|
Your donations keep RPGWatch running!
RPGWatch Forums » Games » General RPG » Top 10 CRPGs of all time

Default Top 10 CRPGs of all time

July 23rd, 2014, 23:40
I wouldn't call it a lack of imagination so much as a tool for immersion. Part of being in the world is seeing how other characters react to actions and others and party banter can do that. They have their own motivations and desires and sometimes trying to bring opposites together has combustible results (much like real life).
greywolf00 is offline

greywolf00

greywolf00's Avatar
Sentinel

#801

Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Colorado, US
Posts: 558

Default 

July 23rd, 2014, 23:50
Indeed, but those 'characters' are going to be the exact same characters every single play-through, and you have no personal choice over those characters.

You're just playing what someone else thinks would make for entertaining interaction. If you personally can't stand the key characters your going to be travelling with it can put a huge downer on every other aspect of the game, even if the game is, otherwise, gorgeous.

The ability to have varied sexuality for the same characters is a good start, but it's kind of just a tip of the iceburg really, a kind of apologetic cosmetic compared to true variety, the characters will still be 'shifty carismatic thief' and 'heavens to goodness with a dark secret healer' etc.
MinorityReport is offline

MinorityReport

Banned

#802

Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 372

Default 

July 24th, 2014, 00:08
Different strokes for different folks.

How much of an impact it can have on replayability can be highly variable (as is people's willingness to replay the game anyway). Some games keep the required plot important characters down, some have lots of potential companions, others the same character will not be exactly the same on another play through depending on choices (Anomen in BG 2 for example) or even a mix of those things.

For me, roleplaying the characters myself lacks a sense of surprise. I think that's part of the appeal of Martin, characters simply aren't safe. There's always a chance for something unexpected to happen which isn't the case for many other authors.
greywolf00 is offline

greywolf00

greywolf00's Avatar
Sentinel

#803

Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Colorado, US
Posts: 558

Default 

July 24th, 2014, 11:04
Originally Posted by greywolf00 View Post
I wouldn't call it a lack of imagination so much as a tool for immersion. Part of being in the world is seeing how other characters react to actions and others and party banter can do that. They have their own motivations and desires and sometimes trying to bring opposites together has combustible results (much like real life).
Exactly this. For me a great part of roleplaying means, that I let my charcter(s) perform actions in the game world, which in turn somehow reacts, where these reactions are not under my control. Combat is an action (where the gameworld's reaction is quite straight forward) as well as dialogs. With a game like vanilla IWD the gameworld's reaction is too shallow for my taste. Fleshed out companions could change that.

And of course I could roleplay 6 characters on my own. But a game like IWD imho lacks the framework to do so. If you take a look at NWN2: Storm of Zehir or of course now D:OS, you have party dialog systems where you can let the NPC actually interact meaningfully. Of course I could do all of that in my head, but for me that's not satisfying. I need some scaffolding here.

Originally Posted by MinorityReport View Post
Indeed, but those 'characters' are going to be the exact same characters every single play-through, and you have no personal choice over those characters.
Right, that's why I only replay games some years later (if at all).

You're just playing what someone else thinks would make for entertaining interaction.
Yep, and sometimes someone is dead on here, you have entertaining interaction and you just love the characters! And if you don't like them, in most games you can select from a variety of companions, so you can chose the ones you like. Of course with this IWD mod (or games like Blackguards) you indeed might have this problem.

If you personally can't stand the key characters your going to be travelling with it can put a huge downer on every other aspect of the game, even if the game is, otherwise, gorgeous.
Yeah, but I think that's quite the same with every other feature of the game. If you don't like the combat/crafting/music/visuals/etc. it can put a huge downer on every other aspect of the game, even if the game is, otherwise, gorgeous.

My current personal favorite approach would indeed be a sophisticated version of D:OS's AI personalities. Imagine if you could create some companions on your own (race, gender, class etc.) and then could add some backgrounds (e.g. like for the main character in DA:O), personalities, traits, quircks etc. and the game generates an actually consistent character from it, where dialogs/banter and general behaviour are derived from the given presets.
Of course this is quite hard to implement properly, but I think it would be a lot of fun.
Last edited by Morrandir; July 24th, 2014 at 14:44.
Morrandir is offline

Morrandir

Morrandir's Avatar
Keeper of the Watch
RPGWatch Donor

#804

Join Date: May 2013
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,159

Default 

July 27th, 2014, 10:19
My top 10 rpgs

1) Baldurs Gate 2 not including throne of bhaal
2) Betrayal at Krondor
3) Fallout 2
4) Starcon 2
5) Divinity Original Sin
6) The Elder Scrolls III Morrowind
7) Ultima 7 first part
8) Quest for Glory series excluding 3 and 5
9) Fallout New Vegas
10) Baldurs Gate + expansion

Notable up and comers to challenge this:
Wasteland 2, Pillars of Eternity, Shadowrun Returns Dragonfall HD, Torment: Tides of Numenera, Legend of Grimrock 2
Silver is offline

Silver

Watcher

#805

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 40

Default 

September 1st, 2014, 09:02
You can rank games in many ways:

1) overall rank (very subjective -> maybe a mix from points 2) to 5))
2) rank in their own era (more objective and fair) -> top 5 games every 5 years: 1976-1980; 1981-1985; 1986-1990;…
3) playability today (can it be run/emulated on modern computers?; is gameplay still fun?)
4a) historical value gameplay (invented/implemented new gameplay elements)
4b) historical value technology (invented/implemented new technologies)
5) influence to the genre (has this game many (game)-followers? Has it become a blueprint?)

For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong. - HL Mencken
Last edited by HiddenX; September 1st, 2014 at 09:29.
HiddenX is offline

HiddenX

HiddenX's Avatar
The Elder Spy
RPGWatch Donor

#806

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: NRW/Germany
Posts: 4,538

Default My top 10

September 11th, 2014, 00:14
1. Wasteland
2. Ultima 4
3. Pool of Radiance
4. Baldur's Gate
5. Fallout 2
6. Fallout
7. Ultima 7
8. Ultima 5
9. Legacy of the Ancients
10. Legend of Blacksilver
xanthrum is offline

xanthrum

Traveler

#807

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1

Default 

September 12th, 2014, 09:41
1. Gothic 2
2. Morrowind
3. Baldur's Gate 2 EE
4. System Shock 2
5. Ultima Underworld 2
6. Ultima 7 Part 2
7. Planescape Torment
8. Fallout 2
9. Fallout 3
10. STALKER SoC

Last 3 could be switched out with KOTOR, Witcher 1 and Arcanum maybe, hard to say which i liked best

Edit: also, this and the "top bottom RPG's" should be in the Polls section, no?

SiiiiLENCE the DISCOOOORD…
Last edited by vurt; September 12th, 2014 at 10:57.
vurt is offline

vurt

vurt's Avatar
Serial Modderer

#808

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: The land of rape and honey
Posts: 1,644

Default 

September 17th, 2014, 02:18
My list

1.Mask of Betrayer - fantastic story, for some reason i enjoy it even more than Planescape: Torment. Really love the way they implement the dark side in this game.
2. Planescape: Torment - no need any explaining.
3. Fallout New Vegas - how i hope i can play this as a top-down game…
4. Baldur Gate 2 : very good story, great NPC intereaction + art style.
5. Fallout 2.
6. Vampire: The Masquerade - great atmosphere, very creativity quest + intereaction.
7.Divinity : Original Sin - i like this game more and more each day.
8.KOTOR 2 : the Sith Lord - great story, ton of bug but thank to the wonderful community almost all of them are fixed.
9.Shadowrun return + dragon fall - really like the atmosphere.
10.Arcanum.

Edit : sorry for including New Vegas, though it was about top 10 RPG
VTTRoseRed is offline

VTTRoseRed

Traveler

#809

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1

Default 

September 17th, 2014, 02:41
Hard to say what my top 10 would be.

Ulitma 3 will always be dear to my heart as I got a disk doctor copy of it in grade nine for my C64. No books, a few scribbles on a page of the spells and my and my best friend spend 6 months on the phone figuring it out after school.

I did like Bards tale back in the day and there were a few others back in the day.

Loved both the Witchers and Dragons age.

Then this little gem called D.OS might have took over as my number one.

So many games back in the day and about a 10 year lay off where schooling and work took over.

Anyways sorry no top ten but those are a few games I really loved.

PS there was a game in the late 80's that I have been trying to remember where you lived in tree tops. It was more like a story book, I would l know what it was called.

Edited notes: if anyone remembers disk doctor it was easy to go though the code and find out how to make spells after finding where it was located…..

Second edit: in the late 90's I got into counter strike so bad…though I hated that sort of game I got very good at very very good. Guess that is what happens when you want to crush your friend at something.
Last edited by CelticFrost; September 17th, 2014 at 02:54.
CelticFrost is offline

CelticFrost

Sentinel

#810

Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 452

Default 

September 25th, 2014, 15:37
Originally Posted by VTTRoseRed View Post
My list

1.Mask of Betrayer - fantastic story, for some reason i enjoy it even more than Planescape: Torment. Really love the way they implement the dark side in this game.
2. Planescape: Torment - no need any explaining.
3. Fallout New Vegas - how i hope i can play this as a top-down game…
4. Baldur Gate 2 : very good story, great NPC intereaction + art style.
5. Fallout 2.
6. Vampire: The Masquerade - great atmosphere, very creativity quest + intereaction.
7.Divinity : Original Sin - i like this game more and more each day.
8.KOTOR 2 : the Sith Lord - great story, ton of bug but thank to the wonderful community almost all of them are fixed.
9.Shadowrun return + dragon fall - really like the atmosphere.
10.Arcanum.

Edit : sorry for including New Vegas, though it was about top 10 RPG
You have KOTOR 2 > KOTOR 1? That game crashed hard for me at two different points beyond the 15 hour mark that forced me to restart the entire game. Plus how do you top the first one's epic story? I can't disagree with your Baldur's Gate 2 ranking though - how do you go wrong with Minsc in your party?

LFGdating.com
Currently playing: D3, SC2, and wait for it … Red Alert 3. (And possibly some Goldeneye here or there.) Also a Bioware fanatic.
anakin57 is offline

anakin57

anakin57's Avatar
Watcher

#811

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 27

Default 

September 25th, 2014, 16:29
Originally Posted by anakin57 View Post
You have KOTOR 2 > KOTOR 1? That game crashed hard for me at two different points beyond the 15 hour mark that forced me to restart the entire game. Plus how do you top the first one's epic story? I can't disagree with your Baldur's Gate 2 ranking though - how do you go wrong with Minsc in your party?
I've always been conflicted about KotOR vs KotOR2, and I understand people in both camps.

KotOR was smooth and had a proper Star Wars story. It really felt part of the universe, which very few games and novels do (let's be honest, they're mostly rubbish).

However, KotOR2 has more interesting characters (Kreia being the best example) and quite a few engine upgrades (once fully patched, prior to that it's just buggy). It also makes use of skills to a different degree, which is good fun for people who like tinkering around with non-combat stuff. And you actually get to start out as a Jedi instead of wasting 8 out of 20 levels that could've been Jedi levels. Then again, you have to spend a lot of time digging around for lightsaber parts before actually being able to wield one.

I replay them both annually, usually more than once, but I can never decide which one is my favorite. It keeps changing. Needless to say, I enjoy them both.
Maylander is offline

Maylander

SasqWatch

#812

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bergen
Posts: 5,655
Send a message via MSN to Maylander

Default 

September 30th, 2014, 05:01
Originally Posted by Maylander View Post
I've always been conflicted about KotOR vs KotOR2, and I understand people in both camps.

KotOR was smooth and had a proper Star Wars story. It really felt part of the universe, which very few games and novels do (let's be honest, they're mostly rubbish).

However, KotOR2 has more interesting characters (Kreia being the best example) and quite a few engine upgrades (once fully patched, prior to that it's just buggy). It also makes use of skills to a different degree, which is good fun for people who like tinkering around with non-combat stuff. And you actually get to start out as a Jedi instead of wasting 8 out of 20 levels that could've been Jedi levels. Then again, you have to spend a lot of time digging around for lightsaber parts before actually being able to wield one.

I replay them both annually, usually more than once, but I can never decide which one is my favorite. It keeps changing. Needless to say, I enjoy them both.
now you make me want to apologize to my KOTOR 2 disc and play that again - seriously though, good post. to me for RPGs storyline is just about everything, so that first KOTOR will always rank a little higher than it's sequel; i just felt that the storyline itself in the first was better than some of the actual, more recent movies (I & II at least), which is really saying something. that being said, i agree with you on the starting off as a jedi route in K2 - i just wish it wasn't so crazy buggy.

LFGdating.com
Currently playing: D3, SC2, and wait for it … Red Alert 3. (And possibly some Goldeneye here or there.) Also a Bioware fanatic.
anakin57 is offline

anakin57

anakin57's Avatar
Watcher

#813

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 27

Default 

November 18th, 2014, 00:19
I wish I could have included more of the out-and-out classics, but the following list is more of an emotional thing:

10. Final Fantasy VII
I know the plot is silly and unskippable… I know how easy the game is if you indulge in a few side battles and I know how hard it should be to describe this as a role-playing game in the first place, but just listen to that soundtrack! Also contains about three hundred random encounters all with model and skinning work so bizarre I find them much harder to forget than the dialogue itself.

9. Morrowind
Probably spent a squillion hours playing this game on the strength of its unique and tense setting, so it deserves a space on the list, but nowadays I look at the box and groan. The game world seems to contain everything but fun - the fantastically and eccentrically populated island of Vvardenfell is a joy to explore but a slog to defend. Also I really am not a fan of soaring, traditional fantasy RPG soundtracks so being told how superlative this one is can chafe. =P Way too short a soundtrack for a game with such scope.

8. Angband
Yeah, Angband! I've poured so many hours into being bad at this game that it creeps onto the list by default. Should probably pick something other than hobbit rogue but it feels so correct… a very balanced rogue-like which stays grounded in the Silmarillion and kills you with small gnome people instead of cosmic uberdragons.

7. Hard Nova
Not a game that time's been kind to, but it hits my weak spot - futuristic setting and with a main character who has some bite. Once you get a hang of how the game actually works, though, it's over in hours. The gritty dialogue and lack of cloying moralist characters saves it for me. Someone gave me a bunch of copied disks for Atari ST back in the day, as was common practise, and this was one of the gems among them. Fun minimal chiptune soundtrack, too.

6. Grimrock II
Even if the presentation of this game was of 1989 quality, the puzzles and dungeon layouts would still be incredibly rich. Combat is surprisingly tense without making you feel like an idiot - it's the clever traps that make you feel like an idiot! =P Loving the piercing sound design that never strays into Epic Fantasy Drama, and generally leaves me inspired that an RPG dungeon-crawler almost totally lacking in dialogue can still work as a modern game.

5. Planescape: Torment
Some of the best dialogue ever in a game, far out-weighing the downfall of others like this - the combat. The dark humour doesn't really ever become overbearing or repetitive and the soundtrack is wonderfully dirty. I don't really ever bother to finish this game, just delve in when I feel the need to relive the depravity for a few hours.

4. Arena / Daggerfall
In the minds of its creators, the best roleplaying games of all time! =P Also the music is intimate and moody instead of, well, you know..

3. the idea of Shin Megami Tensei - none of the actual games, just the sheer mad idea that it exists. in three decades of absurd, power-mad RPG ideas, SMT still has the silliest set-up of all

2. Captive
You're a prisoner controlling four droids through a brief-case with which you plot to break yourself out of jail. One
of the strangest Dungeon Master variants, with levels generated procedurally and packed full of some very nasty
hazards. Made practically by just one person! I've enjoyed countless hours failing over and over again in the same scenarios and I hope more people have enjoyed this bizarre game.

1. Ultima Underworld
I remember weekend after weekend of painstaking progress through this game with my family, playing in a very careful style because reloading felt so game-breaking. We had maps and rune combinations and dialogue snippets all written down on a folder full of scraps of paper and they never quite added up to a complete solution of the game. I blame the Cup of Wonder, of course. If you revisit the game now you can barrel through it in a few nights because having played a lot of games makes you very incautious and resistant to traps, but at the time, UU was as scary and as puzzling as hell. The sequel rules too but had lots of annoying compatibility errors and somehow managed to feel much more linear despite the eight worlds gimmick. A simple conceit, a very well-made dungeon, a handful of believable NPCs, the best early 2.5D engine and some very memorable tunes easily conspire to maintain this title as my favourite game, beating out Doom II and lots of other classics.
Zan-zan-zawa-veia is offline

Zan-zan-zawa-veia

Traveler

#814

Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: UK, North of London
Posts: 6

Tags
crpg, top 10
RPGWatch Forums » Games » General RPG » Top 10 CRPGs of all time
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:44.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright by RPGWatch