

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 9,939

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 21:39
Originally Posted by blatantninja View Post
While I am no 'climate denier', this is pretty much against all journalistic principles. Their job is to report the news, not to decide which news is 'right' (factually correct is a different matter). In the opinions page, the letters get more latitude, as they should. Its one thing to make sure both sides of a debate (regardless of the merits of either side) are presented, its another to decide which sides are presented.
this
but as I tried to point out, times are tough for newspapers so IMO they are trying to appeal to a niche audience.

Those rich, right wingers the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints that owns the LA Times is sounding desperate to try and keep the paper viable.

Developer of The Wizard's Grave Android game. Discussion Thread:
http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22520
Lucky Day is offline

Lucky Day

Lucky Day's Avatar
Daywatch

#37

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: The Uncanny Valley
Posts: 3,188

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 22:10
Originally Posted by Thrasher View Post
Actually we do. There is an orbital variation that corresponds fairly well with periodic ice ages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_age…itch_cycles.29
Taken from your source:
The causes of ice ages are not fully understood for both the large-scale ice age periods and the smaller ebb and flow of glacial–interglacial periods within an ice age. The consensus is that several factors are important: atmospheric composition, such as the concentrations of carbon dioxide and methane (the specific levels of the previously mentioned gases are now able to be seen with the new ice core samples from EPICA Dome C in Antarctica over the past 800,000 years[41] ); changes in the Earth's orbit around the Sun known as Milankovitch cycles; the motion of tectonic plates resulting in changes in the relative location and amount of continental and oceanic crust on the Earth's surface, which affect wind and ocean currents; variations in solar output; the orbital dynamics of the Earth-Moon system; and the impact of relatively large meteorites, and volcanism including eruptions of supervolcanoes.
Of that list, we can only even influence one. But it's a forgone conclusion that we're the driving factor in global temperature. Gotcha.
A 2012 investigation finds that dinosaurs released methane through digestion in a similar amount to humanity's current methane release, which "could have been a key factor" to the very warm climate 150 million years ago.
Well now, how we gonna fix that one? GasX for everyone! Has Al Gore bought stock yet?

Similiarly, the Milankovich Cycle says that the Earth's orbit is driving the global temperature system. I thought we decided it was all the farting, but OK. So how is a carbon tax going to affect the Earth's orbit again?

Perhaps our excess CO2 has something to do with the 6+ billion generators running around? A number which has increased 20% in the last 2 decades and 300% over the last 6 decades? Coincidence, right? Now now, I've got it on good authority that man is the driving factor. Explain to me how green renewable energy is going to get all those folks to stop breathing.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
Dallas Cowboys: *sigh* / / Detroit Red Wings: Took injuries to see them, but how about them youngsters!
dteowner is offline

dteowner

dteowner's Avatar
Shoegazer

#38

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 11,272

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 22:30
You conveniently missed the key point.

The present ice age is the most studied and best understood, particularly the last 400,000 years, since this is the period covered by ice cores that record atmospheric composition and proxies for temperature and ice volume. Within this period, the match of glacial/interglacial frequencies to the Milanković orbital forcing periods is so close that orbital forcing is generally accepted.
But feel free to cherry pick factoids to support your own opinions, as is you want. It's no surprise that right wing propaganda trumps your ability to scientific reason. It is after all what they want to do to you.

More explanations of the effects for those who really want to understand the universe rather than simply poo poo anything that conflicts with their religion errrr politics.

The combined effects of the changing distance to the Sun, the precession of the Earth's axis, and the changing tilt of the Earth's axis redistribute the sunlight received by the Earth. Of particular importance are changes in the tilt of the Earth's axis, which affect the intensity of seasons. For example, the amount of solar influx in July at 65 degrees north latitude varies by as much as 22% (from 450 W/mē to 550 W/mē). It is widely believed that ice sheets advance when summers become too cool to melt all of the accumulated snowfall from the previous winter. Some workers believe that the strength of the orbital forcing is too small to trigger glaciations, but feedback mechanisms like CO2 may explain this mismatch.
Thrasher is online now

Thrasher

Thrasher's Avatar
Wheeee!
RPGWatch Donor

#39

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Studio City, CA
Posts: 9,939

Default 

October 22nd, 2013, 22:44
I don't believe I did. I'll accept your Cycles as undisputed fact, even though your source paints it a bit questionable. Explain to me again how burning fossil fuels, or not doing so, is going to change the earth's orbit and tilt.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
Dallas Cowboys: *sigh* / / Detroit Red Wings: Took injuries to see them, but how about them youngsters!
dteowner is offline

dteowner

dteowner's Avatar
Shoegazer

#40

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 11,272
RPGWatch Forums » General Forums » Politics & Religion » L.A. Times Bans Climate Deniers - When Will the Rest of the Media Follow Suit?
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:15.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright by RPGWatch