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Default RPG Codex - Top 70 PC RPG List

May 11th, 2014, 15:26
HiddenX sent me a link where the RPG Codex has a new Top 70 RPG list that comes with user reviews for every game. Here is some information from the site.

RPG Codex Top 70 PC RPGs (Now with User Reviews!)

Back in January, esteemed community member felipepepe staged a vote so we could find out what our community's all-time best computer RPGs actually are these days. As a result, we got a hefty list, with graphs and stuff, of 70 titles - or actually a bit more: some games were tied, so you may notice that this Top 70 list features more games than just seventy. Then we asked our users to submit mini-reviews for the games that made it on the list. Around 50 Codexers and one Watch spy took the call, and here's what came out of it.
More information.
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May 11th, 2014, 15:26
Wow, that is actually a cool and pretty massive list whith just the right overview (screenshots+text) to give a first impression. Well done!
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May 11th, 2014, 16:02
Great list, I agree with most if not all of it (I haven't played all the games, but quite alot of them). Great work Codex. Noteworthy is that neither Oblivion nor Skyrim made the list…
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May 11th, 2014, 16:14
Never understood the love for Deus Ex… Glad to see Jagged Alliance 2 in the top 15!
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May 11th, 2014, 16:23
Not to lessen the efforts made towards that list, but it's becoming a bit too predictable; ie., Torment, Fallout, BG, etc.. Yes, we get it - I get it! Those are good games. But, just once, I'd like a list made up with voting disallowed for such games. A poll requiring a game to have personally been played or replayed in the past 5 years and not simply voted on based off memory and self-imposed tunnelvision ("Torment was the best! It simply has to be the best! No constructive thinking allowed!").

My poll's requirements:
No games older than 10 years. (we all have to move on at some point… familiarity does not equate to a "better" game)
Must have personally played in the past 5 years.
Limit of 1 Obsidian or Bioware vote.

You put some limits on hive-mind thinking, and all of a sudden constructive thought processes are required.

I *do* like the small section splitting up the games into pre and post 1995. A poll closer to my ideal (and to generally make more sense of an otherwise jumbled list) would be splitting it up further [1986-1995], [1996-2005], & [2006-present].

Regardless of the above, it *is* a nice Codex poll for lighting a fire under one's ass to try out games often overlooked… I'm newly intrigued by Wizardry VII for instance, having only ever played Wiz VIII.

…Also, no Ultima Underworld? Again, if you're going to include certain games from a time period because your buddy's sister friend said they were cool, you can't simply exclude others. The poll needs to be split up or limited in scope from the start. It makes no sense that a twenty year old can add his votes to the same poll as a forty year old if they haven't each played a good part of the same games.
Last edited by Drithius; May 11th, 2014 at 16:49.
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May 11th, 2014, 16:49
Those requirements would make an interesting list (though I don't think new = better either). Would really love to see what kind of hidden gems make the list though.

These lists always make me feel the need try Troika's games. Two of them landing right behind BG 2 (one of the only games I still replay) always make me curious. Also, surprised to see King's of Dragon's Pass on the list. It is a rather unique and interesting game.
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May 11th, 2014, 16:57
Originally Posted by Drithius View Post
Not to lessen the efforts made towards that list, but it's becoming a bit too predictable; ie., Torment, Fallout, BG, etc.. Yes, we get it - I get it! Those are good games. But, just once, I'd like a list made up with voting disallowed for such games. A poll requiring a game to have personally been played or replayed in the past 5 years and not simply voted on based off memory and self-imposed tunnelvision.
You are of course right in the fact that the Top 10 is pretty predictable. If I would make my own it would look about the same. And I actually have played a couple of those games in the last 5 years (V:TMB, Wizardry 8, Arcanum and of course Fallout New Vegas). I made my FIRST playthrough of Wizardry 8 and V:TMB just a year ago, and guess what? They still outclassed everything made in the last 5 years, even though I didn't have any nostalgia classes to put on since I hadn't played them before. So my take on the list is it's still (to me) pretty accurate.

Here's to hoping the list don't look the same in yet another couple of years, because there's light on the horizon. But it's not the list that is flawed, it's simply that few RPG's made today can hold a candle to the classics (again, IMO of course).

D:OS, Torment, PoE or Wasteland 2 might be just what it takes to actually move some of those top 10 down a couple of notches. I have a hard time believing any AAA RPG's will, at least in the forseeable future. "Our" genre has been dead for years, THAT'S the reason so few newer games make the list. The ressurection spell used by Kickstarter might change that. Or we get a couple of good titles and then we go back to complaining…
Last edited by tomasp3n; May 11th, 2014 at 17:47.
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May 11th, 2014, 16:59
Originally Posted by Drithius View Post
…Also, no Ultima Underworld? Again, if you're going to include certain games from a time period because your buddy's sister friend said they were cool, you can't simply exclude others. The poll needs to be split up or limited in scope from the start. It makes no sense that a twenty year old can add his votes to the same poll as a forty year old if they haven't each played a good part of the same games.
Ultima Underworld 1: #20
Ultima Underworld 2: #54

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May 11th, 2014, 17:05
Originally Posted by HiddenX View Post
Ultima Underworld 1: #20
Ultima Underworld 2: #54
Ah, so it is… and yet, Dark Souls is ranked higher. My original point on splitting up the list into more precise demographics remains.
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May 11th, 2014, 17:14
As I said in the Codex thread the ranking is not so important. The whole list is a great effort. Older games have a backseat, because there are not so many guys and gals of the generation 45+ on the Codex. I like the list and it was fun to make a few reviews for the older games.
Most of the work was done by felipepepe and Crooked Bee - special thanks to both of you!

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May 11th, 2014, 17:22
The witcher series, wizardry 1-3, drakensang and dark souls would be much higher on my list.

Torment wouldn't make my top 70 and arcanum might very possibly make my bottom 10.

Good list of games though for the most part.
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May 11th, 2014, 17:38
I love each and every new best RPG list. It's fun like shaking up a hornet's nest or slapping a rattlesnake.

Back on topic.

THE GOOD
I'm surprised by how many RPGs in that list I have never heard about. About 10 titles that I'll have to check out. So in that regard, awesome list.

THE BAD
Wizards & Warriors makes the list? But no UU1 or UU2? Might as well poke a cobra in the eye…

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May 11th, 2014, 17:41
Some of the discussion is very uneven; high praise for older games that have very limited interaction and a contrained design, then damning statements for more recent titles that have greater breadth and flexibility. The product of a committee approach, I suppose.

Separate lists for different eras might have been more useful.
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May 11th, 2014, 17:45
Originally Posted by rjshae View Post
Some of the discussion is very uneven; high praise for older games that have very limited interaction and a contrained design, then damning statements for more recent titles that have greater breadth and flexibility. The product of a committee approach, I suppose.
Each short review is a personal opinion of the reviewer - the reviews are only slightly edited to correct errors.

PS:
@Mad Gamer
UU1 and UU2 are on the list…

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May 11th, 2014, 17:49
Originally Posted by TheMadGamer View Post
I love each and every new best RPG list. It's fun like shaking up a hornet's nest or slapping a rattlesnake.

Back on topic.

THE GOOD
I'm surprised by how many RPGs in that list I have never heard about. About 10 titles that I'll have to check out. So in that regard, awesome list.

THE BAD
Wizards & Warriors makes the list? But no UU1 or UU2? Might as well poke a cobra in the eye…
Please read this thread again…or actually take the time to go through the Codex list properly.

Edit: Doh, HiddenX beat me to it…
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May 11th, 2014, 17:56
Originally Posted by tomasp3n View Post
Please read this thread again…or actually take the time to go through the Codex list properly.

Edit: Doh, HiddenX beat me to it…
Yes my bad… I was feverishly looking for UU1 or UU2 and predictably missed it. But it's there! So that's a good thing!

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May 11th, 2014, 17:57
"No games older than 10 years. (we all have to move on at some point… familiarity does not equate to a "better" game)"

I strongly disagree that just because a game is older than 10 years, that our memories of it are unclear. That effect can happen but I wouldn't assume that it did. Torment is a great game regardless of when it was made, and its inclusion on a list like this does not mean someone was just going by their own dim memory.
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May 11th, 2014, 18:15
Yeah, for a up to date list you would need to filter out nostalgica. But the question is, where nostalgica begins and where the love for older game mechanics ends.

Everyone has a different pain threshold. Some players wouldn't even consider the new Spiderweb Games as good games just because their graphics are very simple. Personally I think that even the BG2 HD version is uglier than these.

Then how do you judge old interfaces? Is an old game bad now because it doesn't have tooltips and it's mandatory to read the manual?

I guess it's probably better to not completely try to filter them but instead mark games as "subject to aging". But on the other hand you mostly can directly tell that from the screenshots alone anyways. So…nothing wrong with that list.

Though I agree that Skyrim should be on it. Was probably filtered out because of "it's too mainstream to be cool anymore". Oblivion? Well…it has the worst character system I ever saw in the game and therefore never played it long without the Nehrim Total Conversion. If you want to add Nehrim to the list, go for it.
Also I think Avernum Escape from the Pit should be on this list.
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May 11th, 2014, 18:23
Originally Posted by Drithius View Post
My poll's requirements:
No games older than 10 years. (we all have to move on at some point… familiarity does not equate to a "better" game)
I will also disagree with this, I replay PS:T,Arcanum, JA 2, Divinity, Star control 2 and couple of other games every few years so most of those games are fresh in my memory and they outclass most modern games especially in world design and amount of details.Only thing I find annoying in older games is UI,modern games have far better UI(I am talking about PC dedicated titles) and sometimes is hard to go back to old UI(this is most noticable for original X-Com).
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May 11th, 2014, 19:23
These type of lists are very biased towards age of the respondents. Would younger players under 25, for instance, agree on the same top 10 games? I doubt it. Not arguing those are terrific games but if you get younger reviewers in there I expect the mix up to change a bit.
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