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Default Let's play LMK … in Wiz8, et al.

January 23rd, 2010, 00:53
Originally Posted by Relayer View Post
When I plow through my backlog,

I say that all the time too….

I think we actually mean "if" we plow through it.
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January 23rd, 2010, 04:55
Haha, right!

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January 23rd, 2010, 18:15
Aaah, after the very challenging Arnika Road things opened up a bit. I could actually move around without having my path blocked by all sorts of pesky monsters. Before entering Arnika I decided to have a look around the premises and suddenly ended up near Trynton. So I thought, what the heck, and went a little further. Some relatively easy fights in the trunk, a new cape for my Ranger (Rangers only, can't identify yet), profit for everyone from the fountain (mage has 100 int now, yay!), my mage got a Detect Secrets book, I found a potion merchant, did some mixing and more identifying (artifacts are at 46 now, could finally identify almost everything I had).

All in all, it's going nicely, and being able to shop and talk and not fight for a change is rather relaxing. I'm selling all the bard-exclusive items, as well as all the gadgeteer stuff. I assume I don't need it?

Also, another question: Is armor all about AC or is there an advantage to medium / heavy armor over light armor? Otherwise I'd rather have my heroes equip the lighter armor so they can carry more stuff. For example, supposed I have light armor with AC 6 and medium armor with AC 6, is there any reason to equip the medium one?

And since my mage can now start training other stats, should I go for speed and/or vitality? I read that vitality points aren't applied retroactively, which is a bit of a pity.

Next I think I'll head back to Arnika before doing anything else in Trynton, I prefer finishing things at one place before going on to another and Arnika was supposed to be first.

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January 23rd, 2010, 18:25
IIRC, the armor class is the only distinction. So if you have a suit of light armor that matches a suit of medium, you won't be missing out by using the lighter stuff. Then again, as I've said it's been a while since I've played Wiz8.

Stats, I'd go for speed. Getting off those first spells early may help things in tough fights.

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January 23rd, 2010, 20:20
The distinction on armor type is which classes can wear it. Everyone can wear light. Most hybrid classes can go medium. Only the tank classes can use heavy. The balance you have to play (particularly with only 3 characters) is AC versus weight. Heavier armor means less weight available for loot before getting encumbered. In general, get the best AC you can, but keep an eye out for weight advantages.

With your crew, I'd put points in speed like azraelck said.

Unless you plan to recruit additional party members, you can safely sell all bard and gadgy items.

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January 23rd, 2010, 21:00
Thanks guys. My fighter will take all the best armor then regardless of weight, ranger will have to stay light even though she could wear medium armor. Regarding additional party members — I was considering to recruit NPCs only temporarily to help them with quests, if there are any of those, otherwise I'll stick to my little dream team.

The Arnika-Trynton road got one hell of a lot tougher overnight, sneaking back to Arnika was a constant adrenaline rush with groups of big bad … I don't remember what they were called, all around. Guess my party's average level increased from 8 to 9 when the second member reached 9 in the trunk, either that or the road is generally more difficult during the night.

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
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January 24th, 2010, 02:50
A trick in Wiz 8 is to not actually level your characters as soon as they're able; instead let them remain at the current level. It'll keep the monsters spawned from moving into tougher types for a bit. Plus, leveling 3-4 times at once is cool.

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January 24th, 2010, 04:00
Noooo, I couldn't do that. I always level up immediately, it's in my bones. Can't change it.

And oh, oh! I found a sword called Bloodlust, which looked so good … but seems to be cursed. I can't Remove Curse yet. Should I reload or deal with the consequences?

edit: Mm, before I got the new sword my fighter had 2 attacks (Don't know since when or why, I never raised speed … only melee, sword and shield. Does the level have anything to do with it?) With Bloodlust he's got 3! And does a whole lot of damage! I think I'll keep it for now and let my mage learn Remove Curse at the next opportunity. It's only fair, seeing how so far my party was vastly outnumbered most of the time. And besides, my fighter is all about swords fighting and melee, so this seems like a natural fit. … *pondering*

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
Last edited by Arhu; January 24th, 2010 at 04:18.
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January 24th, 2010, 04:24
Originally Posted by Arhu View Post
Thanks guys. My fighter will take all the best armor then regardless of weight, ranger will have to stay light even though she could wear medium armor. Regarding additional party members — I was considering to recruit NPCs only temporarily to help them with quests, if there are any of those, otherwise I'll stick to my little dream team.

The Arnika-Trynton road got one hell of a lot tougher overnight, sneaking back to Arnika was a constant adrenaline rush with groups of big bad … I don't remember what they were called, all around. Guess my party's average level increased from 8 to 9 when the second member reached 9 in the trunk, either that or the road is generally more difficult during the night.
You'll meet a guy at the entrance of Arnika that will join the party. You can actually do his quests without hiring him, but he'll act all sorts of pissed if you do. You'll pretty much have to recruit another RPC for a short time. You'll have an option around the 3/4 point to recruit 2 others for a bit to complete a quest or two. There are a few other RPCs running around, but they don't really offer anything.

Other than when it's required for quests, I don't pick up RPCs. They "steal" a share of the XP, and they don't fill out the party's skill set unless you've done a poor job building it.

Most likely, you were getting juggernauts. Tough bastards. Gotta use funnels with those guys, even with a strong party.

The best medium armor (non-magical, that is) can be found/purchased in Mt. Gigas. It's got good AC at half the weight.

As long as you don't mind that your fighter can't swap to a ranged weapon anymore, Bloodlust is a kickass weapon. That's where the extra attack is coming from, too.

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January 24th, 2010, 04:32
Most of the best weapons in the game are cursed, so always save before eqipping, just in case.

If God said it, then that settles it!!

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January 24th, 2010, 05:50
Worst thing about juggernauts is how little experience killing them provides, considering how tough they are. There´s one more similarily unbalanced type of monster IIRC - depth dwellers and such. Probably an oversight.

In regards to fighter´s number of attacks - since you got Bloodlust (automatic berserking) it probably doesn´t matter much right now, but you should always have berserking on with your fighter. The hit rate loss is rather negligible.
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January 25th, 2010, 23:05
Status update.

Arnika finished for now, got the goodies from the Monastery, went to the Umpani Base Camp, now on my way to Trynton. At the base camp I did the training course and when I saw the training dummies I couldn't help it. I let the Knight train shielding for an hour or so while I was cleaning up my room. Quality sparring partners. They did next to no damage and had 2-3 attacks each round.

Apart from that I don't really see a need for lots of training, even with my small party. I guess it's because fights take longer than with a full party, so they get more time to work on their skills during actual combat. The first time in Arnika Road with level 6 or 7 was really the hardest challenge so far. Might have been my inexperience, who knows. Now that my characters are a little more fleshed out in their role and relatively well equipped, difficulty is just right.

As I had planned, the mage learned Remove Curse, which is good because now the Knight can switch weapons at will. I'm using Demonsbane as my main sword now for balanced fights and switch to Bloodlust for harder enemies. Problem with this sword is that fights are over too soon, meaning the only skill that goes up is sword fighting and the other two characters don't learn a thing. It's too powerful for its own good.

The lady focuses a lot on Alchemy spells at the moment, which leaves little time for archery. Alchemy is over 50 now, so I immediately started making renewal potions in the Base Camp. Trouble is that I can't identify them. Identify scrolls are too weak and so is my mage's Artifacts skill. Working hard on increasing that now. It seems stuck at 60. Until that solves itself somehow I'm sitting on 20 renewal potions.

Attached screenshots of the Lady, the Mage and the Knight. They really feel cool now, the mage even got himself a wizard hat a couple of minutes ago! The lady is only wearing very light "light armor", i.e. not the one with the most AC, lest she be encumbered.


Question: Since I'm staring to get more random stuff now that I can neither immediately use nor sell — is there a way to store stuff somewhere? Can I put something on the ground or does it vanish eventually?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Wiz800008.jpg (166.4 KB, 63 views)
File Type: jpg Wiz800009.jpg (166.4 KB, 63 views)
File Type: jpg Wiz800010.jpg (167.8 KB, 65 views)

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
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January 26th, 2010, 00:59
Did you get your room in Arnika from Heli? That chest doesn't lose its inventory, so you can store stuff in there. Put the item on your hand and then click on the chest. It will go in and there will be much rejoicing.

Arnika Road has the hardest balance between party power and critter power in the entire game. Other areas will be tough, but nothing as bad as that @%^%@^ road.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
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January 26th, 2010, 03:25
I used to store stuff in the chest in the small room off the Rapax smith's shop. Good place to rest too.

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January 26th, 2010, 22:35
Well, you went and did it.

Fired up a run. Decided to run a short party with some classes I don't usually play. So….

Faerie ninja
Human rogue
Mook ranger
Elf bishop

We just moved to the upper monestary.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
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January 26th, 2010, 23:48
Haha, seriously? Crazy. When I read your first line I thought you meant Armored Princess … No LMK though? You could have tried your modified version of human bard, faerie bishop and lord. But I can see the appeal of trying out unfamiliar classes, when I had the rogue and Valkyrie with me in Arnika temporarily, they brought interesting things to the table. Hm, how about removing the ranger? From what you told me you always had one with you.

So you'd get ninja = L, bishop = M, rogue = K (sort of).

Storage in the room in Arnika sounds good, thanks!

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
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January 27th, 2010, 00:07
I would love to do a replay myself, but that's where the length of the game goes against it. Wiz 8 is a huge timesink, albeit a great one.

Don't know if I'd ever go with less than 4 party members though, and I prefer all 6. I just like the variety.


@dteowner - You *really* need to play KB:AP.
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January 27th, 2010, 00:52
Since this is the first time for me to do anything like it, i.e. playing a 6-member-party game with only 3 characters, and given that it's also my first time playing Wiz8 I have to say that I do like it this way. While I agree that variety is good and fun, what I love about my party is the reduced micromanagement involved. It's not too little and not too much. The fighter is on auto-attack, the mage I micromanage, the ranger is a mix of both depending on whether I need her to cast spells or not. There's almost no overlap. Fighter in front, mage in the center (staff has extended range, pity the good staves seem to be exclusive for priests/bishops), ranger behind.

But it's also true that I'm missing out on a variety of things. Divine and Psionic spellbooks, pickpocketing, mind reading, instruments, gadgets, thrown weapons, trap disarming (knock knock doesn't care about traps), different weapon types. Well, there's always a next time, although as you said, Wiz8 is a huge timesink … and I think I'd rather try out the LMK approach on different games, or even play new games every once in a while.

But for now, it's great fun. I always have to think of Ambermoon when I'm playing. Gameplay was kinda similar, there were also four magic schools (healing, alchemy, mystics, destruction). Dialogues were done in exactly the same fashion. If you've never played the game, don't mind some retro graphics/music and don't shy away from an Amiga emulator, I can still recommend it. Here's a gameplay video:

Ambermoon Gameplay.

Game is available in English too. Sadly you don't create your own party but recruit members along the way, otherwise this would have been my next LMK game.

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
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January 28th, 2010, 18:42
I've said many times that the true beauty of Wiz8 is that any party you can create can be played. Some will be easier than others, but everything is possible. Depending on how you build the party, dynamics can change and characters can develop very differently. That's part of the reason why I have so many games played thru Arnika. You can get a pretty good experience with various party builds running them thru Arnika or maybe Trynton. They get enough levels to get a feel for what they can do, and you can gage how all the various character skills mesh and interact. My Rift games were interesting parties that I just didn't enjoy enough to invest the time to finish, like the solo faerie ninja.

Sorry. No pearls of wisdom in this oyster.
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January 29th, 2010, 03:34
Hear, hear. That's why I love playing my little LMK party in it so much. It's not only the fact that they manage, it's also that they are almost exactly like I imagined them to be. Wiz8 really nailed the class archetypes and their abilities.

That said there are times when I have to reload often, like when I'm surrounded by vampire bats with two undead casters in the back … don't remember what they were called, but they chain cast fireballs on my group and insanity and whatnot.

Which brings me to an awesome encounter I had in Mt. Gigas. I turned around a corner and was suddenly facing 5 or 6 groups of spiders, rats and bat vampires. Luckily they were far away and blocking each other's paths so my two casters had time to summon elementals. My knight took care of every single critter that tried to break through and got behind the others, after that the elementals rushed forward, paving the way for the mage and ranger who would rain death and destruction on their foes. 170k worth of experience for each character.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Wiz8-gigas1.jpg (155.1 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg Wiz8-gigas2.jpg (155.3 KB, 45 views)
File Type: jpg Wiz8-gigas3.jpg (136.7 KB, 23 views)
File Type: jpg Wiz8-gigas4.jpg (119.8 KB, 24 views)

"Mystery is important. To know everything, to know the whole truth, is dull. There is no magic in that. Magic is not knowing, magic is wondering about what and how and where." ~ Cortez, from The Longest Journey
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