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Default RPGWatch Feature - Blade of Destiny HD Review

November 11th, 2013, 23:12
Originally Posted by Stingray View Post
Last time I remember mentioning Bethesda or any of their games, you were right there to white knight them, sporting similar levels of charm:

http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showt…t=21606&page=2

You managed to link to a discussion about the Fallout franchise, and one in which nobody seemed to agree with you. Way to look even less credible than you already did.

Carry on…
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November 11th, 2013, 23:15
Alright it seems time to step in with the usual warning. Please get back on topic if you want to talk about Bethesda take it to the forums.

From here on out warnings will be given if anyone fails to do so.

"Frankly Sir /Madam I don't give a damn about your opinion."- Couchpotato
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November 12th, 2013, 01:14
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
And to top it off arguing how bad skyrim is in a thread about a game that was so broken that it still isn't close to being right months later and to boot it's a copy of the original, seems incredibly stupid.
1. It is not a one to one copy of the game. The name remake makes people think it is simply same game with no differences, additions or advancements. Let us not forget today's tech is different and more versatile.

2. It is very playable, there are minor bugs left here and there only. As a follower of the official forums and playing the game…I could say it is very close to being right. In two weeks it will have even more drastic improvements.
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November 12th, 2013, 01:31
Originally Posted by rune_74 View Post
And to top it off arguing how bad skyrim is in a thread about a game that was so broken that it still isn't close to being right months later and to boot it's a copy of the original, seems incredibly stupid.
Actually if this was directed at me…if you bothered to read my post, I was defending Skyrim. Joxer compared its bugginess upon release to this game, which is utterly ludicrous. The only reason I even mentioned my distaste for Bethesda was to bolster the comparison, ie: I have no reason to say good things about Skyrim. Also, despite its numerous shortcomings, I have very little doubt it is 100X better than this game.
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November 12th, 2013, 08:24
Originally Posted by Stingray View Post
Actually if this was directed at me…if you bothered to read my post, I was defending Skyrim. Joxer compared its bugginess upon release to this game, which is utterly ludicrous. The only reason I even mentioned my distaste for Bethesda was to bolster the comparison, ie: I have no reason to say good things about Skyrim. Also, despite its numerous shortcomings, I have very little doubt it is 100X better than this game.
Then Angry Birds is old-school, hardcore, party-based RPG.
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November 12th, 2013, 09:01
Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
1. It is not a one to one copy of the game. The name remake makes people think it is simply same game with no differences, additions or advancements. Let us not forget today's tech is different and more versatile.
The main point is that all those things that would be positive about an actual finished version of the remake would be positive because they were so in the original. Except minor addons like some flavor events and better UI.
Those minor bonuses would make the remake a better game, yes. But most of the fun does not come from fluff like that, it comes from core gameplay. And the core gameplay remains practically unchanged from the original (or else it would not be a remake).

Also, I doubt too many people argue this remake could not ever be a good game. Maybe it will. But nothing in the world will make me support the developers that screwed up like that. Bringing it into a playable, finished state now is just the bare minimum (and maximum, actually) they need to do to hope for indemnification somewhere in the future. Maybe for the next game, if they make it much, much better there.
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November 12th, 2013, 12:11
Core mechanics and ideas come from the game yes, if the originals had a good part of those core mechanics and ideas in motion(sadly original could not fulfill what it promised). Rebuilding the whole world is not a minor addon and definitely there are/will be events which are not flavor but have significant impact on gameplay. And since you speak like that, I suppose you have no thorough knowledge on original games or the state of this particular game.

And nobody can make you support developers, but at least we can make unaffected people see the both sides of the issue. It is so easy to curse, derogate or devalue a game with shitstorms and incessant whining while donning nostalgia googles. The hard and right way is to be constructive and supportive to back an ideal instead saying "Ah maybe next time." Because there might be "no next time" and there are a good deal of people who wants there should be "next time". Hence supporting it.

For your information, the game was already playable for a few months if you look from "core" perspective…in that case it already exceeded your maximum.
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November 12th, 2013, 13:02
Originally Posted by TheSHEEEP View Post
The main point is that all those things that would be positive about an actual finished version of the remake would be positive because they were so in the original. Except minor addons like some flavor events and better UI.
Those minor bonuses would make the remake a better game, yes. But most of the fun does not come from fluff like that, it comes from core gameplay. And the core gameplay remains practically unchanged from the original (or else it would not be a remake).

Also, I doubt too many people argue this remake could not ever be a good game. Maybe it will. But nothing in the world will make me support the developers that screwed up like that. Bringing it into a playable, finished state now is just the bare minimum (and maximum, actually) they need to do to hope for indemnification somewhere in the future. Maybe for the next game, if they make it much, much better there.
What about the interface? Is it better than the original game? Does it have features the original game lacked because of its time? (things like automap, quest log, etc). This alone would be a good point for making a remake of an old game. Story, characters, dialog all can stay the same if the new game is more accessible. But don't know if that's the case in this particular example (I don't remember how it was in the original game and I haven't played the remake yet).
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November 12th, 2013, 15:26
Originally Posted by wolfing View Post
What about the interface? Is it better than the original game? Does it have features the original game lacked because of its time? (things like automap, quest log, etc). This alone would be a good point for making a remake of an old game. Story, characters, dialog all can stay the same if the new game is more accessible. But don't know if that's the case in this particular example (I don't remember how it was in the original game and I haven't played the remake yet).
It has automap, place markers such as shops, inns, taverns, points of interests(such as Hetman's House, Central Embassy, Imman Stadium etc etc), questlog and its user interface will get a good revamp too.

For example one thing existed in original Realms of Arkania is to see the world from the height of your leader character. Of course many people could not notice the difference because the original game environment was quite same everywhere. In the remake they implemented it and in our current gaming technology, camera manipulation it is quite more noticeable. There is definitely a large difference when your Dwarf is leading or your Warrior.

Main story, characters and dialogues are not different. But of course there are some improvements here and there. The game promises to fill the gameworld more then its predecessor. For example a user-contributed event features heroes participating in an important Imman game at Imman Stadium in Thorwal. (With skill checks and such) City encounters did not exist in original games, but they are in the remake to give more atmosphere to the gameworld. And dungeons are still the game's strongest point. Wouldn't you like to return Old Bailey to deal with robbers who bothers Master Dramosh? I personally enjoyed it quite, since the original bailey hallways were similar to each other, in remake you can simply look around and enjoy visuals.

Weather effects? Birds on the sky? Swaying banners? Water reflections? Dragon ships of Thorwalians at harbors? Optical light effects? Shop signs? They are all a plus to the remake. And seeing it getting better, I find it quite worthy to support.

Plus: You will find a very helpful and friendly community in the official forums who are ready to support you (let it be developer or the players) in any way they can. After all, many people are not aware of the game(originals) or its mechanics(it can be complex) and it can be frustrating. Or you found an annoying bug, maybe simply computer crashed? You will find quite swift assistance there.
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November 12th, 2013, 16:28
Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
Rebuilding the whole world is not a minor addon
Well, it is what a remake basically has to do. Rebuild the world. This time it is from 2D to 3D which has some potential improvements. But can also end up looking far worse. The character models alone will never look as convincing and atmospheric as the hand drawn portraits and scenes in the original. And I'm not even talking about the nightmare inducing models the game shipped with. Those are "legendary" on their own. The towns look better, sure.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
and definitely there are/will be events which are not flavor but have significant impact on gameplay.
That kind of depends on what you define as event. For me, an event is something like a random encounter. A scripted "something" that might happen when visiting towns etc.
All of this is flavor to me. Sure it will be nice if there is more of it than in the originals, and it would make the game better if it reached the originals quality in all other aspects. But really, I fail to see where this is a major improvement. Or a significant impact on gameplay. For that, you would have to significantly change the gameplay, not just add more of the same. It's more like an enhanced edition (like the new Space Rangers or The Witcher: EE).

User created content is really cool. I like that, I'm a great fan of modding and supporting modders.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
And since you speak like that, I suppose you have no thorough knowledge on original games or the state of this particular game.
I am pretty sure I have thorough knowledge of the originals, thank you.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
It is so easy to curse, derogate or devalue a game with shitstorms and incessant whining while donning nostalgia googles.
You fail to realize that not everybody criticizing the remake or Crafty Studios is blinded by nostalgia. The originals were good games, sure, but they sure had a load of problems (really, a lot). Though I do not remember many bugs.
The only ones blinded here seem to be those that somehow defend this kind of business practice.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
The hard and right way is to be constructive and supportive to back an ideal instead saying "Ah maybe next time." Because there might be "no next time" and there are a good deal of people who wants there should be "next time". Hence supporting it.
Supporting the ideal of releasing unfinished games for the full price without clearly stating that they are unfinished or without giving any proper reason why they were released in such a state, except blatant lies*? What an ideal to support, really. It might even encourage more devs to follow that very road. Great idea!
Where I come from, this "ideal" is called fraud.

Or do you mean the ideal to create remakes? Well, this is currently "the shit" in game development, it seems. Instead of coming up with your own stuff, just copy/clone/remake something. Also, a great ideal to follow. EA will agree.

Or do you mean the ideal of creating RPGs? Well, I see no lack of those at the moment. With more coming up.

Really, what ideal are you speaking of? I can see none that is worth supporting here.

If there is no next time for Crafty Studios, it is entirely their own fault and they do not deserve pity for that, and let's hope it would discourage other devs from following their "ideals". If there is a next time, fine, and let's hope they have learned.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
For your information, the game was already playable for a few months if you look from "core" perspective…in that case it already exceeded your maximum.
A few months back from now, you couldn't even finish all quests. It is even in Fluent's review which is not months old. Not sure why you would call that complete from the "core" perspective. Or playable.

Originally Posted by ugralitan View Post
Plus: You will find a very helpful and friendly community in the official forums who are ready to support you (let it be developer or the players) in any way they can. After all, many people are not aware of the game(originals) or its mechanics(it can be complex) and it can be frustrating. Or you found an annoying bug, maybe simply computer crashed? You will find quite swift assistance there.
That is a good sign. Really. For all the shitstorms they deserve and get, this speaks for them, if they managed to maintain a positive atmosphere there.

Spoiler – *
Last edited by TheSHEEEP; November 12th, 2013 at 16:48.
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November 12th, 2013, 18:05
Originally Posted by TheSHEEEP View Post
Well, it is what a remake basically has to do. Rebuild the world. This time it is from 2D to 3D which has some potential improvements. But can also end up looking far worse. The character models alone will never look as convincing and atmospheric as the hand drawn portraits and scenes in the original. And I'm not even talking about the nightmare inducing models the game shipped with. Those are "legendary" on their own. The towns look better, sure.

There will be modding tools to allow 2D pictures but apparently you have no idea how time consuming 2D pictures/art at this point while a 3D polish can be easier. All those stuff has been thoroughly discussed in the proper places and it is a bit late for that unless the game can be supported financially. A remake is a remake, it does not have to rebuild things in 3D with beautiful visuals. If I made it with the exactly same way in copy paste towns, it would be a remake also. And NPCs will look better as well.

That kind of depends on what you define as event. For me, an event is something like a random encounter. A scripted "something" that might happen when visiting towns etc.
All of this is flavor to me. Sure it will be nice if there is more of it than in the originals, and it would make the game better if it reached the originals quality in all other aspects. But really, I fail to see where this is a major improvement. Or a significant impact on gameplay. For that, you would have to significantly change the gameplay, not just add more of the same. It's more like an enhanced edition (like the new Space Rangers or The Witcher: EE).

Everything you encounter in an Arkania game is an event, from countless dungeon encounters to small city encounters. The original games had a handfull of them, with vast, uninteresting towns. The original games had not any significant negative attribute checks, hence people could easily min/max some attributes and have no real downsides. And there are and will be more negative checks in this game. It is not enhanced edition. It is fixing the original and making it more beautiful.

User created content is really cool. I like that, I'm a great fan of modding and supporting modders.


I am pretty sure I have thorough knowledge of the originals, thank you.

You are welcome.

You fail to realize that not everybody criticizing the remake or Crafty Studios is blinded by nostalgia. The originals were good games, sure, but they sure had a load of problems (really, a lot). Though I do not remember many bugs.
The only ones blinded here seem to be those that somehow defend this kind of business practice.

Originals were decent games, but was a great waste of potential. I did not like Riva much to be honest. And Star Trail did not have the charm of Blade of Destiny….if only Blade of Destiny was not so empty. Of course you do not remember any bugs, because you have no way to find them or you'd have no patience to playthrough it 20 times. And we do not defend business practice, developers are aware of their mistakes and they are trying to make amends. And your kind just whines like petulant childs and throw another kick to the goat who is trying to get up by itself.

Supporting the ideal of releasing unfinished games for the full price without clearly stating that they are unfinished or without giving any proper reason why they were released in such a state, except blatant lies*? What an ideal to support, really. It might even encourage more devs to follow that very road. Great idea!
Where I come from, this "ideal" is called fraud.

Kickstarter sells you dreams, non-existent games and many of them are disappointing. And they are not entitled to give reasons everywhere at every forum sheesh. Otherwise they'd have no time to make amends in form of developing the game. If you want blatant lies, don't make me speak about many spell and talent entries of RoA original games which never had a use but simply wasted your experience points. It is a real kick in the head when learning there is nothing to Drive or no Animal to Train or Necropathia will not work since there is no dead to talk etc etc. "Ideal" is to support creation of such games more. Supporting Crafty Studios after they show signs of amendment is a solid investment. In a year your criticism will not be remembered.

Or do you mean the ideal to create remakes? Well, this is currently "the shit" in game development, it seems. Instead of coming up with your own stuff, just copy/clone/remake something. Also, a great ideal to follow. EA will agree.

Sure TES: Arena was copied for last 4 games with a few minor changes and graphics. If I look from your logic…many games are mere remakes of each other. Sure instead wizards, there can be technology freaks, or instead an evil overlord there can be a computer pulling strings. Well they have been successful, selling same stories in different forms. And no this is not copy/clone/remake simply.

Or do you mean the ideal of creating RPGs? Well, I see no lack of those at the moment. With more coming up.

Really, what ideal are you speaking of? I can see none that is worth supporting here.

Ideal of having a good Northland Trilogy. But spare me your theatrics

If there is no next time for Crafty Studios, it is entirely their own fault and they do not deserve pity for that, and let's hope it would discourage other devs from following their "ideals". If there is a next time, fine, and let's hope they have learned.

Let's hope one day you will fall into a situation where you make a similar mistake, and while you try to amend it with concrete steps they would just turn their faces away from you. Constructive

A few months back from now, you couldn't even finish all quests. It is even in Fluent's review which is not months old. Not sure why you would call that complete from the "core" perspective. Or playable.

A few months back from now, it was finishable and playable. When you patch things up, new bugs appear and they may affect some occurrences. Apparently you don't know anything about programming.

That is a good sign. Really. For all the shitstorms they deserve and get, this speaks for them, if they managed to maintain a positive atmosphere there.

Spoiler – *
Conclusion: Heh.
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November 12th, 2013, 19:00
The only thing that irked me about this entire affair is the complete retards they employed as mods during the shitstorm. They outright deleted negative feedback and tried to call people out on their criticisms at the same time.

Not-So-Crafty-Studios hasn't and will never see my money, so no hard feelings there.

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February 3rd, 2014, 14:58
I just bought the game and i enjoy it very much. I wanted to play Arkania trilogy, but could not face its old fashioned looks
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February 4th, 2014, 12:39
Yep, the game has made another good leap after 1.32 patch. Eyes on 1.33.

With this rate, the game should deserve another fluent(tm) review featuring another elephant in room.
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February 4th, 2014, 19:38
They even got steam achievements now.
Not that a game needs them to be good. But replacing the dummy achievement with real ones kinda shows it is "out of beta" now.
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February 4th, 2014, 22:10
Uh oh, that's the death knell to my interest level. Pointless achievements. Buggy pointless achievements. Ugh.
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February 5th, 2014, 10:10
The best achievement game

http://armorgames.com/play/13196/achievement-unlocked-3

And yeah, some people like achievements too much. I am quite indifferent to them, but some of them can add to the humor of some games when aptly named.
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