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Default Top 10 CRPGs of all time

September 21st, 2008, 10:08
Right, a step by step description of a game's ending wouldn't be a spoiler at all….
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September 21st, 2008, 11:17
Originally Posted by dteowner View Post
Spoiler
Originally Posted by JDR13 View Post
Right, a step by step description of a game's ending wouldn't be a spoiler at all….
??? I understand nothing of your comments. I guess I just discovered I never played BG1, I wonder what game I played.
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September 21st, 2008, 15:28
Please, can you stop this BG spoilfest? I´ve finished the game at least 3 times but the ending is so unmemorable that I always forget how it goes, and now, before my fourth run, thanks to this thread, I already know there´s a big boss at the end!!
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September 21st, 2008, 18:31
I can even add that it's really nasty to spoil a so unexpected and original end.
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November 8th, 2008, 00:11
Originally Posted by blatantninja View Post
Well, I panned a bunch in the other list, so I guess I'd better post here too!

3) Legacy of the Ancients - for all the reasons the above poster mentioned! Great game, really wish they had made the sequel for the C64
There was a spiritual sequel from Epyx called Legend of Blacksilver. Same engine, larger game, same fun gameplay.
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November 8th, 2008, 00:17
My top 10 list, in no particular order… and sorry if most are not PC RPG's. I do play most in emulation so it is on my PC

1) Final Fantasy VII - Very good story, good combat
2) Xenogears - underated PS1 RPG. Again, very good story line and Mech battles.
3) Legacy of the Ancients - see previous reviews as to why
4) Legend of Blacksilver - spiritual successor to Legacy of the Ancients
5) Chronotrigger
6) Ultima 3 - played this on my C64 and it's the first of the Ultimas that I finished
7) Questron II - again, another C64 RPG
8) ADOM - Rogulike at it's best
9) Nethack - fun to play, hard to finish
10) Wizardry 6-7-8 What a way to end a series.
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November 8th, 2008, 14:12
Originally Posted by ebonflame View Post
My top 10 list, in no particular order… and sorry if most are not PC RPG's. I do play most in emulation so it is on my PC
That's weird, I know every taste is in the world but I wonder how Fallout 1 for example couldn't reach your top ten and if an old game as Ultima III did it how some old much better like Ultima VII couldn't. Cough cough I know, not my concern.
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November 8th, 2008, 16:22
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
That's weird, I know every taste is in the world but I wonder how Fallout 1 for example couldn't reach your top ten and if an old game as Ultima III did it how some old much better like Ultima VII couldn't. Cough cough I know, not my concern.
I've just not had the pleasure/opportunity to play Ultima Vii nor Fallout. Sad thing is that I have both of them but just haven't gotten around to play with them as I've got hooked on Rappelz (free to play MMORPG). I've been following this thread and do plan on trying some of these games out. But with my short attention span, I don't hold out much hope in finishing any of them.
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November 8th, 2008, 21:25
Also, I fell into the dark grasps of the adventure game genre. Currently playing The Longest Journey and recently finished Syberia and Syberia II. I higly recommend the Syberia pair. Best adventure game I've played in a long time.
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November 9th, 2008, 13:13
Originally Posted by ebonflame View Post
I've just not had the pleasure/opportunity to play Ultima Vii nor Fallout. Sad thing is that I have both of them but just haven't gotten around to play with them as I've got hooked on Rappelz (free to play MMORPG). I've been following this thread and do plan on trying some of these games out. But with my short attention span, I don't hold out much hope in finishing any of them.
I have to admit that there many CRPG that I played more than 50% of them but that I haven't finish.

With this sort of list the temptation is high to include some less known item at depends of some other that most people already know. That's what I suspected with your list because it has 6 new items no people in this topic has yet quoted in their top 10 (some could have been listed as 11 and more). But I don't make judgment about this sort of choice they have positive and negative points.
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November 10th, 2008, 06:54
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
I have to admit that there many CRPG that I played more than 50% of them but that I haven't finish.

With this sort of list the temptation is high to include some less known item at depends of some other that most people already know. That's what I suspected with your list because it has 6 new items no people in this topic has yet quoted in their top 10 (some could have been listed as 11 and more). But I don't make judgment about this sort of choice they have positive and negative points.
I look at it this way… most of the top 10 were the same ones. At least mine, which were my personal favorites, will have introduced people to some games they may have never considered trying.
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November 12th, 2008, 01:32
Originally Posted by ebonflame View Post
I look at it this way… most of the top 10 were the same ones. At least mine, which were my personal favorites, will have introduced people to some games they may have never considered trying.
Right this his the plus of being original but the minus is not being fully honest and this can lead to weird things.

No, all post wasn't all the same, some posts ago I computed them all and there was 152 different CRPG quoted in top 10 (I removed those after the 10) for 82 people votes and some vote for less than 10.

That's another reason to not being fully honest and try favoring originality, that's what makes this topic fun, picking up some obscure titles.
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November 12th, 2008, 01:51
I enjoyed U3 much more than I did U7. I've met a number of people wjp agree that remember the seminal event that was U3.

U3 was the most polished and professional game ever put out at the time and finally brought the real D&D experience to computers. As older devs are being replaced with new ones I find only a sparse that even remember it. As I recall U7's sales figures were unfortunately poor for its run because of the expensive hardware requirements, such as a hard drive.

Questron II has been played by a few of us here and it was quite enjoyable. What I liked most about it was the fantastic ending - I wasn't expecting such a long sequence - it really made you feel the time you played was worth it.

Developer of The Wizard's Grave Android game. Discussion Thread:
http://www.rpgwatch.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22520
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November 14th, 2008, 22:17
Originally Posted by Lucky Day View Post
I enjoyed U3 much more than I did U7. I've met a number of people wjp agree that remember the seminal event that was U3.

U3 was the most polished and professional game ever put out at the time and finally brought the real D&D experience to computers. As older devs are being replaced with new ones I find only a sparse that even remember it. As I recall U7's sales figures were unfortunately poor for its run because of the expensive hardware requirements, such as a hard drive.
I don't think the hard drive was that much of an issue. By 1992, hard drives were pretty standard on PC's. Even Ultima VI basically required a hard drive (not technically, but it was unplayable switching disks). My parents were pretty cheap, so we were always a generation or two behind on technology, and I remember having no real issues playing U7 on our 386 (when 486's were the top dog).

IIRC U7 sold well, but the issue was that it cost more to create U7 part 2 than part 1, and it didn't sell near as well as U7 did. (Still can't figure out why it cost so much given that they were reusing the engine).

I enjoyed Ultima III, however maybe it was was age (I was under 10 when I played it the first time), but there didn't seem to be that much story there to me. You kind of knew there was this Exodus creature hanging out causing havok, but outside of that until you got towards the end, it seemed like the goal was just kill stuff, get more loot, get better equipment and level up, then repeat.


Questron II has been played by a few of us here and it was quite enjoyable. What I liked most about it was the fantastic ending - I wasn't expecting such a long sequence - it really made you feel the time you played was worth it.
I may have to check that one out!

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November 15th, 2008, 01:11
I tried played Ultima III some time ago and well it became very very old. Even during the end of the 80's I don't think I'll have enjoy it. Games like Dungeon Master and Ultima Underworld are much more modern despite they are setup inside dungeons. I don't like Ultima approach until the world setup is full of little things to discover, before that it looks to me quite empty and robotic a bit like Oblivion but with almost no story. Also the fights don't fill the void from the few I see. That's totally different with a later Ultima but I don't remember which one I played a bit apart the VII.
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November 15th, 2008, 02:13
For those who want to try out Fallout and Deus Ex, Game Tap have them available as part of their free downloads for those who don't mind ads
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December 6th, 2008, 09:23
Originally Posted by ebonflame View Post
Also, I fell into the dark grasps of the adventure game genre. Currently playing The Longest Journey and recently finished Syberia and Syberia II. I higly recommend the Syberia pair. Best adventure game I've played in a long time.
I wonder if the DS version is good or not. You are tempting me to attempt it.
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December 6th, 2008, 22:45
Originally Posted by Dasale View Post
I wonder if the DS version is good or not. You are tempting me to attempt it.
Try it. I don't think you'll be disappointed. I just got lucky a few Christmases back and found Syberia I and II as a 'game of the year' pack for $9.99 at my local Target. Best 10 bucks I've ever spent. 2nd best would be the Longest Journey/Dreamfall bundle for the same price.. .but I digress as these are adventure games and not RPGs
Last edited by ebonflame; December 6th, 2008 at 22:46. Reason: spelling error
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December 7th, 2008, 10:10
Originally Posted by ebonflame View Post
Try it. I don't think you'll be disappointed. I just got lucky a few Christmases back and found Syberia I and II as a 'game of the year' pack for $9.99 at my local Target. Best 10 bucks I've ever spent. 2nd best would be the Longest Journey/Dreamfall bundle for the same price.. .but I digress as these are adventure games and not RPGs
In fact I never enjoyed adventure games because too many had a tradition of non sense puzzles. There's only one I enjoyed a lot it's Myst… But yep I'll try Syberia.
Last edited by Dasale; December 7th, 2008 at 11:51.
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December 7th, 2008, 11:43
That sort of list is constantly changing, so I wished post my new version:
  1. Gothic 2 Merged with NOTR : The RPG world is really deep with a high density of story stuff, the sword fighting is amazing, the real life mimic is quite good if you compare to other RPG, often the game offer many ways to achieve some important steps. Enough to make it the best from far and despite some weakness like a poor bow system, a magic system a bit average, an interface design which is quite old and it require a long time to get used to it. The only CRPG I ever replayed fully and even I played it fully 3 times.
  2. Fallout 1 : First RPG with a real adult feeling. It has many strong points, excellent setup of a post apocalyptic world, there are many choices and different paths, good story elements, a good turn based fight system. I recently replayed it and was stunned by how its beginning grab you so fast and so strongly, it's weird I didn't took the time to replay it fully and have a more fresh point of view of it. One thing I don't like is that it has never been translated in my language, that's rather weird.
  3. Ultima Underworld : Fascinating game, the interface was incredibly original and well though for exploring and using stuff but involves quite tough controls for the fights. With patience and practice you can get used more to the system and then could discover the subtle points in fights, but fights controls remain uneasy and will probably disgust most modern players. Puzzles are more on the easy side than in Dungeon Master but there's many and there's a good diversity, ton of good hints, and the best merging I ever see of story/exploration/puzzling/fighting. Also it's probably still the best area 3D design in CRPG, still not beat by modern CRPG that tend to stick to unimaginative realism leading them to a very average area 3D design.
  4. The Witcher : The fight system isn't good if you don't try be versatile and instead stick to a simple but efficient tactic. But if you try fight with more diversity by mixing moving, swording and signs then it's quite fun. Other than that the mood is great and the story stuff is the best that I have seen in CRPG. Also quite interesting is the implementation of user decision effects, the alternate paths and the best in game CRPG encyclopedia.
  5. Dungeon Master : I still have too see a CRPG with a better puzzling design, I have two candidates in my list but I doubt they'll make better for diversity and hints design. The fights are also one of the great features of this game, much more deep and interesting than in many more modern CRPG.
  6. Mystery Dungeon: Shiren the Wanderer : Ok I haven't yet finished it but I haven't been attracted and obsessed by a CRPG as much since The Witcher and Gothic 2 with NOTR. It's a JRPG but not really because it's in fact a Roguelike. I don't share the "no save backup" design of Roguelike but I have to admit that with a good diversity in random generation this is working well and with a good design of possibilities it generate the most strategical and tactical CRPG. Adom is probably better than Shiren on those two points but Shiren is more friendly, for example it has plenty in game hints when in Adom there's only few and most are so obscure that they are useless. It also break a bit Roguelike traditional rules by having some persistence points even through death. In fact you don't die but lost your PC levels and items you are carrying and are teleported back to first level. So you keep stuff stored in storehouses, you keep knowledge of identified stuff in your storehouse, the secondary stories or NPC relationships continue evolve and in fact most often they require you die to evolve. All of that change a lot the mood of the death/restart. Beside that good points, it is very tactical and a bit strategical like all good Roguelike. It has a good diversity and manage well surprises, the graphics are quite cute and that's quite cool and thanks, unlike most JRPG you can almost shut off the music (crap).
  7. NWN2 Mask of the Betrayer : Epic game, better puzzling than most modern RPG but far to match older games like Dungeon Master. It has deep party NPC, a great story with a strong epic feeling, and it is much more subtle on the moral point of view than are usually the CD&D CRPG games.
  8. Badur's Gate 2 Throne of Bhaal : Less big than Shadows of Amn but many improvements, better dungeon quality, better fights and better main story (there's many point I didn't like that much in SoA story including many hard to believe points of the main plot).
  9. NWN2 OC : Certainly the biggest main quest of all CRPG. Great castle management to manage in parallel. For the story approach it is going closer to JRPG like most Final Fantasy with a lot of story stuff, quite detailed and overall quite linear. But the mood is quite different as are the relationships and dialogs with NPC. Party NPC are much more detailed than ever. That's enough to compensate a dungeon quality which isn't always good but sometime just average and some graphics a bit on the low side when compared to other contemporary RPG like The Witcher or Gothic 3
  10. Citadel: Adventure of the Crystal Keep : I replayed it recently and it's been a chock to realize it was even better than what I allowed me think of a totally unknown game. It's just a little dungeon game but it has an unmatched mystery mood. It's also impressive how many modern features this 1989 game had. For example, a deep mouse interface design that you'll see at a similar level only much later, you could personalize in game the graphics of PC and of many items, there's a complete in game toolset to allow draw the map yourself or with a trick it could become an automap and you could add notes in the automap. There's a contextual in game help, party split allowing some interesting puzzles and strategy and even voices for dialogs even if it's through Macintalk. But it's strongest points are its mysterious mood, a good puzzling quite diversified, and an overall interesting challenge. If that game had only those qualities I will have put it quite close to my top 1, but it has also some weak points, few puzzling is probably too tough, it has some design holes certainly deliberate to allow anybody finish the game. But you have to avoid use them to not spoil the fun. You don't need cheat for getting more money, you should avoid use few weird wall tricks to avoid some obstacles/puzzling, and when you'll discover long range weapons with unlimited ammo it's better give up using them because they easily break the challenge of most fights.

Honorable mentions for: Gothic 1, Badur's Gate 1 + Tosc, NWN1: Dreamcatcher Series, BG2 Shadows of Amn, Divine Divinity, NWN1: Hordes of the Underdark, Realmz Sword Lands Trilogy, Etrian Odyssey, Arx Fatalis, NWN1: Shadows of Undrentide, Ancient Domains of Mystery, Final Fantasy IV (DS remake), Temple of Elemental Evil, Zelda : Twilight Princess, IVAN.

For the list of CRPG I haven't played deeply (ie more than few hours) but that I plan to play fully or almost, it's a list that rises faster than I consume it so I'll skip quote any. :-)
Last edited by Dasale; December 7th, 2008 at 11:59.
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