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RPGWatch Forums » Comments » News Comments » Warhammer Online - There's too much Confusion

Default Warhammer Online - There's too much Confusion

August 26th, 2008, 23:20
RPS have blogged up on the state of the WAR beta inclusions, adding that there is still no offical monthly sub fees.
After astonishing amounts of confusion, GOA has finally made what appears to be the definitive statement regarding Open Beta access for those who pre-order Warhammer Online from the EA Store, and Direct2Drive.
It seems their plan was to not announce which of their partners would be offering customers OB access until the day the game becomes officially available for pre-order sale - this Thursday. However, EA and D2D, who it turns out will be amongst those partners, put the information up early. GOA then responded to this by, er, denying it. Now they have said they intended Open Beta to be available via certain pre-order outlets all along.
Despite GOA’s Community Manager, MagnusK, rather unambiguously responding to the question, “Will EU SE pre-order customers get into WAR Open Beta?” with, “No,” it seems the answer was rather, “Yes.”
More information.
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August 26th, 2008, 23:20
And that is exactly the reason why a game NEEDs official forums: to avoid such information catastrophes.
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August 27th, 2008, 01:20
Well, official announcements can be done on a web-site they don't really need forums for that. Though an MMO with no forums seems kind of irregular. I'm sure if enough people shout about them forums will go up at some point.
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August 27th, 2008, 10:42
If you make a MMO which is supposed to attract thousands, possibly millions of people and then announce that there will be no official forums you give the fanbase one very clear message: We don't care a bit about your opinion… just play our game, pay your fees and shut the fuck up. Good luck with this kind of customer support…
Mythic should have learned from the AoC disaster. In the beginning the official forums were the only source of real information and help for players. When the patcher wasn't working for example it was a player who posted a solution that actually helped.

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August 27th, 2008, 10:48
Tabular rasa didnt have any forums. I found it kind if annoying.

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August 27th, 2008, 11:45
You're really not expecting much from this game, Ionstormsucks, are you? Seems you take every opportunity to dis WAR, which you of course is free to do but it doesn't match up well with either my friends' or MMO sites' opinions of how the game is going to be.

Anyway, that they won't have any official forums has been known since forever, and I fully agree with that decision as the amount in head-exploding whining always is so extremely high no matter if the MMO is any good or not. Third party sites can moderate that much better without upsetting subscribers and probably feel strengthened by Mythic trusting them to be the place for all player discussion about the game.

(And I'm not trying to just be a fanboy here, I sure am expecting a good, but not perfect game with lots of room for improvement post-launch. And that really is what I want on the MMO front right now.)
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August 27th, 2008, 14:14
Even if WAR turns out to be the greatest MMO ever, having an official forum is a gesture of respect, to say "hi customer, here is a place where you can meet everyone else, say you stuff and have a guarantee we make someone look at it now and then". No miracles, but a matter of honoring paying customers. I know in our days people care less about respect and honor, but in this case, its a poor sigh for me book. I will buy WAR nonetheless, but it gives me a BAD feeling, and I know from other MMOs what endless confusion the lack of official forums cause. I really had thought at least in THIS EA would know better and MAKE Mythic have a forum. Now we have a splintered community spread over dozens of sites. I dont like it a BIT. And that has ZERO to do with my opinion on the game! Nowadays, in the long run, I rather play a MMO where I see the devs actually care and communicate, than a top game run by a bunch of arrogants.
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August 27th, 2008, 15:01
Fair point, even though the devs have been posting on different fan sites already. It's just that in the MMOs I've played (WoW and EVE) using the official forums for serious discussion has been unthinkable, and news from the devs don't need forums to be communicated.

What I really mean is that I buy your argument that they should provide official forums out of respect for their customers, but I don't think they're arrogant for not doing so.
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August 28th, 2008, 12:29
Originally Posted by Toaster View Post
You're really not expecting much from this game, Ionstormsucks, are you? Seems you take every opportunity to dis WAR, which you of course is free to do but it doesn't match up well with either my friends' or MMO sites' opinions of how the game is going to be.
I expected a lot from this game - too much maybe, also thanks to what Mythic and all the MMO sites wrote about the game. I recently posted a lengthy beta-preview/review/whatever in another forum (unfortunately in German) which I personally think does justice to the game. The are some things in WAR which I like and some things I don't like, so no - the game is not just bad, it also has a lot of positive aspects. No offense but I really don't care for the opinion of MMO sites or your your friends. I simply don't know your friends and what exactly they told you about WAR and most MMO sites nowadays are idiotic hype machines.
What I know are the beta forums and these tell me that I'm not alone with my criticism concerning WAR…
Look at AoC is all I say… it got glorious reviews and all MMO sites praised it as if it were the next big hit… fanbois wrote me angry e-mails after I published a tongue-in-cheek review of the game on my blog - now look at what happened to it. I very well remember the reaction when I posted my opinion that subscriber numbers would rapidly decline after launch. I'm not saying the same will happen to WAR, but I think, one should not believe everything what MMO sites or the developers are saying. MMO sites have a tendency to emphasise the positive sides of games and cut out all the negative stuff.

I never liked the decision that WAR won't have official forums because it inevitably leads to chaos. Just look at what happens right now. Mark Jakobs posts in the IGN forums, Barnett on Warhammer Alliance, Hickman on Ten Ton Hammer, you name it - is that customer friendly? Not in my opinion. As Elikal said, this has something to do with respect. I don't need Mythic, but Mythic needs me (well, not me personally, but you know what I mean…). This decision seeminglessly blends in with what I've seen so far from Mythic. They always pretend to be the good, honest and funny guys of the MMO scene. Fact is however that they lie and cheat exactly as much and have exactly as little respect for their customers as every other big MMO developer currently on the market. And that is something that totally pisses me off.

If WAR is a good or a bad game is a very different question and has nothing to do with that. If you want, we can discuss about that, I think you would very suprised about my opinion.

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Last edited by Ionstormsucks; August 28th, 2008 at 12:36.
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August 28th, 2008, 13:02
I'll be playing this one just to see how it goes. AoC lasted the free month because I though the game deteriorated the further you played, it still has some really nice locations though. The zoned design of the game probably puts MMO players off as well. I think you really have to keep people playing from launch if you want a successful MMO (not just a polished and rather cynical first 20mins as some people have surmised).

I like the design of WAR in that there is an actual game there that is akin to Warhammer campaigns of old, such as Blood Bath at Orc's Drift and the like. Suicide attacks like the Bright Mage's backlash are also very Warhammer.
Last edited by woges; August 28th, 2008 at 15:45.
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August 28th, 2008, 16:17
Originally Posted by woges View Post
I like the design of WAR in that there is an actual game there that is akin to Warhammer campaigns of old, such as Blood Bath at Orc's Drift and the like. Suicide attacks like the Bright Mage's backlash are also very Warhammer.
WAR also has a pretty nice atmosphere if you're asking me. Mythic did not stick in all details to the license, but nonetheless I think that they did a nice job in this particular area.

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August 28th, 2008, 17:09
It feels like a Warhammer game to me, even though the last things I played Warhammer are the first WHFR and The Enemy Within campaign. I think that's when they introduced Witch Hunters and the like so it is recognisable to me.

I also like the many passive and moral skills and buffs that you can add to your character to distinguish them. The Tome offers skills from the library in Altdorf, while PVP offers skills from the Keeps in the RvR fields.

I think Mark Jacobs listed a lot of the common complaints about the game after the beta weekend that concern the most so at least they are listening to people even without the forums.
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August 28th, 2008, 17:42
Originally Posted by woges View Post
I also like the many passive and moral skills and buffs that you can add to your character to distinguish them. The Tome offers skills from the library in Altdorf, while PVP offers skills from the Keeps in the RvR fields.
I'm a bit sceptical about the "tactics". On the one hand it is great that there are so many, on the other hand you can only slot five at the same time. In a way this is a bit of an overkill because about 80% will probably not be used since there are simply tactics which are "dominant", meaning much better than the rest.

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August 28th, 2008, 17:59
Possibly, but there are some handy in group play and some specific for the individual. It should be easy to tweak the two to make them worthy.
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August 28th, 2008, 18:01
Oh the pvp ones are passive I thought? They aren't part of the 5 you chose as well, at least that's how it looked to me. As I took Int for my Bright Wizard and it seemed to add it auto to my character.
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August 28th, 2008, 20:31
Originally Posted by woges View Post
Oh the pvp ones are passive I thought? They aren't part of the 5 you chose as well, at least that's how it looked to me. As I took Int for my Bright Wizard and it seemed to add it auto to my character.
Ah yep, that's Renown Mastery which works a bit differently. You can check it out on curse-gaming. There are a completely passive abilties and those you can put in the PvP tactics slot.

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August 29th, 2008, 14:48
I'd love to discuss WAR when open beta starts! And I didn't mean to point you out as a WAR hater Ionstormsucks (ISS?), it's just that your opinions of the game here in the comments came off as a bit one-sided while it's very understandable as the press are hyping the game pretty heavily now. I share some of your concerns about the game, the biggest of course being that it's a new AoC, but looking at gameplay a thing like very toned down crowd control is just positive for me who remember playing a Warrior in Alterac Valley where I'd just come near the enemy and then be unable to do anything before I was dead.

Their handling of the community can be a weak link of WAR, we'll see at launch how it works out, especially if there's major problems with the servers as my WoW time has made me expect but still fear.
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August 30th, 2008, 00:10
I don't think you can blame Mythic for GOA, GOA have always proven themselves to be well below the level of service that Mythic offers their customers.

I've played WAR for the last 3 months. Leveled pretty much every class to level 11 at least and a 4 to in their 20's. I have also played the high end via auto templates that were created by mythic.

Pretty much all the tactics will be of use to certain builds, some are completely useless for people who don't spec down a particular mastery line or buy a certain ability in one of the mastery lines, others are only useful if you build your character in a certain way, for example if you focus on being a PvE Tank (Wounds+toughness+armour+inititive+resists) you might choose a tactic that gives you a small chance to proc a absorb buff every time you get hit.

As for mythic not caring about their fanbase, it couldn't be further from the truth. In the beta they had the most extensive IN-GAME feedback tools of any MMORPG out there. Ingame surveys, extensive bug reporting, quick feedback, and also the closed beta forums. They also frequent all the major fan forums and several guild forums.

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August 31st, 2008, 07:50
"I will buy WAR nonetheless, but it gives me a BAD feeling,"

Why not speak with your wallet then? Don't buy it and send them an email telling them why.

I did that with LOTRO.

I won't buy a game that doesn't have an actual open beta that is open. I will never buy a game that calls their closed beta, or "pre-order" beta, an open beta. I don't care if its the greatest game in the world or if I'd love the shit out of it. If you want my money, give me the chance, the option, to try your product for free.

I really despised Blizzard and had no plans of buying WoW at all, when I got an email for their open beta. I would've ignored all the hubbub about it, since their was hubbub about Diablo 2 and I hate that fucking game and every other blizz game made. I ended up loving wow and have kept my subscription going for years without even playing for year long stretches. I would've never bought it if I didn't get into open beta.

Now, I probably wouldn't even download the client for open beta if i got (get) into it. But thats the difference of me forking my money over to them and not forking it over. The only power I have over corporate entities is speaking with my wallet. Do what I think is right, or don't get my money. If enough people had consumer integrity, you'd be amazed what we could get or how much influence we could have on these companies.

But, if you have dislike what a comapny is doing, or their business practices, and still buy their product, you just discounted all your influence over them. You have to have patience and the willpower to hold to your integrity.

I would never go to the wow forums or any mmorpg forum, so I can't agree with anyone's sentiments on this one. I see them not having an official forums as a good business decision. No wasted money on labor moderating the forums which are populated by a bunch of whinny retards without jobs. You can post on other forums for free. Its a smart business move. But if enough people think its an insult, and these people speak with their wallets instead of whinning with their keyboards, mythic will listen, and have to eat the cost of forum mpoderation and all the headaches that come with it.

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August 31st, 2008, 17:38
They never had official forums for DAoC either did they?

It's not really a new thing for Mythic and DAoC seems to have a few fans.

I'm uncertain to what the beta program was like though.
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